Debunking the 4000 fans lost due to rebrand theory (updated)

A forum for all things Cardiff City

Re: Debunking the 4000 fans lost due to rebrand theory (upda

Postby maccydee » Sat Feb 24, 2018 7:20 pm

Steve Zodiak wrote:I was one of six regulars who from my local pub. None of us went while we were in red, and none of us have seen City in the top flight. Two of us have returned since the club went back to blue, but the rest have found other ways to spend their weekends. I suppose if we get to the PL, they may come back. The change to red certainly cost the club support, but I think there are probably other reasons as well. I am surprised that we are not getting 20k plus on a regular basis given our league position, but perhaps tomorrow will see the fans start to return.


I don’t dispute that we lost ‘hardcore’ fans due to the rebrand. TLG was one who never came back. There are some who won’t ever despite being back in blue.

However Mogs said he stopped doing due to the rebrand yet went the whole season in the championship in red. He didn’t leave because of the rebrand he left for other reasons.

What I definitely dispute is that it is anywhere near 4000. True crowds are 3200 less this year than our final season in blue (in a similar position to now) but they are also 3300 less than our first season in red (in a similar position to now).

I have no doubt many of those fans used the rebrand as their excuse but they were lying. No ifs no buts.

The only fans who truly left cos of the rebrand were the 50 who asked for their season ticket money back after the rebrand was announced and the others who left who didn’t have season tickets but there is no way to know how many of them there are.

Anybody who says that stats show that 4000 ‘hardcore’ fans left due to the rebrand (cough, cough Ian) are lying or delusional or a mixture of both or I suspect deliberately on a wind up as no one can be that stupid and I know that Ian is not a stupid man.
maccydee
 
Posts: 6022
Joined: Sat Dec 05, 2009 9:33 pm
Location: Cottesmore

Re: Debunking the 4000 fans lost due to rebrand theory (upda

Advertisement

Advertisement
Login or Register to remove this ad.

Re: Debunking the 4000 fans lost due to rebrand theory (upda

Postby maccydee » Sat Feb 24, 2018 7:23 pm

Steve Zodiak wrote:I was one of six regulars who from my local pub. None of us went while we were in red, and none of us have seen City in the top flight. Two of us have returned since the club went back to blue, but the rest have found other ways to spend their weekends. I suppose if we get to the PL, they may come back. The change to red certainly cost the club support, but I think there are probably other reasons as well. I am surprised that we are not getting 20k plus on a regular basis given our league position, but perhaps tomorrow will see the fans start to return.


You are someone who left because of the rebrand and I respect that totally.

I respect even more that you have come back due to the reversal of the rebrand.
maccydee
 
Posts: 6022
Joined: Sat Dec 05, 2009 9:33 pm
Location: Cottesmore

Re: Debunking the 4000 fans lost due to rebrand theory (upda

Postby Bakedalasker » Sat Feb 24, 2018 7:37 pm

maccydee wrote:
Steve Zodiak wrote:I was one of six regulars who from my local pub. None of us went while we were in red, and none of us have seen City in the top flight. Two of us have returned since the club went back to blue, but the rest have found other ways to spend their weekends. I suppose if we get to the PL, they may come back. The change to red certainly cost the club support, but I think there are probably other reasons as well. I am surprised that we are not getting 20k plus on a regular basis given our league position, but perhaps tomorrow will see the fans start to return.


I don’t dispute that we lost ‘hardcore’ fans due to the rebrand. TLG was one who never came back. There are some who won’t ever despite being back in blue.

However Mogs said he stopped doing due to the rebrand yet went the whole season in the championship in red. He didn’t leave because of the rebrand he left for other reasons.

What I definitely dispute is that it is anywhere near 4000. True crowds are 3200 less this year than our final season in blue (in a similar position to now) but they are also 3300 less than our first season in red (in a similar position to now).

I have no doubt many of those fans used the rebrand as their excuse but they were lying. No ifs no buts.

The only fans who truly left cos of the rebrand were the 50 who asked for their season ticket money back after the rebrand was announced and the others who left who didn’t have season tickets but there is no way to know how many of them there are.

Anybody who says that stats show that 4000 ‘hardcore’ fans left due to the rebrand (cough, cough Ian) are lying or delusional or a mixture of both or I suspect deliberately on a wind up as no one can be that stupid and I know that Ian is not a stupid man.


The only reason there was not an avalanche of fans walking away was because we were primed to go up. I knew from those early days as soon as things started going wrong fans would leave and we would drop below the baseline we had built up over the last 10 years. I always wonder if we were mid-table and Tan tried the rebrand if we would have had the avalanche then.

I believe if we never had the rebrand we would now be hitting over the 20K mark.
User avatar
Bakedalasker
 
Posts: 15632
Joined: Wed Nov 25, 2009 9:46 am
Location: Derby

Re: Debunking the 4000 fans lost due to rebrand theory (upda

Postby maccydee » Sat Feb 24, 2018 7:43 pm

Bakedalasker wrote:
maccydee wrote:
Steve Zodiak wrote:I was one of six regulars who from my local pub. None of us went while we were in red, and none of us have seen City in the top flight. Two of us have returned since the club went back to blue, but the rest have found other ways to spend their weekends. I suppose if we get to the PL, they may come back. The change to red certainly cost the club support, but I think there are probably other reasons as well. I am surprised that we are not getting 20k plus on a regular basis given our league position, but perhaps tomorrow will see the fans start to return.


I don’t dispute that we lost ‘hardcore’ fans due to the rebrand. TLG was one who never came back. There are some who won’t ever despite being back in blue.

However Mogs said he stopped doing due to the rebrand yet went the whole season in the championship in red. He didn’t leave because of the rebrand he left for other reasons.

What I definitely dispute is that it is anywhere near 4000. True crowds are 3200 less this year than our final season in blue (in a similar position to now) but they are also 3300 less than our first season in red (in a similar position to now).

I have no doubt many of those fans used the rebrand as their excuse but they were lying. No ifs no buts.

The only fans who truly left cos of the rebrand were the 50 who asked for their season ticket money back after the rebrand was announced and the others who left who didn’t have season tickets but there is no way to know how many of them there are.

Anybody who says that stats show that 4000 ‘hardcore’ fans left due to the rebrand (cough, cough Ian) are lying or delusional or a mixture of both or I suspect deliberately on a wind up as no one can be that stupid and I know that Ian is not a stupid man.


The only reason there was not an avalanche of fans walking away was because we were primed to go up. I knew from those early days as soon as things started going wrong fans would leave and we would drop below the baseline we had built up over the last 10 years. I always wonder if we were mid-table and Tan tried the rebrand if we would have had the avalanche then.

I believe if we never had the rebrand we would now be hitting over the 20K mark.


I’ll take that Ian. Believe rather than stats back it up. If they left later though it was because of lack of success rather than the rebrand.

Agree to disagree.
maccydee
 
Posts: 6022
Joined: Sat Dec 05, 2009 9:33 pm
Location: Cottesmore

Re: Debunking the 4000 fans lost due to rebrand theory (upda

Postby Steve Zodiak » Sat Feb 24, 2018 7:47 pm

maccydee wrote:
Bakedalasker wrote:
maccydee wrote:
Steve Zodiak wrote:I was one of six regulars who from my local pub. None of us went while we were in red, and none of us have seen City in the top flight. Two of us have returned since the club went back to blue, but the rest have found other ways to spend their weekends. I suppose if we get to the PL, they may come back. The change to red certainly cost the club support, but I think there are probably other reasons as well. I am surprised that we are not getting 20k plus on a regular basis given our league position, but perhaps tomorrow will see the fans start to return.


I don’t dispute that we lost ‘hardcore’ fans due to the rebrand. TLG was one who never came back. There are some who won’t ever despite being back in blue.

However Mogs said he stopped doing due to the rebrand yet went the whole season in the championship in red. He didn’t leave because of the rebrand he left for other reasons.

What I definitely dispute is that it is anywhere near 4000. True crowds are 3200 less this year than our final season in blue (in a similar position to now) but they are also 3300 less than our first season in red (in a similar position to now).

I have no doubt many of those fans used the rebrand as their excuse but they were lying. No ifs no buts.

The only fans who truly left cos of the rebrand were the 50 who asked for their season ticket money back after the rebrand was announced and the others who left who didn’t have season tickets but there is no way to know how many of them there are.

Anybody who says that stats show that 4000 ‘hardcore’ fans left due to the rebrand (cough, cough Ian) are lying or delusional or a mixture of both or I suspect deliberately on a wind up as no one can be that stupid and I know that Ian is not a stupid man.


The only reason there was not an avalanche of fans walking away was because we were primed to go up. I knew from those early days as soon as things started going wrong fans would leave and we would drop below the baseline we had built up over the last 10 years. I always wonder if we were mid-table and Tan tried the rebrand if we would have had the avalanche then.

I believe if we never had the rebrand we would now be hitting over the 20K mark.


I’ll take that Ian. Believe rather than stats back it up. If they left later though it was because of lack of success rather than the rebrand.

Agree to disagree.


We should get a good crowd tomorrow, hopefully well over 20k. A good performance and 3 points may help keep those who have not been so regularly this season. Tomorrow could kick start our attendances into something better than we have seen so far this season. I have a feeling this game will give us the opportunity for better attendances for all our remaining home games. Just need a good performance to convince everyone that we could really be heading back to the top table.
Steve Zodiak
 
Posts: 4203
Joined: Thu Oct 16, 2014 7:42 pm

Re: Debunking the 4000 fans lost due to rebrand theory (upda

Postby Sven » Sat Feb 24, 2018 7:49 pm

maccydee wrote:
goats wrote:
maccydee wrote:
goats wrote:
maccydee wrote:These are our average attendances and league positions over the last 20 odd years now updated. It is based on current names so dungeon is called league 2. I have put a possible mitigating factor for large (or low) attendance in last column.

I hope this shows that Cardiff have had crowds up during success and down when not so successful for years so this season's low crowds are to be expected and nothing to do with the rebrand, Tan being owner or Dai Hunt.

To make it really easy for Bakedalaskar I have even done the text in the colour kit we were playing in. This makes it incredibly easy for him to see exactly what colour we were wearing and proves in no uncertain terms that colour of kit has no impact on crowds and if anything it shows that when wearing red we gained fans not lost them.

Year- Level & Position- Average Attendance- Historical significance
2017/18 Championship (currently 2nd) 18,922
2016/17 Championship (12th) 16,564 no historical significance
2015/16 Championship (8th) 16,463 first year fully back in blue

2014/15 Championship (11th) 21,124 Season tickets sold from previous year plus lots of money spent on player under OGS. Changed to blue January 2015.
2013/14 Premiership (20th) 27,430 First year in top tier in ages
2012/13 Championship (1st) 22,299 Season tickets sold from League cup final + success and money spent on players but playing in red and 199 higher than year before

2011/12 Championship (6th) 22,100 Large number of 'Golden' season tickets sold year before
2010/11 Championship (4th) 23.194 Bellamy + top of table most of year + play off final year before
2009/10 Championship (4th) 20,717 First season new stadium
2008/09 Championship (7th) 18,000 Last season Ninian, FA Cup Final so season ticket sales high
2007/08 Championship (12th) 13,939 Nothing season low crowds
2006/07 Championship (13th) 15,223 Top of table after 12 games so 20k crowds dropping to 12k
2005/06 Championship (11th) 11,720 Mid table nothing happening crowds sub 10k regularly
2004/05 Championship (16th) 12,976 Sam's dream started to implode. Black Friday etc.
2003/04 Championship (13th) 15,569 First year in Championship
2002/03 League 1 (6th) 13,050 Promoted via playoffs. Money spent on players + Success
2001/02 League 1 (4th) 12,253 Back in League 1 + success
2000/01 League 2 (2nd) 7,962 First year of Sam. Money spent on players + success
1999/00 League 1 (21st) 6,895 Back in League 1 but relegated. Crowds started 10k +
1998/99 League 2 (3rd) 7,131 Frank Burrows takes us up. Success.
1997/98 League 2 (21st) 3,610 Dungeon performing badly. 20k say they went actually 3k
1996/97 League 2 (7th) 3,594 Relative success but still crowds low.
1995/96 League 2 (22nd) 3,420 Hangover from relegation year before.
1994/95 League 1 (22nd) 4,543 Sat lower league most of year, inevitable relegation.
1993/94 League 1 (19th) 6,072 Spike in crowds from promotion plus Cup Run boosted league crowds.
1992/93 League 2 (1st) 8,560 Eddie May's barmy army. Money spent + success under RW.
1991/92 League 2 (9th) 6,191 First bit of relative success in ages boosted crowds. Lots of children got into the City (including me). Large crowds back end of season.


Any question, comments or concerns please feel free to add.



You put that very clearly, so well you can clearly see we have lost about 4000 fans :thumbup:


But not because of the rebrand.


Just enticements like fa cup final giving us false highs you think?


Ridsdale (for all his considerable faults) was a master at publicity and using stuff like that to our advantage.

How many season tickets did he sell from the golden ticket scam?

We could do with him now.


Neil, there was no 'Golden Ticket' scam! It was a simple case of pay up what you have or fold! ;)

Apart form that, you omit to mention the 'Ambassador Scheme under Sam, which I know had a large effect on season ticket sales for a couple of seasons at least and rendered 'some' reward for its initial members but those flew out the window when it was opened up to those who jumped on board following the initial successful period :thumbright:
"If only closed minds came with closed mouths!"
User avatar
Sven
Moderator
 
Posts: 14211
Joined: Sat Aug 21, 2010 6:14 pm

Re: Debunking the 4000 fans lost due to rebrand theory (upda

Postby maccydee » Sat Feb 24, 2018 7:56 pm

Golden ticket scam was pay up to give us money to spend on players. At the time anyway. Hence why a scam.
maccydee
 
Posts: 6022
Joined: Sat Dec 05, 2009 9:33 pm
Location: Cottesmore

Re: Debunking the 4000 fans lost due to rebrand theory (upda

Postby seanmogs » Sat Feb 24, 2018 8:17 pm

I didn’t ask for my money back because I had been a season ticket holder since the Ninian Park days and I gave the club a chance. It it became more and more of a circus, it just got worse. So I fell out of love with the club and I’ve never felt the same since. Many others have felt the same. You’re stupid to think otherwise. Genuinely.

The club have lost a couple of thousand due to the rebrand whether you like it or not.
seanmogs
 
Posts: 576
Joined: Sat Feb 06, 2010 4:09 pm

Re: Debunking the 4000 fans lost due to rebrand theory (upda

Postby maccydee » Sat Feb 24, 2018 8:24 pm

seanmogs wrote:I didn’t ask for my money back because I had been a season ticket holder since the Ninian Park days and I gave the club a chance. It it became more and more of a circus, it just got worse. So I fell out of love with the club and I’ve never felt the same since. Many others have felt the same. You’re stupid to think otherwise. Genuinely.

The club have lost a couple of thousand due to the rebrand whether you like it or not.


The fans made it the circus. The actual rebrand was done in good faith by Tan and he offered us the chance to reverse it. We wanted the 100 million investment.

Like with Ian we are going to have to agree to disagree but there is nothing that backs up your stats that the rebrand cost us thousands of fans. It didn’t cost us you as you went after the rebrand. You either were against it and got a refund or didn’t go again or you weren’t that bothered and went the following year.

If you went the following year and watched us in red and then walked away the following year it was not due to the rebrand.
maccydee
 
Posts: 6022
Joined: Sat Dec 05, 2009 9:33 pm
Location: Cottesmore

Re: Debunking the 4000 fans lost due to rebrand theory (upda

Postby Bluebina » Sat Feb 24, 2018 8:30 pm

maccydee wrote:These are our average attendances and league positions over the last 20 odd years now updated. It is based on current names so dungeon is called league 2. I have put a possible mitigating factor for large (or low) attendance in last column.

I hope this shows that Cardiff have had crowds up during success and down when not so successful for years so this season's low crowds are to be expected and nothing to do with the rebrand, Tan being owner or Dai Hunt.

To make it really easy for Bakedalaskar I have even done the text in the colour kit we were playing in. This makes it incredibly easy for him to see exactly what colour we were wearing and proves in no uncertain terms that colour of kit has no impact on crowds and if anything it shows that when wearing red we gained fans not lost them.

Year- Level & Position- Average Attendance- Historical significance
2017/18 Championship (currently 2nd) 18,922
2016/17 Championship (12th) 16,564 no historical significance
2015/16 Championship (8th) 16,463 first year fully back in blue

2014/15 Championship (11th) 21,124 Season tickets sold from previous year plus lots of money spent on player under OGS. Changed to blue January 2015.
2013/14 Premiership (20th) 27,430 First year in top tier in ages
2012/13 Championship (1st) 22,299 Season tickets sold from League cup final + success and money spent on players but playing in red and 199 higher than year before

2011/12 Championship (6th) 22,100 Large number of 'Golden' season tickets sold year before
2010/11 Championship (4th) 23.194 Bellamy + top of table most of year + play off final year before
2009/10 Championship (4th) 20,717 First season new stadium
2008/09 Championship (7th) 18,000 Last season Ninian, FA Cup Final so season ticket sales high
2007/08 Championship (12th) 13,939 Nothing season low crowds
2006/07 Championship (13th) 15,223 Top of table after 12 games so 20k crowds dropping to 12k
2005/06 Championship (11th) 11,720 Mid table nothing happening crowds sub 10k regularly
2004/05 Championship (16th) 12,976 Sam's dream started to implode. Black Friday etc.
2003/04 Championship (13th) 15,569 First year in Championship
2002/03 League 1 (6th) 13,050 Promoted via playoffs. Money spent on players + Success
2001/02 League 1 (4th) 12,253 Back in League 1 + success
2000/01 League 2 (2nd) 7,962 First year of Sam. Money spent on players + success
1999/00 League 1 (21st) 6,895 Back in League 1 but relegated. Crowds started 10k +
1998/99 League 2 (3rd) 7,131 Frank Burrows takes us up. Success.
1997/98 League 2 (21st) 3,610 Dungeon performing badly. 20k say they went actually 3k
1996/97 League 2 (7th) 3,594 Relative success but still crowds low.
1995/96 League 2 (22nd) 3,420 Hangover from relegation year before.
1994/95 League 1 (22nd) 4,543 Sat lower league most of year, inevitable relegation.
1993/94 League 1 (19th) 6,072 Spike in crowds from promotion plus Cup Run boosted league crowds.
1992/93 League 2 (1st) 8,560 Eddie May's barmy army. Money spent + success under RW.
1991/92 League 2 (9th) 6,191 First bit of relative success in ages boosted crowds. Lots of children got into the City (including me). Large crowds back end of season.


Any question, comments or concerns please feel free to add.


Ridsdales Golden ticket sales were instrumental in the increase in ticket sales along with the finals and promotion, and it proves success and good marketing will bring back crowds.

If we get promotion there will be 1000s more plastics ready to suppport us...
Bluebina
 
Posts: 8678
Joined: Wed Dec 02, 2009 11:32 pm

Re: Debunking the 4000 fans lost due to rebrand theory (upda

Postby maccydee » Sat Feb 24, 2018 8:31 pm

Bluebina wrote:
maccydee wrote:These are our average attendances and league positions over the last 20 odd years now updated. It is based on current names so dungeon is called league 2. I have put a possible mitigating factor for large (or low) attendance in last column.

I hope this shows that Cardiff have had crowds up during success and down when not so successful for years so this season's low crowds are to be expected and nothing to do with the rebrand, Tan being owner or Dai Hunt.

To make it really easy for Bakedalaskar I have even done the text in the colour kit we were playing in. This makes it incredibly easy for him to see exactly what colour we were wearing and proves in no uncertain terms that colour of kit has no impact on crowds and if anything it shows that when wearing red we gained fans not lost them.

Year- Level & Position- Average Attendance- Historical significance
2017/18 Championship (currently 2nd) 18,922
2016/17 Championship (12th) 16,564 no historical significance
2015/16 Championship (8th) 16,463 first year fully back in blue

2014/15 Championship (11th) 21,124 Season tickets sold from previous year plus lots of money spent on player under OGS. Changed to blue January 2015.
2013/14 Premiership (20th) 27,430 First year in top tier in ages
2012/13 Championship (1st) 22,299 Season tickets sold from League cup final + success and money spent on players but playing in red and 199 higher than year before

2011/12 Championship (6th) 22,100 Large number of 'Golden' season tickets sold year before
2010/11 Championship (4th) 23.194 Bellamy + top of table most of year + play off final year before
2009/10 Championship (4th) 20,717 First season new stadium
2008/09 Championship (7th) 18,000 Last season Ninian, FA Cup Final so season ticket sales high
2007/08 Championship (12th) 13,939 Nothing season low crowds
2006/07 Championship (13th) 15,223 Top of table after 12 games so 20k crowds dropping to 12k
2005/06 Championship (11th) 11,720 Mid table nothing happening crowds sub 10k regularly
2004/05 Championship (16th) 12,976 Sam's dream started to implode. Black Friday etc.
2003/04 Championship (13th) 15,569 First year in Championship
2002/03 League 1 (6th) 13,050 Promoted via playoffs. Money spent on players + Success
2001/02 League 1 (4th) 12,253 Back in League 1 + success
2000/01 League 2 (2nd) 7,962 First year of Sam. Money spent on players + success
1999/00 League 1 (21st) 6,895 Back in League 1 but relegated. Crowds started 10k +
1998/99 League 2 (3rd) 7,131 Frank Burrows takes us up. Success.
1997/98 League 2 (21st) 3,610 Dungeon performing badly. 20k say they went actually 3k
1996/97 League 2 (7th) 3,594 Relative success but still crowds low.
1995/96 League 2 (22nd) 3,420 Hangover from relegation year before.
1994/95 League 1 (22nd) 4,543 Sat lower league most of year, inevitable relegation.
1993/94 League 1 (19th) 6,072 Spike in crowds from promotion plus Cup Run boosted league crowds.
1992/93 League 2 (1st) 8,560 Eddie May's barmy army. Money spent + success under RW.
1991/92 League 2 (9th) 6,191 First bit of relative success in ages boosted crowds. Lots of children got into the City (including me). Large crowds back end of season.


Any question, comments or concerns please feel free to add.


Riders Lee Golden ticket sales were instrumental in the increase in ticket sales along with the finals and promotion, and it proves success and good marketing will bring back crowds.

If we get promotion there will be 1000s more plastics ready to suppport us...


Yep like the ‘4000’ who left cos of the rebrand minus the 50 odd with principles.
maccydee
 
Posts: 6022
Joined: Sat Dec 05, 2009 9:33 pm
Location: Cottesmore

Re: Debunking the 4000 fans lost due to rebrand theory (upda

Postby Bluebina » Sat Feb 24, 2018 8:34 pm

Bluebina wrote:
maccydee wrote:These are our average attendances and league positions over the last 20 odd years now updated. It is based on current names so dungeon is called league 2. I have put a possible mitigating factor for large (or low) attendance in last column.

I hope this shows that Cardiff have had crowds up during success and down when not so successful for years so this season's low crowds are to be expected and nothing to do with the rebrand, Tan being owner or Dai Hunt.

To make it really easy for Bakedalaskar I have even done the text in the colour kit we were playing in. This makes it incredibly easy for him to see exactly what colour we were wearing and proves in no uncertain terms that colour of kit has no impact on crowds and if anything it shows that when wearing red we gained fans not lost them.

Year- Level & Position- Average Attendance- Historical significance
2017/18 Championship (currently 2nd) 18,922
2016/17 Championship (12th) 16,564 no historical significance
2015/16 Championship (8th) 16,463 first year fully back in blue

2014/15 Championship (11th) 21,124 Season tickets sold from previous year plus lots of money spent on player under OGS. Changed to blue January 2015.
2013/14 Premiership (20th) 27,430 First year in top tier in ages
2012/13 Championship (1st) 22,299 Season tickets sold from League cup final + success and money spent on players but playing in red and 199 higher than year before

2011/12 Championship (6th) 22,100 Large number of 'Golden' season tickets sold year before
2010/11 Championship (4th) 23.194 Bellamy + top of table most of year + play off final year before
2009/10 Championship (4th) 20,717 First season new stadium
2008/09 Championship (7th) 18,000 Last season Ninian, FA Cup Final so season ticket sales high
2007/08 Championship (12th) 13,939 Nothing season low crowds
2006/07 Championship (13th) 15,223 Top of table after 12 games so 20k crowds dropping to 12k
2005/06 Championship (11th) 11,720 Mid table nothing happening crowds sub 10k regularly
2004/05 Championship (16th) 12,976 Sam's dream started to implode. Black Friday etc.
2003/04 Championship (13th) 15,569 First year in Championship
2002/03 League 1 (6th) 13,050 Promoted via playoffs. Money spent on players + Success
2001/02 League 1 (4th) 12,253 Back in League 1 + success
2000/01 League 2 (2nd) 7,962 First year of Sam. Money spent on players + success
1999/00 League 1 (21st) 6,895 Back in League 1 but relegated. Crowds started 10k +
1998/99 League 2 (3rd) 7,131 Frank Burrows takes us up. Success.
1997/98 League 2 (21st) 3,610 Dungeon performing badly. 20k say they went actually 3k
1996/97 League 2 (7th) 3,594 Relative success but still crowds low.
1995/96 League 2 (22nd) 3,420 Hangover from relegation year before.
1994/95 League 1 (22nd) 4,543 Sat lower league most of year, inevitable relegation.
1993/94 League 1 (19th) 6,072 Spike in crowds from promotion plus Cup Run boosted league crowds.
1992/93 League 2 (1st) 8,560 Eddie May's barmy army. Money spent + success under RW.
1991/92 League 2 (9th) 6,191 First bit of relative success in ages boosted crowds. Lots of children got into the City (including me). Large crowds back end of season.


Any question, comments or concerns please feel free to add.


Ridsdales Golden ticket sales were instrumental in the increase in ticket sales along with the finals and promotion, and it proves success and good marketing will bring back crowds.

If we get promotion there will be 1000s more plastics ready to suppport us...


If we got to the playoffs and offered tickets for the games to season ticket holders only 1000’s would return and buy season tickets fir next season, to jump on the bandwagon like they have in the past
Bluebina
 
Posts: 8678
Joined: Wed Dec 02, 2009 11:32 pm

Re: Debunking the 4000 fans lost due to rebrand theory (upda

Postby Bluebina » Sat Feb 24, 2018 8:36 pm

Jimmykingz wrote:Someone on this forum had it bang on the other day on another of these kind of discussions.

The “missing” fans are the ones who bought season tickets to get tickets for Wembley and then the Premier League.

Without that big success/games people are not interested.

We have a fickle fan base. Always have

Exactly spot on
Bluebina
 
Posts: 8678
Joined: Wed Dec 02, 2009 11:32 pm

Re: Debunking the 4000 fans lost due to rebrand theory (upda

Postby seanmogs » Sat Feb 24, 2018 9:12 pm

maccydee wrote:
seanmogs wrote:I didn’t ask for my money back because I had been a season ticket holder since the Ninian Park days and I gave the club a chance. It it became more and more of a circus, it just got worse. So I fell out of love with the club and I’ve never felt the same since. Many others have felt the same. You’re stupid to think otherwise. Genuinely.

The club have lost a couple of thousand due to the rebrand whether you like it or not.


The fans made it the circus. The actual rebrand was done in good faith by Tan and he offered us the chance to reverse it. We wanted the 100 million investment.

Like with Ian we are going to have to agree to disagree but there is nothing that backs up your stats that the rebrand cost us thousands of fans. It didn’t cost us you as you went after the rebrand. You either were against it and got a refund or didn’t go again or you weren’t that bothered and went the following year.

If you went the following year and watched us in red and then walked away the following year it was not due to the rebrand.


If it wasn’t due to the rebrand and the circus the club turned into I would still be a season ticket holder now. I’ve watched the club since they were in league 2 so don’t tell me I stopped watching them because we failed in the premier league. You can twist and turn comments to suit your agenda all you want. But the bottom line is, the club HAVE lost fans due to the rebrand. And that is a fact. The club was an absolute joke since getting promoted. A joke that I didn’t want to be associated with. Spin my comments all you want to suit your own agenda.
seanmogs
 
Posts: 576
Joined: Sat Feb 06, 2010 4:09 pm

Re: Debunking the 4000 fans lost due to rebrand theory (upda

Postby maccydee » Sat Feb 24, 2018 9:15 pm

seanmogs wrote:
maccydee wrote:
seanmogs wrote:I didn’t ask for my money back because I had been a season ticket holder since the Ninian Park days and I gave the club a chance. It it became more and more of a circus, it just got worse. So I fell out of love with the club and I’ve never felt the same since. Many others have felt the same. You’re stupid to think otherwise. Genuinely.

The club have lost a couple of thousand due to the rebrand whether you like it or not.


The fans made it the circus. The actual rebrand was done in good faith by Tan and he offered us the chance to reverse it. We wanted the 100 million investment.

Like with Ian we are going to have to agree to disagree but there is nothing that backs up your stats that the rebrand cost us thousands of fans. It didn’t cost us you as you went after the rebrand. You either were against it and got a refund or didn’t go again or you weren’t that bothered and went the following year.

If you went the following year and watched us in red and then walked away the following year it was not due to the rebrand.


If it wasn’t due to the rebrand and the circus the club turned into I would still be a season ticket holder now. I’ve watched the club since they were in league 2 so don’t tell me I stopped watching them because we failed in the premier league. You can twist and turn comments to suit your agenda all you want. But the bottom line is, the club HAVE lost fans due to the rebrand. And that is a fact. The club was an absolute joke since getting promoted. A joke that I didn’t want to be associated with. Spin my comments all you want to suit your own agenda.


I don’t dispute it and I haven’t an agenda.
maccydee
 
Posts: 6022
Joined: Sat Dec 05, 2009 9:33 pm
Location: Cottesmore

Re: Debunking the 4000 fans lost due to rebrand theory (upda

Postby seanmogs » Sat Feb 24, 2018 9:23 pm

maccydee wrote:
seanmogs wrote:
maccydee wrote:
seanmogs wrote:I didn’t ask for my money back because I had been a season ticket holder since the Ninian Park days and I gave the club a chance. It it became more and more of a circus, it just got worse. So I fell out of love with the club and I’ve never felt the same since. Many others have felt the same. You’re stupid to think otherwise. Genuinely.

The club have lost a couple of thousand due to the rebrand whether you like it or not.


The fans made it the circus. The actual rebrand was done in good faith by Tan and he offered us the chance to reverse it. We wanted the 100 million investment.

Like with Ian we are going to have to agree to disagree but there is nothing that backs up your stats that the rebrand cost us thousands of fans. It didn’t cost us you as you went after the rebrand. You either were against it and got a refund or didn’t go again or you weren’t that bothered and went the following year.

If you went the following year and watched us in red and then walked away the following year it was not due to the rebrand.


If it wasn’t due to the rebrand and the circus the club turned into I would still be a season ticket holder now. I’ve watched the club since they were in league 2 so don’t tell me I stopped watching them because we failed in the premier league. You can twist and turn comments to suit your agenda all you want. But the bottom line is, the club HAVE lost fans due to the rebrand. And that is a fact. The club was an absolute joke since getting promoted. A joke that I didn’t want to be associated with. Spin my comments all you want to suit your own agenda.


I don’t dispute it and I haven’t an agenda.



So don’t come up with shit that the rebrand hasn’t lost any fans then. Because I’m proof the club have lost on a a long standing season ticket holder. And I know many more like me.
seanmogs
 
Posts: 576
Joined: Sat Feb 06, 2010 4:09 pm

Re: Debunking the 4000 fans lost due to rebrand theory (upda

Postby maccydee » Sat Feb 24, 2018 9:29 pm

seanmogs wrote:
maccydee wrote:
seanmogs wrote:
maccydee wrote:
seanmogs wrote:I didn’t ask for my money back because I had been a season ticket holder since the Ninian Park days and I gave the club a chance. It it became more and more of a circus, it just got worse. So I fell out of love with the club and I’ve never felt the same since. Many others have felt the same. You’re stupid to think otherwise. Genuinely.

The club have lost a couple of thousand due to the rebrand whether you like it or not.


The fans made it the circus. The actual rebrand was done in good faith by Tan and he offered us the chance to reverse it. We wanted the 100 million investment.

Like with Ian we are going to have to agree to disagree but there is nothing that backs up your stats that the rebrand cost us thousands of fans. It didn’t cost us you as you went after the rebrand. You either were against it and got a refund or didn’t go again or you weren’t that bothered and went the following year.

If you went the following year and watched us in red and then walked away the following year it was not due to the rebrand.


If it wasn’t due to the rebrand and the circus the club turned into I would still be a season ticket holder now. I’ve watched the club since they were in league 2 so don’t tell me I stopped watching them because we failed in the premier league. You can twist and turn comments to suit your agenda all you want. But the bottom line is, the club HAVE lost fans due to the rebrand. And that is a fact. The club was an absolute joke since getting promoted. A joke that I didn’t want to be associated with. Spin my comments all you want to suit your own agenda.


I don’t dispute it and I haven’t an agenda.



So don’t come up with shit that the rebrand hasn’t lost any fans then. Because I’m proof the club have lost on a a long standing season ticket holder. And I know many more like me.


Are you even reading what I write? I have said we lost fans just not 4000 and certainly there are no stats that suggest that.

Who has the agenda and trying to see something that I simply haven’t written?
maccydee
 
Posts: 6022
Joined: Sat Dec 05, 2009 9:33 pm
Location: Cottesmore

Re: Debunking the 4000 fans lost due to rebrand theory (upda

Postby Costa Coffee Crew » Sat Feb 24, 2018 9:33 pm

Could it be that the missing fans are ex City fans who now support the Shite in White.
Soft fans, from places like Bridgend Maesteg Port Talbot and Aberdare. Welsh football fan rather than hardcore Bluebirds. Truth is there are more bigger games in the Prem. This could explain the difference between the crowds under Jones and the crowds now. Hard to stomach maybe, but a reasonable theory.
Costa Coffee Crew
 
Posts: 79
Joined: Tue Aug 17, 2010 8:44 pm

Re: Debunking the 4000 fans lost due to rebrand theory (upda

Postby seanmogs » Sat Feb 24, 2018 9:41 pm

maccydee wrote:
seanmogs wrote:
maccydee wrote:
seanmogs wrote:
maccydee wrote:
seanmogs wrote:I didn’t ask for my money back because I had been a season ticket holder since the Ninian Park days and I gave the club a chance. It it became more and more of a circus, it just got worse. So I fell out of love with the club and I’ve never felt the same since. Many others have felt the same. You’re stupid to think otherwise. Genuinely.

The club have lost a couple of thousand due to the rebrand whether you like it or not.


The fans made it the circus. The actual rebrand was done in good faith by Tan and he offered us the chance to reverse it. We wanted the 100 million investment.

Like with Ian we are going to have to agree to disagree but there is nothing that backs up your stats that the rebrand cost us thousands of fans. It didn’t cost us you as you went after the rebrand. You either were against it and got a refund or didn’t go again or you weren’t that bothered and went the following year.

If you went the following year and watched us in red and then walked away the following year it was not due to the rebrand.


If it wasn’t due to the rebrand and the circus the club turned into I would still be a season ticket holder now. I’ve watched the club since they were in league 2 so don’t tell me I stopped watching them because we failed in the premier league. You can twist and turn comments to suit your agenda all you want. But the bottom line is, the club HAVE lost fans due to the rebrand. And that is a fact. The club was an absolute joke since getting promoted. A joke that I didn’t want to be associated with. Spin my comments all you want to suit your own agenda.


I don’t dispute it and I haven’t an agenda.



So don’t come up with shit that the rebrand hasn’t lost any fans then. Because I’m proof the club have lost on a a long standing season ticket holder. And I know many more like me.


Are you even reading what I write? I have said we lost fans just not 4000 and certainly there are no stats that suggest that.

Who has the agenda and trying to see something that I simply haven’t written?



Reading through your comments you seem to think the rebrand has had zero effect on our crowds. An opinion that you’re clearly wrong at. The club have lost a couple of thousand due to the circus the club turned into and that’s a fact. Having 20k + average before we were contenders for promotion in the championship and comparing them to the crowds these days proves it.
seanmogs
 
Posts: 576
Joined: Sat Feb 06, 2010 4:09 pm

Re: Debunking the 4000 fans lost due to rebrand theory (upda

Postby maccydee » Sat Feb 24, 2018 9:50 pm

seanmogs wrote:
maccydee wrote:
seanmogs wrote:
maccydee wrote:
seanmogs wrote:
maccydee wrote:
seanmogs wrote:I didn’t ask for my money back because I had been a season ticket holder since the Ninian Park days and I gave the club a chance. It it became more and more of a circus, it just got worse. So I fell out of love with the club and I’ve never felt the same since. Many others have felt the same. You’re stupid to think otherwise. Genuinely.

The club have lost a couple of thousand due to the rebrand whether you like it or not.


The fans made it the circus. The actual rebrand was done in good faith by Tan and he offered us the chance to reverse it. We wanted the 100 million investment.

Like with Ian we are going to have to agree to disagree but there is nothing that backs up your stats that the rebrand cost us thousands of fans. It didn’t cost us you as you went after the rebrand. You either were against it and got a refund or didn’t go again or you weren’t that bothered and went the following year.

If you went the following year and watched us in red and then walked away the following year it was not due to the rebrand.


If it wasn’t due to the rebrand and the circus the club turned into I would still be a season ticket holder now. I’ve watched the club since they were in league 2 so don’t tell me I stopped watching them because we failed in the premier league. You can twist and turn comments to suit your agenda all you want. But the bottom line is, the club HAVE lost fans due to the rebrand. And that is a fact. The club was an absolute joke since getting promoted. A joke that I didn’t want to be associated with. Spin my comments all you want to suit your own agenda.


I don’t dispute it and I haven’t an agenda.



So don’t come up with shit that the rebrand hasn’t lost any fans then. Because I’m proof the club have lost on a a long standing season ticket holder. And I know many more like me.


Are you even reading what I write? I have said we lost fans just not 4000 and certainly there are no stats that suggest that.

Who has the agenda and trying to see something that I simply haven’t written?



Reading through your comments you seem to think the rebrand has had zero effect on our crowds. An opinion that you’re clearly wrong at. The club have lost a couple of thousand due to the circus the club turned into and that’s a fact. Having 20k + average before we were contenders for promotion in the championship and comparing them to the crowds these days proves it.


I do think that. The stats I have put out prove it too. The crowds actually went up the year after the rebrand in the same division but of course that’s because 2000 or 4000 didn’t stop going at the actual point the rebrand occurred. The crowds only started going down when we were back in blue and co-incidentally losing and not playing very well.

You can say it’s a fact all you like but it isn’t it’s your opinion. Of course if you gave me proper proof I will gladly say I’m wrong.
maccydee
 
Posts: 6022
Joined: Sat Dec 05, 2009 9:33 pm
Location: Cottesmore

Re: Debunking the 4000 fans lost due to rebrand theory (upda

Postby Tony Blue Williams » Sat Feb 24, 2018 10:30 pm

seanmogs wrote:I didn’t ask for my money back because I had been a season ticket holder since the Ninian Park days and I gave the club a chance. It it became more and more of a circus, it just got worse. So I fell out of love with the club and I’ve never felt the same since. Many others have felt the same. You’re stupid to think otherwise. Genuinely.

The club have lost a couple of thousand due to the rebrand whether you like it or not.


We don't know the exact figure but on the balance of probabilities we definitely lost a significant number of so called hard core supporters.

I don't accept that the rebrand is responsible for all of the 4k missing fans but I wouldn't be surprised if the number was something between 1-1.5k.
User avatar
Tony Blue Williams
 
Posts: 12658
Joined: Wed Nov 25, 2009 8:25 am

Re: Debunking the 4000 fans lost due to rebrand theory (upda

Postby maccydee » Sat Feb 24, 2018 10:33 pm

Tony Blue Williams wrote:
seanmogs wrote:I didn’t ask for my money back because I had been a season ticket holder since the Ninian Park days and I gave the club a chance. It it became more and more of a circus, it just got worse. So I fell out of love with the club and I’ve never felt the same since. Many others have felt the same. You’re stupid to think otherwise. Genuinely.

The club have lost a couple of thousand due to the rebrand whether you like it or not.


We don't know the exact figure but on the balance of probabilities we definitely lost a significant number of so called hard core supporters.

I don't accept that the rebrand is responsible for all of the 4k missing fans but I wouldn't be surprised if the number was something between 1-1.5k.


There aren’t 4000 missing fans.

Why didn’t the crowds drop straight away after the rebrand if it was legitimately as many as 1500?
maccydee
 
Posts: 6022
Joined: Sat Dec 05, 2009 9:33 pm
Location: Cottesmore

Re: Debunking the 4000 fans lost due to rebrand theory (upda

Postby seanmogs » Sat Feb 24, 2018 10:35 pm

maccydee wrote:
seanmogs wrote:
maccydee wrote:
seanmogs wrote:
maccydee wrote:
seanmogs wrote:
maccydee wrote:
seanmogs wrote:I didn’t ask for my money back because I had been a season ticket holder since the Ninian Park days and I gave the club a chance. It it became more and more of a circus, it just got worse. So I fell out of love with the club and I’ve never felt the same since. Many others have felt the same. You’re stupid to think otherwise. Genuinely.

The club have lost a couple of thousand due to the rebrand whether you like it or not.


The fans made it the circus. The actual rebrand was done in good faith by Tan and he offered us the chance to reverse it. We wanted the 100 million investment.

Like with Ian we are going to have to agree to disagree but there is nothing that backs up your stats that the rebrand cost us thousands of fans. It didn’t cost us you as you went after the rebrand. You either were against it and got a refund or didn’t go again or you weren’t that bothered and went the following year.

If you went the following year and watched us in red and then walked away the following year it was not due to the rebrand.


If it wasn’t due to the rebrand and the circus the club turned into I would still be a season ticket holder now. I’ve watched the club since they were in league 2 so don’t tell me I stopped watching them because we failed in the premier league. You can twist and turn comments to suit your agenda all you want. But the bottom line is, the club HAVE lost fans due to the rebrand. And that is a fact. The club was an absolute joke since getting promoted. A joke that I didn’t want to be associated with. Spin my comments all you want to suit your own agenda.


I don’t dispute it and I haven’t an agenda.



So don’t come up with shit that the rebrand hasn’t lost any fans then. Because I’m proof the club have lost on a a long standing season ticket holder. And I know many more like me.


Are you even reading what I write? I have said we lost fans just not 4000 and certainly there are no stats that suggest that.

Who has the agenda and trying to see something that I simply haven’t written?



Reading through your comments you seem to think the rebrand has had zero effect on our crowds. An opinion that you’re clearly wrong at. The club have lost a couple of thousand due to the circus the club turned into and that’s a fact. Having 20k + average before we were contenders for promotion in the championship and comparing them to the crowds these days proves it.


I do think that. The stats I have put out prove it too. The crowds actually went up the year after the rebrand in the same division but of course that’s because 2000 or 4000 didn’t stop going at the actual point the rebrand occurred. The crowds only started going down when we were back in blue and co-incidentally losing and not playing very well.

You can say it’s a fact all you like but it isn’t it’s your opinion. Of course if you gave me proper proof I will gladly say I’m wrong.


Fair enough, but I think the crowd we had in the premiership were just there for the premiership. I believe the hardcore we had before that was replaced by these so called glory supporters that only came for the premiership games and then faded away after promotion
Along with with hardcore we lost, proving that we have lost fans rather than gained. If you know what I mean. But that’s just my opinion.
seanmogs
 
Posts: 576
Joined: Sat Feb 06, 2010 4:09 pm

Re: Debunking the 4000 fans lost due to rebrand theory (upda

Postby maccydee » Sat Feb 24, 2018 10:39 pm

seanmogs wrote:
maccydee wrote:
seanmogs wrote:
maccydee wrote:
seanmogs wrote:
maccydee wrote:
seanmogs wrote:
maccydee wrote:
seanmogs wrote:I didn’t ask for my money back because I had been a season ticket holder since the Ninian Park days and I gave the club a chance. It it became more and more of a circus, it just got worse. So I fell out of love with the club and I’ve never felt the same since. Many others have felt the same. You’re stupid to think otherwise. Genuinely.

The club have lost a couple of thousand due to the rebrand whether you like it or not.


The fans made it the circus. The actual rebrand was done in good faith by Tan and he offered us the chance to reverse it. We wanted the 100 million investment.

Like with Ian we are going to have to agree to disagree but there is nothing that backs up your stats that the rebrand cost us thousands of fans. It didn’t cost us you as you went after the rebrand. You either were against it and got a refund or didn’t go again or you weren’t that bothered and went the following year.

If you went the following year and watched us in red and then walked away the following year it was not due to the rebrand.


If it wasn’t due to the rebrand and the circus the club turned into I would still be a season ticket holder now. I’ve watched the club since they were in league 2 so don’t tell me I stopped watching them because we failed in the premier league. You can twist and turn comments to suit your agenda all you want. But the bottom line is, the club HAVE lost fans due to the rebrand. And that is a fact. The club was an absolute joke since getting promoted. A joke that I didn’t want to be associated with. Spin my comments all you want to suit your own agenda.


I don’t dispute it and I haven’t an agenda.



So don’t come up with shit that the rebrand hasn’t lost any fans then. Because I’m proof the club have lost on a a long standing season ticket holder. And I know many more like me.


Are you even reading what I write? I have said we lost fans just not 4000 and certainly there are no stats that suggest that.

Who has the agenda and trying to see something that I simply haven’t written?



Reading through your comments you seem to think the rebrand has had zero effect on our crowds. An opinion that you’re clearly wrong at. The club have lost a couple of thousand due to the circus the club turned into and that’s a fact. Having 20k + average before we were contenders for promotion in the championship and comparing them to the crowds these days proves it.


I do think that. The stats I have put out prove it too. The crowds actually went up the year after the rebrand in the same division but of course that’s because 2000 or 4000 didn’t stop going at the actual point the rebrand occurred. The crowds only started going down when we were back in blue and co-incidentally losing and not playing very well.

You can say it’s a fact all you like but it isn’t it’s your opinion. Of course if you gave me proper proof I will gladly say I’m wrong.


Fair enough, but I think the crowd we had in the premiership were just there for the premiership. I believe the hardcore we had before that was replaced by these so called glory supporters that only came for the premiership games and then faded away after promotion
Along with with hardcore we lost, proving that we have lost fans rather than gained. If you know what I mean. But that’s just my opinion.


No doubt we lost fans. It was poorly handled by Tan on the advice of trusted advisors who had motives for getting 100 million into the club no matter the cost.

Thankfully we are back blue and I honestly think if we go up in blue it will mean a lot more to so many people.
maccydee
 
Posts: 6022
Joined: Sat Dec 05, 2009 9:33 pm
Location: Cottesmore

Re: Debunking the 4000 fans lost due to rebrand theory (upda

Postby Dicey » Sun Feb 25, 2018 12:46 am

If someone was to plot a regression line through those attendances you would see the fluctuating attendances are due to the success/ results of the club. The average trend line would also be positive showing how far we have come from the dungeon days.
This 4k fan loss holds no water imo.
User avatar
Dicey
 
Posts: 1103
Joined: Mon Jun 07, 2010 8:08 pm

Re: Debunking the 4000 fans lost due to rebrand theory (upda

Postby Tony Blue Williams » Sun Feb 25, 2018 10:52 am

maccydee wrote:
Tony Blue Williams wrote:
seanmogs wrote:I didn’t ask for my money back because I had been a season ticket holder since the Ninian Park days and I gave the club a chance. It it became more and more of a circus, it just got worse. So I fell out of love with the club and I’ve never felt the same since. Many others have felt the same. You’re stupid to think otherwise. Genuinely.

The club have lost a couple of thousand due to the rebrand whether you like it or not.


We don't know the exact figure but on the balance of probabilities we definitely lost a significant number of so called hard core supporters.

I don't accept that the rebrand is responsible for all of the 4k missing fans but I wouldn't be surprised if the number was something between 1-1.5k.


There aren’t 4000 missing fans.

Why didn’t the crowds drop straight away after the rebrand if it was legitimately as many as 1500?


There has been a drop of around 4000 from the last time we were in the same position (i.e. in the top 2 with a genuine chance of promotion) so on that context there is a 'missing' 4000.

I can see your logic by comparing the figures season on season but when using stats it is not always an exact science as there can be many variables. The biggest variable was obviously the chance of top flight football for the first time in 51 years and fans jumping on the bandwagon.

Another variable is the toxic after shock the rebrand has left. It simply isn't the same at CCS and I personally have been in denial about that since 2012. Fans have walked away or still attend but don't enjoy the experience of watching City like they used to.

As I said fans have gone for one reason or another since relegation from the PL. Not all of it is down to the rebrand but I still would estimate that figure is somewhere around 1500.
User avatar
Tony Blue Williams
 
Posts: 12658
Joined: Wed Nov 25, 2009 8:25 am

Re: Debunking the 4000 fans lost due to rebrand theory (upda

Postby maccydee » Sun Feb 25, 2018 10:59 am

Tony Blue Williams wrote:
maccydee wrote:
Tony Blue Williams wrote:
seanmogs wrote:I didn’t ask for my money back because I had been a season ticket holder since the Ninian Park days and I gave the club a chance. It it became more and more of a circus, it just got worse. So I fell out of love with the club and I’ve never felt the same since. Many others have felt the same. You’re stupid to think otherwise. Genuinely.

The club have lost a couple of thousand due to the rebrand whether you like it or not.


We don't know the exact figure but on the balance of probabilities we definitely lost a significant number of so called hard core supporters.

I don't accept that the rebrand is responsible for all of the 4k missing fans but I wouldn't be surprised if the number was something between 1-1.5k.


There aren’t 4000 missing fans.

Why didn’t the crowds drop straight away after the rebrand if it was legitimately as many as 1500?


There has been a drop of around 4000 from the last time we were in the same position (i.e. in the top 2 with a genuine chance of promotion) so on that context there is a 'missing' 4000.

I can see your logic by comparing the figures season on season but when using stats it is not always an exact science as there can be many variables. The biggest variable was obviously the chance of top flight football for the first time in 51 years and fans jumping on the bandwagon.

Another variable is the toxic after shock the rebrand has left. It simply isn't the same at CCS and I personally have been in denial about that since 2012. Fans have walked away or still attend but don't enjoy the experience of watching City like they used to.

As I said fans have gone for one reason or another since relegation from the PL. Not all of it is down to the rebrand but I still would estimate that figure is somewhere around 1500.


But you can use the stats to show the year after the rebrand we were in a similar position with bigger crowds than the year before. The one constant is three years of lack of success (last three seasons) and that’s why the crowds are down.

The CCS is horrible and that was the case long before the rebrand. But the CCS has been amazing whilst in red. (Man City home). A lot of that is the stewards’ over zealous policing of the law that states people must sit. That is nothing to do with the rebrand.

I firmly believe that if it was 1000 - 1500 or 4000 who left due to the rebrand it would have happened straight away. This didn’t happen so it is other reasons.

I think it’s the 50 who gave in their season tickets for a refund plus another few hundred. I don’t doubt that crowds are lower now but that’s due to other reasons but rebrand is the ‘face saving’ way out.
maccydee
 
Posts: 6022
Joined: Sat Dec 05, 2009 9:33 pm
Location: Cottesmore

Re: Debunking the 4000 fans lost due to rebrand theory (upda

Postby bluespeers » Sun Feb 25, 2018 2:54 pm

maccydee wrote:There is no actual way you can (with any credibility) say that stats back up your assertion that we have lost 4000 fans due to the rebrand. No way at all.

If you do then I want the actual names of all 4000.


I think it is a mixture of the Reband and returning to to the Champion ship, we had to righten our belts for FFP as well, also knocking on door of Premiership pulled in the crowds as did the The Cup Finals, so yes the 4000 can't just be down to the Reband. Hopefully if we continue going in the right direction we will start to pull a few thousnad back asap. :bluescarf: :ayatollah:
bluespeers
 
Posts: 1473
Joined: Wed Oct 31, 2012 9:02 pm

Re: Debunking the 4000 fans lost due to rebrand theory (upda

Postby goats » Sun Feb 25, 2018 3:38 pm

Costa Coffee Crew wrote:Could it be that the missing fans are ex City fans who now support the Shite in White.
Soft fans, from places like Bridgend Maesteg Port Talbot and Aberdare. Welsh football fan rather than hardcore Bluebirds. Truth is there are more bigger games in the Prem. This could explain the difference between the crowds under Jones and the crowds now. Hard to stomach maybe, but a reasonable theory.



No real fans change allegiances, just arseholes. They are not the hardcore support since the old days we have lost.
Looking at today’s attendance, only scraping 20k home fans, not great really. 5 years ago I reckon we’d have had 25000 easy today. Maybe it’s more than 4000 gone macca, more like 5000 :lol: :lol:
User avatar
goats
 
Posts: 1826
Joined: Thu Nov 26, 2009 11:09 pm

Re: Debunking the 4000 fans lost due to rebrand theory (upda

Postby maccydee » Sun Feb 25, 2018 3:44 pm

goats wrote:
Costa Coffee Crew wrote:Could it be that the missing fans are ex City fans who now support the Shite in White.
Soft fans, from places like Bridgend Maesteg Port Talbot and Aberdare. Welsh football fan rather than hardcore Bluebirds. Truth is there are more bigger games in the Prem. This could explain the difference between the crowds under Jones and the crowds now. Hard to stomach maybe, but a reasonable theory.



No real fans change allegiances, just arseholes. They are not the hardcore support since the old days we have lost.
Looking at today’s attendance, only scraping 20k home fans, not great really. 5 years ago I reckon we’d have had 25000 easy today. Maybe it’s more than 4000 gone macca, more like 5000 :lol: :lol:


Complete guess.

Maybe we aren’t as big as we thought?
maccydee
 
Posts: 6022
Joined: Sat Dec 05, 2009 9:33 pm
Location: Cottesmore

PreviousNext


Return to General Chat

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Bing [Bot], DartfordBluebird, dogfound, Google [Bot], Jones_1994, Milkybarkid, montyblue, nigelelec, SvendTheBluebird, Wolfpac and 258 guests

Disclaimer :
The views and comments entered in these forums are personal and are not necessarily those of the management of this board.
The management of this board is not responsible for the content of any external internet sites.