Sun Jul 01, 2018 5:21 pm
Sun Jul 01, 2018 5:31 pm
103 Barmy Army wrote:I’m in the process of buying a house and have agreed a purchase price with the current vendors, albeit the home buyers and valuation report is based on the current state of the property and all certificates being readily available.
My solicitors have highlighted the fact that although there is planning permission and building regulations approval for an upstairs extension, there is no final completion certificate confirming it meets building regulation standards. An indemnity policy has been put in place to cover me for enforcement purposes only, which would be invalidated if I contact the council. Repair costs for potential dodgy work would be my responsibility.
In the indemnity policy - under the heading “additional exclusions” - it says the insured (and successors in title) can not sell the land OR has to reduce the price when selling because the construction, conversion, alterations or additions have been made in breach of building regulations approval. Surely this has to be taken into consideration when reading the opening paragraph and I should be renegotiating a lower price?
Why wouldn’t a final completion certificate be applied for at the time and what implications could it have on my home insurance and resale value/prospects?
Any advice would be much appreciated! Thanks in advance!
Sun Jul 01, 2018 5:51 pm
Milkybarkid wrote:103 Barmy Army wrote:I’m in the process of buying a house and have agreed a purchase price with the current vendors, albeit the home buyers and valuation report is based on the current state of the property and all certificates being readily available.
My solicitors have highlighted the fact that although there is planning permission and building regulations approval for an upstairs extension, there is no final completion certificate confirming it meets building regulation standards. An indemnity policy has been put in place to cover me for enforcement purposes only, which would be invalidated if I contact the council. Repair costs for potential dodgy work would be my responsibility.
In the indemnity policy - under the heading “additional exclusions” - it says the insured (and successors in title) can not sell the land OR has to reduce the price when selling because the construction, conversion, alterations or additions have been made in breach of building regulations approval. Surely this has to be taken into consideration when reading the opening paragraph and I should be renegotiating a lower price?
Why wouldn’t a final completion certificate be applied for at the time and what implications could it have on my home insurance and resale value/prospects?
Any advice would be much appreciated! Thanks in advance!
Reduce the price to reflect cost of any potential repairs or walk away would be my advise Also has you lender stated anything
Sun Jul 01, 2018 5:51 pm
Sun Jul 01, 2018 6:00 pm
2blue2handle wrote:I would personally be concerned, why has he done all the hard work and not done the easy bit of getting the completion certificate. To me it would suggest that something hasn't been done right and corners may have been cut so wouldn't pass.
Has your solicitor given any further advise other than an indem pol? My understanding is that if you contact the council you won't be able to get an indem policy.
Sun Jul 01, 2018 6:00 pm
103 Barmy Army wrote:I’m in the process of buying a house and have agreed a purchase price with the current vendors, albeit the home buyers and valuation report is based on the current state of the property and all certificates being readily available.
My solicitors have highlighted the fact that although there is planning permission and building regulations approval for an upstairs extension, there is no final completion certificate confirming it meets building regulation standards. An indemnity policy has been put in place to cover me for enforcement purposes only, which would be invalidated if I contact the council. Repair costs for potential dodgy work would be my responsibility.
In the indemnity policy - under the heading “additional exclusions” - it says the insured (and successors in title) can not sell the land OR has to reduce the price when selling because the construction, conversion, alterations or additions have been made in breach of building regulations approval. Surely this has to be taken into consideration when reading the opening paragraph and I should be renegotiating a lower price?
Why wouldn’t a final completion certificate be applied for at the time and what implications could it have on my home insurance and resale value/prospects?
Any advice would be much appreciated! Thanks in advance!
Sun Jul 01, 2018 6:08 pm
Bananas wrote:103 Barmy Army wrote:I’m in the process of buying a house and have agreed a purchase price with the current vendors, albeit the home buyers and valuation report is based on the current state of the property and all certificates being readily available.
My solicitors have highlighted the fact that although there is planning permission and building regulations approval for an upstairs extension, there is no final completion certificate confirming it meets building regulation standards. An indemnity policy has been put in place to cover me for enforcement purposes only, which would be invalidated if I contact the council. Repair costs for potential dodgy work would be my responsibility.
In the indemnity policy - under the heading “additional exclusions” - it says the insured (and successors in title) can not sell the land OR has to reduce the price when selling because the construction, conversion, alterations or additions have been made in breach of building regulations approval. Surely this has to be taken into consideration when reading the opening paragraph and I should be renegotiating a lower price?
Why wouldn’t a final completion certificate be applied for at the time and what implications could it have on my home insurance and resale value/prospects?
Any advice would be much appreciated! Thanks in advance!
Don't do it butt
Sun Jul 01, 2018 6:09 pm
Sun Jul 01, 2018 6:18 pm
eddiep wrote:There are lots of properties like this.
Particularly attic conversions or conservatories
I've bought and sold a house with these indemnities
It's no always a sign of some dodgy work.
It wouldn't concern me if;
A I really wanted the house
B I really wanted the location
C price is right
Then again, I work around the regs so a big issue would stand out for me.
Sun Jul 01, 2018 7:00 pm
Sun Jul 01, 2018 7:11 pm
Sun Jul 01, 2018 7:16 pm
eddiep wrote:I agree with Taff
You could get a builder in for peace of mind but an RICS Surveyor option would be better
Sun Jul 01, 2018 7:27 pm
Taff on the Mersey wrote:Hiya mate, I manage 3 estate agency businesses and this is really common so firstly don’t get scared off. Use it to your advantage to gain a better purchase price, if the vendor is whilling to compromise then fantastic. If the construction was that bad then the surveyor would have made this a red factor and ultimately would have affected the valuation and thus what a lender would borrow you, giving you no option but to renegotiate (if not cash buyer). That being said, just from reading your post it appears a lazy vendor didn’t get the right paperwork. This line “can not sell the land OR has to reduce the price when selling because” is confusing as hell....can you or can’t you! Haha. If a purchaser is buying a house that has an extension of some sort without a full paper trail I would generally preempt this to avoid a fall through and advise them to get a RICS registered survey or higher to give you full reassurance.
Sun Jul 01, 2018 7:41 pm
Sun Jul 01, 2018 7:51 pm
Sun Jul 01, 2018 8:01 pm
pembroke allan wrote:One asumes your lender will not give you the mortgage that you've asked for if any doubts about property they will usually ask for certain things to be done before lending you the money! Sounds like poor paper work than dodgy work.
Sun Jul 01, 2018 8:07 pm
Jock wrote:Sounds like the vendor has applied for planning and building regulation approval but hasn’t informed the council he was starting the works, consequently the build has never been inspected,if you did go to the council now they could apply a regularisation and insist the owner gets all works up to current building regulations. Getting a RICS survey done to find out what’s needed, to bring it up to regs is a must. Best of luck with it mate.
Sun Jul 01, 2018 8:49 pm
103 Barmy Army wrote:I’m in the process of buying a house and have agreed a purchase price with the current vendors, albeit the home buyers and valuation report is based on the current state of the property and all certificates being readily available.
My solicitors have highlighted the fact that although there is planning permission and building regulations approval for an upstairs extension, there is no final completion certificate confirming it meets building regulation standards. An indemnity policy has been put in place to cover me for enforcement purposes only, which would be invalidated if I contact the council. Repair costs for potential dodgy work would be my responsibility.
In the indemnity policy - under the heading “additional exclusions” - it says the insured (and successors in title) can not sell the land OR has to reduce the price when selling because the construction, conversion, alterations or additions have been made in breach of building regulations approval. Surely this has to be taken into consideration when reading the opening paragraph and I should be renegotiating a lower price?
Why wouldn’t a final completion certificate be applied for at the time and what implications could it have on my home insurance and resale value/prospects?
Any advice would be much appreciated! Thanks in advance!
Sun Jul 01, 2018 9:09 pm
Sun Jul 01, 2018 9:11 pm
103 Barmy Army wrote:Jock wrote:Sounds like the vendor has applied for planning and building regulation approval but hasn’t informed the council he was starting the works, consequently the build has never been inspected,if you did go to the council now they could apply a regularisation and insist the owner gets all works up to current building regulations. Getting a RICS survey done to find out what’s needed, to bring it up to regs is a must. Best of luck with it mate.
My understanding is that if I go to the council now, that’ll make any indemnity policy void. Also, the current vendors haven’t got to get it up to standard to sell (just as I haven’t got to buy).
It might be worth me ringing the council with a hypothetical question based on my situation and not giving any personal information.
The part about not informing the council is highly possible.
Thanks for the idea, it’s much appreciated!
Sun Jul 01, 2018 9:16 pm
Carlossus wrote:103 Barmy Army wrote:I’m in the process of buying a house and have agreed a purchase price with the current vendors, albeit the home buyers and valuation report is based on the current state of the property and all certificates being readily available.
My solicitors have highlighted the fact that although there is planning permission and building regulations approval for an upstairs extension, there is no final completion certificate confirming it meets building regulation standards. An indemnity policy has been put in place to cover me for enforcement purposes only, which would be invalidated if I contact the council. Repair costs for potential dodgy work would be my responsibility.
In the indemnity policy - under the heading “additional exclusions” - it says the insured (and successors in title) can not sell the land OR has to reduce the price when selling because the construction, conversion, alterations or additions have been made in breach of building regulations approval. Surely this has to be taken into consideration when reading the opening paragraph and I should be renegotiating a lower price?
Why wouldn’t a final completion certificate be applied for at the time and what implications could it have on my home insurance and resale value/prospects?
Any advice would be much appreciated! Thanks in advance!
Ive been a property landlord for some time now,Ive made a few mistakes but on the whole done OK. Have to admit this is a new one on me,confused about the indemnity problem and not being able contact council.As i see it indemnity policies are for your own safeguard if anything went wrong. Lenders will not take undue risks they ,I suspect value deliberately on the low side to hedge their bets. If you are being offered a mortgage? then my own opinion it must be sound .My advice is if you are in any doubt arrange for a reputable builder/surveyor to check it out and by all means use what I suspect is untidy paperwork for a reduction. By the way I dont what type of boiler is there, whether it a back boiler or combi i would insist on a certificate.
Sun Jul 01, 2018 9:49 pm
103 Barmy Army wrote:Carlossus wrote:103 Barmy Army wrote:I’m in the process of buying a house and have agreed a purchase price with the current vendors, albeit the home buyers and valuation report is based on the current state of the property and all certificates being readily available.
My solicitors have highlighted the fact that although there is planning permission and building regulations approval for an upstairs extension, there is no final completion certificate confirming it meets building regulation standards. An indemnity policy has been put in place to cover me for enforcement purposes only, which would be invalidated if I contact the council. Repair costs for potential dodgy work would be my responsibility.
In the indemnity policy - under the heading “additional exclusions” - it says the insured (and successors in title) can not sell the land OR has to reduce the price when selling because the construction, conversion, alterations or additions have been made in breach of building regulations approval. Surely this has to be taken into consideration when reading the opening paragraph and I should be renegotiating a lower price?
Why wouldn’t a final completion certificate be applied for at the time and what implications could it have on my home insurance and resale value/prospects?
Any advice would be much appreciated! Thanks in advance!
Ive been a property landlord for some time now,Ive made a few mistakes but on the whole done OK. Have to admit this is a new one on me,confused about the indemnity problem and not being able contact council.As i see it indemnity policies are for your own safeguard if anything went wrong. Lenders will not take undue risks they ,I suspect value deliberately on the low side to hedge their bets. If you are being offered a mortgage? then my own opinion it must be sound .My advice is if you are in any doubt arrange for a reputable builder/surveyor to check it out and by all means use what I suspect is untidy paperwork for a reduction. By the way I dont what type of boiler is there, whether it a back boiler or combi i would insist on a certificate.
Ive been told they’re getting the boiler serviced, but I’m assuming that’s different to having a certificate.
Regarding the mortgage, it’s less than the purchase amount as I’m putting money towards it to the tune of about 28k. I don’t know if the lenders are just safe guarding the mortgage amount or the actual amount I’m paying for the property. Does anyone know the protocol for lenders?
It sounds like you’re playing monopoly in real life. Good effort and thanks for the information!
Sun Jul 01, 2018 9:56 pm
Carlossus wrote:103 Barmy Army wrote:Carlossus wrote:103 Barmy Army wrote:I’m in the process of buying a house and have agreed a purchase price with the current vendors, albeit the home buyers and valuation report is based on the current state of the property and all certificates being readily available.
My solicitors have highlighted the fact that although there is planning permission and building regulations approval for an upstairs extension, there is no final completion certificate confirming it meets building regulation standards. An indemnity policy has been put in place to cover me for enforcement purposes only, which would be invalidated if I contact the council. Repair costs for potential dodgy work would be my responsibility.
In the indemnity policy - under the heading “additional exclusions” - it says the insured (and successors in title) can not sell the land OR has to reduce the price when selling because the construction, conversion, alterations or additions have been made in breach of building regulations approval. Surely this has to be taken into consideration when reading the opening paragraph and I should be renegotiating a lower price?
Why wouldn’t a final completion certificate be applied for at the time and what implications could it have on my home insurance and resale value/prospects?
Any advice would be much appreciated! Thanks in advance!
Ive been a property landlord for some time now,Ive made a few mistakes but on the whole done OK. Have to admit this is a new one on me,confused about the indemnity problem and not being able contact council.As i see it indemnity policies are for your own safeguard if anything went wrong. Lenders will not take undue risks they ,I suspect value deliberately on the low side to hedge their bets. If you are being offered a mortgage? then my own opinion it must be sound .My advice is if you are in any doubt arrange for a reputable builder/surveyor to check it out and by all means use what I suspect is untidy paperwork for a reduction. By the way I dont what type of boiler is there, whether it a back boiler or combi i would insist on a certificate.
Ive been told they’re getting the boiler serviced, but I’m assuming that’s different to having a certificate.
Regarding the mortgage, it’s less than the purchase amount as I’m putting money towards it to the tune of about 28k. I don’t know if the lenders are just safe guarding the mortgage amount or the actual amount I’m paying for the property. Does anyone know the protocol for lenders?
It sounds like you’re playing monopoly in real life. Good effort and thanks for the information!
Again in my experience there are many lenders and protocol varies, lending is usually between 70-90% depending on circumstances.All my dealings they have worked to the actual amount and if valuation did not stack up I would not get the loan even though they were lending only 70% . I hope this helps you.
Mon Jul 02, 2018 12:12 am
Mon Jul 02, 2018 7:15 am
103 Barmy Army wrote:Milkybarkid wrote:103 Barmy Army wrote:I’m in the process of buying a house and have agreed a purchase price with the current vendors, albeit the home buyers and valuation report is based on the current state of the property and all certificates being readily available.
My solicitors have highlighted the fact that although there is planning permission and building regulations approval for an upstairs extension, there is no final completion certificate confirming it meets building regulation standards. An indemnity policy has been put in place to cover me for enforcement purposes only, which would be invalidated if I contact the council. Repair costs for potential dodgy work would be my responsibility.
In the indemnity policy - under the heading “additional exclusions” - it says the insured (and successors in title) can not sell the land OR has to reduce the price when selling because the construction, conversion, alterations or additions have been made in breach of building regulations approval. Surely this has to be taken into consideration when reading the opening paragraph and I should be renegotiating a lower price?
Why wouldn’t a final completion certificate be applied for at the time and what implications could it have on my home insurance and resale value/prospects?
Any advice would be much appreciated! Thanks in advance!
Reduce the price to reflect cost of any potential repairs or walk away would be my advise Also has you lender stated anything
Lender seem alright with it.
I’m sending a builder in to look at some other issues which I’m content to pay for if it’s not too much money, as it’s within the “current state” parameters of the valuation survey. The message passed via the estate agent was that they are happy to let someone in, but will not be reducing the purchase price due to demand in the property.
Also, there’s currently no CORGI certificate for the installation of the boiler to meet regulation standards. An indemnity policy will again be in place for this for enforcement purposes and not if the boiler breaks. A service is due soon, with a report to follow.
Additionally, the sellers have stated in the property information form that the property has been rewired or electrical installations work has been carried out, but there’s no evidence.
Im still waiting to hear if they have an installation certificate for a log burner and if regular services have been carried out. The survey flagged it up as dangerous due to size and proximity issues, so further investigations are ongoing. There’s no carbon monoxide detector, but that’s something I can sort out myself. Potentially even more official certificates missing when negoating a purchase price.
That’s a good idea on getting a cost of all potential repairs, thanks!
Mon Jul 02, 2018 1:58 pm
Bluebina wrote:103 Barmy Army wrote:Milkybarkid wrote:103 Barmy Army wrote:I’m in the process of buying a house and have agreed a purchase price with the current vendors, albeit the home buyers and valuation report is based on the current state of the property and all certificates being readily available.
My solicitors have highlighted the fact that although there is planning permission and building regulations approval for an upstairs extension, there is no final completion certificate confirming it meets building regulation standards. An indemnity policy has been put in place to cover me for enforcement purposes only, which would be invalidated if I contact the council. Repair costs for potential dodgy work would be my responsibility.
In the indemnity policy - under the heading “additional exclusions” - it says the insured (and successors in title) can not sell the land OR has to reduce the price when selling because the construction, conversion, alterations or additions have been made in breach of building regulations approval. Surely this has to be taken into consideration when reading the opening paragraph and I should be renegotiating a lower price?
Why wouldn’t a final completion certificate be applied for at the time and what implications could it have on my home insurance and resale value/prospects?
Any advice would be much appreciated! Thanks in advance!
Reduce the price to reflect cost of any potential repairs or walk away would be my advise Also has you lender stated anything
Lender seem alright with it.
I’m sending a builder in to look at some other issues which I’m content to pay for if it’s not too much money, as it’s within the “current state” parameters of the valuation survey. The message passed via the estate agent was that they are happy to let someone in, but will not be reducing the purchase price due to demand in the property.
Also, there’s currently no CORGI certificate for the installation of the boiler to meet regulation standards. An indemnity policy will again be in place for this for enforcement purposes and not if the boiler breaks. A service is due soon, with a report to follow.
Additionally, the sellers have stated in the property information form that the property has been rewired or electrical installations work has been carried out, but there’s no evidence.
Im still waiting to hear if they have an installation certificate for a log burner and if regular services have been carried out. The survey flagged it up as dangerous due to size and proximity issues, so further investigations are ongoing. There’s no carbon monoxide detector, but that’s something I can sort out myself. Potentially even more official certificates missing when negoating a purchase price.
That’s a good idea on getting a cost of all potential repairs, thanks!
You sound a bit cautious, I have never worried about certificates for boilers and rewiring and alike, this doesn't sound like the right property for you, some people will have kept all those types of documents, but lots of people don't bother.
I can see you getting all of these checks done paying money and pulling out for some reason later down the lane costing you money.
Mon Jul 02, 2018 7:13 pm
Sat Jul 21, 2018 7:26 am
Sat Jul 21, 2018 8:34 am
103 Barmy Army wrote:As promised, here’s the final update on the house situation.
The vendors refused to get a completion certificate for the extension, even though it only costs about £200 and would supersede any indemnity policy. This got me wondering if they were worried about potential large repair bills due to building regulations not being adhered to.
It came across as a classic transfer of risk ownership, with me potentially liable for any repairs as I would have been unable or victimised when getting home insurance.
As a result, I won’t be buying the Dorma Bungalow and it’s back up for sale on the market in Bridgend. I’m annoyed that I wasn’t given all the information at the start, as their lack of integrity has cost me about a grand.
I’ve got 2 and a half years remaining of extremely cheap rent (through work) and the plan is to buy nearer the time it ends.
Thanks to everyone who contributed for your time and effort and I hope you enjoy next season.
Sat Jul 21, 2018 9:00 am
103 Barmy Army wrote:As promised, here’s the final update on the house situation.
The vendors refused to get a completion certificate for the extension, even though it only costs about £200 and would supersede any indemnity policy. This got me wondering if they were worried about potential large repair bills due to building regulations not being adhered to.
It came across as a classic transfer of risk ownership, with me potentially liable for any repairs as I would have been unable or victimised when getting home insurance.
As a result, I won’t be buying the Dorma Bungalow and it’s back up for sale on the market in Bridgend. I’m annoyed that I wasn’t given all the information at the start, as their lack of integrity has cost me about a grand.
I’ve got 2 and a half years remaining of extremely cheap rent (through work) and the plan is to buy nearer the time it ends.
Thanks to everyone who contributed for your time and effort and I hope you enjoy next season.