A draw might have been better than a win

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Re: A draw might have been better than a win

Postby bluebird66 » Wed Sep 06, 2017 7:19 am

I could be wrong but I've worked it out as follows..

If Bosnia fail to win both of their final games , one of which is against Belgium and we win both our games then we qualify for play offs.

I know Greece are still in the picture but they can only achieve a maximum of 13 points when taking into account results against bottom placed team.

In my opinion the Bosnia v Belgium game is key for us in terms of knowing exactly what is needed.

Easier said than done I know , but if we win our last 2 games it should be enough.
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Re: A draw might have been better than a win

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Re: A draw might have been better than a win

Postby dogfound » Wed Sep 06, 2017 8:19 am

maccydee wrote:
dogfound wrote:
maccydee wrote:
Leon1927 wrote:We have to win both games. A draw against Ireland won't be enough so I don't understand your logic?


Had we drawn tonight we would be a point behind Ireland. Providing we both win our next game we would still be a point behind Ireland going into our last game. This would mean we would set up needing to win Ireland would need a draw to secure 2nd place. I think that would be our best chance of getting a win. Now we are ahead of Ireland we will go into the last game (providing we both win our next fixtures) only needing a draw to secure 2nd place. That can be a hard spot to be in. Of course it could work for us in that Ireland would need to attack and might leave space.



no..we wont need a draw we need a win to not finish bottom of the runners up table


The result against Moldova had no factor on the play off table.



obviously .......regarding points...because they are the bottom team.
but without those points we wouldnt be in the runners up spot to start with.
but that was not your point...
your point was that if we had drawn and remained behind the ROI it would ensure we try to win the final game.
we need to win it anyway..
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Re: A draw might have been better than a win

Postby dogfound » Wed Sep 06, 2017 8:29 am

bluebird66 wrote:I could be wrong but I've worked it out as follows..

If Bosnia fail to win both of their final games , one of which is against Belgium and we win both our games then we qualify for play offs.

I know Greece are still in the picture but they can only achieve a maximum of 13 points when taking into account results against bottom placed team.

In my opinion the Bosnia v Belgium game is key for us in terms of knowing exactly what is needed.

Easier said than done I know , but if we win our last 2 games it should be enough.



you are spot on...going to be interesting to see how strong a team Belgium put out as they have already qualified as group winners..
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Re: A draw might have been better than a win

Postby ealing_ayatollah » Wed Sep 06, 2017 8:41 am

Given UEFA is arguably the most competetive federation couldnt they have allocated an extra space for a european team and let the runner up with the highest points tally qualify automatically and the other 8 go into play-offs rather than this ridiculous nonsense?
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Re: A draw might have been better than a win

Postby paulh_85 » Wed Sep 06, 2017 8:48 am

ealing_ayatollah wrote:Given UEFA is arguably the most competetive federation couldnt they have allocated an extra space for a european team and let the runner up with the highest points tally qualify automatically and the other 8 go into play-offs rather than this ridiculous nonsense?



why should they ?


perhaps instead UEFA should ensure theres only 8 groups by making the minnows like kosovo, gibraltar malta and andorra pre qualify
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Re: A draw might have been better than a win

Postby dogfound » Wed Sep 06, 2017 9:04 am

paulh_85 wrote:
ealing_ayatollah wrote:Given UEFA is arguably the most competetive federation couldnt they have allocated an extra space for a european team and let the runner up with the highest points tally qualify automatically and the other 8 go into play-offs rather than this ridiculous nonsense?



why should they ?


perhaps instead UEFA should ensure theres only 8 groups by making the minnows like kosovo, gibraltar malta and andorra pre qualify



9 winners plus the 4 winners of play off games = 13
8 group winners plus 4 winners of play offs = 12...where would the 13th team come from?
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Re: A draw might have been better than a win

Postby paulh_85 » Wed Sep 06, 2017 9:10 am

dogfound wrote:
paulh_85 wrote:
ealing_ayatollah wrote:Given UEFA is arguably the most competetive federation couldnt they have allocated an extra space for a european team and let the runner up with the highest points tally qualify automatically and the other 8 go into play-offs rather than this ridiculous nonsense?



why should they ?


perhaps instead UEFA should ensure theres only 8 groups by making the minnows like kosovo, gibraltar malta and andorra pre qualify



9 winners plus the 4 winners of play off games = 13
8 group winners plus 4 winners of play offs = 12...where would the 13th team come from?




give it to the best set of fans :D
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Re: A draw might have been better than a win

Postby paulh_85 » Wed Sep 06, 2017 9:11 am

ok but seriously if they went the 8 groups way the could still have the second place table they do now but reward the two best teams with auto places while the other 6 playoff. at least that way no one finishs second and misses out.
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Re: A draw might have been better than a win

Postby maccydee » Wed Sep 06, 2017 11:39 am

So it is widely acknowledged we need to win all our remaining games to finish 2nd.

Therefore my point is right. A draw last night wouldn't have mattered one iota.
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Re: A draw might have been better than a win

Postby paulh_85 » Wed Sep 06, 2017 11:45 am

maccydee wrote:So it is widely acknowledged we need to win all our remaining games to finish 2nd.

Therefore my point is right. A draw last night wouldn't have mattered one iota.



so your point is incorrect then isnt it?


because if it doesnt matter then its also not "better"
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Re: A draw might have been better than a win

Postby maccydee » Wed Sep 06, 2017 11:51 am

paulh_85 wrote:
maccydee wrote:So it is widely acknowledged we need to win all our remaining games to finish 2nd.

Therefore my point is right. A draw last night wouldn't have mattered one iota.



so your point is incorrect then isnt it?


because if it doesnt matter then its also not "better"


Touché.

Although I did write might.
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Re: A draw might have been better than a win

Postby ealing_ayatollah » Wed Sep 06, 2017 1:20 pm

paulh_85 wrote:
ealing_ayatollah wrote:Given UEFA is arguably the most competetive federation couldnt they have allocated an extra space for a european team and let the runner up with the highest points tally qualify automatically and the other 8 go into play-offs rather than this ridiculous nonsense?



why should they ?


perhaps instead UEFA should ensure theres only 8 groups by making the minnows like kosovo, gibraltar malta and andorra pre qualify

White privelage ;-)

no seriously (and i was taking the piss before anyone gets all libtard on me) you make a perfectly valid point.

Its just a completely crap system when a side finishes second in the group and still fails to make a playoff.
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Re: A draw might have been better than a win

Postby pembroke allan » Wed Sep 06, 2017 2:38 pm

ealing_ayatollah wrote:
paulh_85 wrote:
ealing_ayatollah wrote:Given UEFA is arguably the most competetive federation couldnt they have allocated an extra space for a european team and let the runner up with the highest points tally qualify automatically and the other 8 go into play-offs rather than this ridiculous nonsense?



why should they ?


perhaps instead UEFA should ensure theres only 8 groups by making the minnows like kosovo, gibraltar malta and andorra pre qualify

White privelage ;-)

no seriously (and i was taking the piss before anyone gets all libtard on me) you make a perfectly valid point.

Its just a completely crap system when a side finishes second in the group and still fails to make a playoff.



Sure Qualification was altered to allow extra teams from Africa and other continents to qualify at expense of Europe! Think that's reasoning behind expanding world cup in the future
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Re: A draw might have been better than a win

Postby dogfound » Wed Sep 06, 2017 3:27 pm

ealing_ayatollah wrote:
paulh_85 wrote:
ealing_ayatollah wrote:Given UEFA is arguably the most competetive federation couldnt they have allocated an extra space for a european team and let the runner up with the highest points tally qualify automatically and the other 8 go into play-offs rather than this ridiculous nonsense?



why should they ?


perhaps instead UEFA should ensure theres only 8 groups by making the minnows like kosovo, gibraltar malta and andorra pre qualify

White privelage ;-)

no seriously (and i was taking the piss before anyone gets all libtard on me) you make a perfectly valid point.

Its just a completely crap system when a side finishes second in the group and still fails to make a playoff.



very very harsh on the team that finishes bottom..but 8 groups and 8 play off games would result in 12 not 13 teams qualifying
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Re: A draw might have been better than a win

Postby maccydee » Thu Oct 12, 2017 12:50 pm

Warnock alluded to this today in his press conference.

Who knows how Ireland would have played had they not needed the three points?
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