“ SURELY SURELY ITS A MUST “

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“ SURELY SURELY ITS A MUST “

Postby Forever Blue » Sun Oct 07, 2018 3:01 pm

“ SURELY SURELY ITS A MUST “

Win for Cardiff City v Fulham a week on Saturday at home, No ifs or buts, no accepting a hard fought draw , no saying we played well but only just lost, I would rather say Fulham were the better team, but we got the 3pts :thumbright: :bluebird:

We can’t afford the gap to get any bigger or lose our battling performances, We need 3pts end off as the players heads and the fans hearts will sink if we lose or draw again in my opinion.

Our fans deserve at least a small bit of success, a win would build confidence and keep us on a high in the stadium :bluebird:
Anyone disagree?



Fulham’s result today
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“ SURELY SURELY ITS A MUST “

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Re: “‘SURELY SURELY ITS A MUST “

Postby Forever Blue » Sun Oct 07, 2018 3:03 pm

Updated :bluebird:
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Re: “ SURELY SURELY ITS A MUST “

Postby Kingyccfc » Sun Oct 07, 2018 3:08 pm

We lose. Warnock walks.
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Re: “ SURELY SURELY ITS A MUST “

Postby Hopski » Sun Oct 07, 2018 3:12 pm

I hope not
Everyone is entitled to my opinion
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Re: “ SURELY SURELY ITS A MUST “

Postby nubbsy » Sun Oct 07, 2018 3:14 pm

Kingyccfc wrote:We lose. Warnock walks.



Mate not being funny who else is going to make a difference?

The problem lies in our team and the lack of quality and lack of depth not in our manager.
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Re: “ SURELY SURELY ITS A MUST “

Postby Kingyccfc » Sun Oct 07, 2018 3:35 pm

nubbsy wrote:
Kingyccfc wrote:We lose. Warnock walks.



Mate not being funny who else is going to make a difference?

The problem lies in our team and the lack of quality and lack of depth not in our manager.


No idea mate,Just think his time is up. It's up to the board and owner to get things right. I want to be wrong and Warnock to turn it around but I can't see it. It comes to something when Annis posts his op about 3 pts being the only thing good enough. It's mid October and we have must win games.
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Re: “‘SURELY SURELY ITS A MUST “

Postby lincoln blue » Sun Oct 07, 2018 4:30 pm

Forever Blue wrote:Updated :bluebird:

On the positive side, there is NO match next Saturday, breathing space for all concerned?
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Re: “ SURELY SURELY ITS A MUST “

Postby Wayne S » Sun Oct 07, 2018 4:31 pm

Kingyccfc wrote:We lose. Warnock walks.


Warnock stays until at least June 2020.

Ya bunch a big time Charlie's.
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Re: “ SURELY SURELY ITS A MUST “

Postby montyblue » Sun Oct 07, 2018 4:39 pm

The fulham manager should be under more pressure than our neil at least we gave arsenal a game 2 3 fulham loosing at home 1 5 and have spent 100 million plus i cannot believe people saying its Neil's last we have played the top 5 after Liverpool and i am sure we will improve and get our wins and who do the f..k do you think could do a better job than neil the team have a good relationship with neil and we did this last time around panicking and ended up with a rookie ogs, lets see how we go see what comes in january with some recruits.
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Re: “ SURELY SURELY ITS A MUST “

Postby Plymuff Bloobird » Sun Oct 07, 2018 4:43 pm

Obviously a win would be a massive boost especially with Liverpool up afterwards,but I wouldn't label a game must win in October.
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Re: “ SURELY SURELY ITS A MUST “

Postby Kingyccfc » Sun Oct 07, 2018 5:38 pm

montyblue wrote:The fulham manager should be under more pressure than our neil at least we gave arsenal a game 2 3 fulham loosing at home 1 5 and have spent 100 million plus i cannot believe people saying its Neil's last we have played the top 5 after Liverpool and i am sure we will improve and get our wins and who do the f..k do you think could do a better job than neil the team have a good relationship with neil and we did this last time around panicking and ended up with a rookie ogs, lets see how we go see what comes in january with some recruits.


It's not up to fans to recruit managers it's up to boards, owners and agents to make these hard decisions. We didn't really panick last time, Malky messed up big time with his antics. This time the industry has changed and the current incumbent is out of his depth. No backing hasn't helped him much. He needs that first win to stay in a job. If he doesn't get it against Fulham then will be the time to act.
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Re: “ SURELY SURELY ITS A MUST “

Postby soldierblue1880 » Sun Oct 07, 2018 6:36 pm

nubbsy wrote:
Kingyccfc wrote:We lose. Warnock walks.



Mate not being funny who else is going to make a difference?

The problem lies in our team and the lack of quality and lack of depth not in our manager.

Not being funny mate but who is ultimately responsible for the quality and the depth of our squad,yes that's right Warnock!!
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Re: “ SURELY SURELY ITS A MUST “

Postby ealing_ayatollah » Sun Oct 07, 2018 7:12 pm

Kingyccfc wrote:We lose. Warnock walks.

We win. We go above Fulham despite them spending four times as mch as us and Jokanović walks then i guess...
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Re: “ SURELY SURELY ITS A MUST “

Postby City Slicker » Sun Oct 07, 2018 7:17 pm

soldierblue1880 wrote:
nubbsy wrote:
Kingyccfc wrote:We lose. Warnock walks.



Mate not being funny who else is going to make a difference?

The problem lies in our team and the lack of quality and lack of depth not in our manager.

Not being funny mate but who is ultimately responsible for the quality and the depth of our squad,yes that's right Warnock!!


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Re: “ SURELY SURELY ITS A MUST “

Postby BlueMoon1974 » Sun Oct 07, 2018 7:29 pm

Plastics want sexy big name managers
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Re: “ SURELY SURELY ITS A MUST “

Postby 2blue2handle » Sun Oct 07, 2018 7:30 pm

It's a massive massive game no doubt about it.

I think must win is used to often and to inaccurately, no game at this point in the season is must win.
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Re: “ SURELY SURELY ITS A MUST “

Postby Kingyccfc » Sun Oct 07, 2018 7:39 pm

ealing_ayatollah wrote:
Kingyccfc wrote:We lose. Warnock walks.

We win. We go above Fulham despite them spending four times as mch as us and Jokanović walks then i guess...


Maybe, that’s their problem
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Re: “ SURELY SURELY ITS A MUST “

Postby snoopystorm » Sun Oct 07, 2018 11:32 pm

Looking back over the last few seasons and Fulham seem to be the team we struggle against, mostly ending in a hard fought draw.

Hopefully Gunners is fit when he comes back from international duty to give NW more options in midfield especially since we won’t have Ralls.
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Re: “ SURELY SURELY ITS A MUST “

Postby SirJimmySchoular » Mon Oct 08, 2018 1:03 am

Forever Blue wrote:“ SURELY SURELY ITS A MUST “

Win for Cardiff City v Fulham a week on Saturday at home, No ifs or buts, no accepting a hard fought draw , no saying we played well but only just lost, I would rather say Fulham were the better team, but we got the 3pts :thumbright: :bluebird:

We can’t afford the gap to get any bigger or lose our battling performances, We need 3pts end off as the players heads and the fans hearts will sink if we lose or draw again in my opinion.

Our fans deserve at least a small bit of success, a win would build confidence and keep us on a high in the stadium :bluebird:
Anyone disagree?



Fulham’s result today


Yeah, I disagree quite strongly actually.
That sort of talk doesn't do anything but build pressure on the boys . It doesn't make any positive difference to the outcome, which will be whatever it will be. I don't think anyone's unaware that the opportunities are gradually getting smaller , but that's not dependant on one particular result.
They must approach each game in the knowledge that they must improve again form the last and intending to win and providing they continue to improve I think they'll start winning enough games to eventually finish mid table. The most likely thing to bugger that up is the endlessly building pressure and the danger of becoming psychologically overwhelmed by expectation.

There's so much unhelpful comment and target setting, ( quicker and more scathing than I've ever seen it in any other club actually), that Sir Neil will soon be at the stage of having to convince the players to ignore what supporters are saying in the hope that they'll be able to shut it out and continue to perform. That's the edge of a real collapse, by the way.

Think about it - if you were a player, how totally committed could you be to fans who repeatedly belittle your efforts ?
The recent success of this club has been far more about a sense of unity and players putting in 110% for the supporters and the city than spectacular skills, and the potential downfall might be the reverse of that if we're not very very careful.

They know they need to start winning some games I expect , so let's not issuing them with ultimatums. Their heads are really not going to be in the best place for this game if they're being told it's their last chance and, given the fact that they've been trying their very very best for the fans so far , well it'd only be human for them to get subconsciously angry with them if they're constantly belittling the players and managers.

Loyalty breeds loyalty ,and loyalty earns commitment, but like all equations , the opposite is also true. The fans can add something to the performance if they conduct themselves in one way or totally demotivate the team if they offer support with conditions and strings attached.

Of course I'm not suggesting that your comments are disloyal or destructive - that's aimed at some others. I am saying though that talk of " must win" games, however well intentioned, can have the same nett effect.
Col Travis famously told his men at the Alamo that the two alternatives were "death or glory", and we know how well that went. On the other hand, Churchill's message that we should "fight them on the beaches, fight them in the streets and never surrender", even after Dunkirk , was a wiser strategy , expressing as it did a complete faith in the British forces and people to prevail in the end and not be halted in that intention by serious setbacks. Of course that faith and confidence inspired everyone to find hidden reserves when it was needed.

In short, let's send those boys out determined to win, NOT frightened to lose !
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Re: “ SURELY SURELY ITS A MUST “

Postby TheHangedMan » Mon Oct 08, 2018 3:28 am

SirJimmySchoular wrote:
Forever Blue wrote:“ SURELY SURELY ITS A MUST “

Win for Cardiff City v Fulham a week on Saturday at home, No ifs or buts, no accepting a hard fought draw , no saying we played well but only just lost, I would rather say Fulham were the better team, but we got the 3pts :thumbright: :bluebird:

We can’t afford the gap to get any bigger or lose our battling performances, We need 3pts end off as the players heads and the fans hearts will sink if we lose or draw again in my opinion.

Our fans deserve at least a small bit of success, a win would build confidence and keep us on a high in the stadium :bluebird:
Anyone disagree?



Fulham’s result today


Yeah, I disagree quite strongly actually.
That sort of talk doesn't do anything but build pressure on the boys . It doesn't make any positive difference to the outcome, which will be whatever it will be. I don't think anyone's unaware that the opportunities are gradually getting smaller , but that's not dependant on one particular result.
They must approach each game in the knowledge that they must improve again form the last and intending to win and providing they continue to improve I think they'll start winning enough games to eventually finish mid table. The most likely thing to bugger that up is the endlessly building pressure and the danger of becoming psychologically overwhelmed by expectation.

There's so much unhelpful comment and target setting, ( quicker and more scathing than I've ever seen it in any other club actually), that Sir Neil will soon be at the stage of having to convince the players to ignore what supporters are saying in the hope that they'll be able to shut it out and continue to perform. That's the edge of a real collapse, by the way.

Think about it - if you were a player, how totally committed could you be to fans who repeatedly belittle your efforts ?
The recent success of this club has been far more about a sense of unity and players putting in 110% for the supporters and the city than spectacular skills, and the potential downfall might be the reverse of that if we're not very very careful.

They know they need to start winning some games I expect , so let's not issuing them with ultimatums. Their heads are really not going to be in the best place for this game if they're being told it's their last chance and, given the fact that they've been trying their very very best for the fans so far , well it'd only be human for them to get subconsciously angry with them if they're constantly belittling the players and managers.

Loyalty breeds loyalty ,and loyalty earns commitment, but like all equations , the opposite is also true. The fans can add something to the performance if they conduct themselves in one way or totally demotivate the team if they offer support with conditions and strings attached.

Of course I'm not suggesting that your comments are disloyal or destructive - that's aimed at some others. I am saying though that talk of " must win" games, however well intentioned, can have the same nett effect.
Col Travis famously told his men at the Alamo that the two alternatives were "death or glory", and we know how well that went. On the other hand, Churchill's message that we should "fight them on the beaches, fight them in the streets and never surrender", even after Dunkirk , was a wiser strategy , expressing as it did a complete faith in the British forces and people to prevail in the end and not be halted in that intention by serious setbacks. Of course that faith and confidence inspired everyone to find hidden reserves when it was needed.

In short, let's send those boys out determined to win, NOT frightened to lose !

For anyone who couldn't be bothered to read all of SJS's post.........you should, the guy is talking a lot of sense. :thumbup:

But coming back to the OP, and the question of "Surely Surely it's a must".....anyone disagree? I disagree.

A must win only comes at the back end of a season, when it's a mathematical certainty that a win gets you promoted, or a defeat sends you down. We are nowhere near that yet so now is not the time to panic. Obviously every true City fan on this board is craving for our 1st win. me included, and Fulham looks like an opportunity not to be missed.

But football is a funny old game and what will be will be. As long as Warnock is at the helm I will never stop believing in this team. Our points to date don't reflect what we have deserved IMO, but over a full season the luck will even out.

Annis, you more than most know what it's like to be in the dungeon, with a real fear of dropping out of the football league. So to be in the position we are now is incredible. I can't remember unity from so many. It was easy for us to be unified when we had crowds of 3 to 4,000, but to have the unity of 20,000 plus is a feat in itself.

I have faith in this team, and I have even more faith in our Manager. Come what may against Fulham.......but whatever the result there is one thing I know.......we will never surrender. :bluebird:
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Re: “ SURELY SURELY ITS A MUST “

Postby TopCat CCFC » Mon Oct 08, 2018 9:32 am

I thought the Burnley game was a Must Win game at the time .
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Re: “ SURELY SURELY ITS A MUST “

Postby pembroke allan » Mon Oct 08, 2018 10:17 am

Bit early for must win but it will do our confidence a great boost to do so ! Prefer wait end Nov to get to that stage as lot of points that can be won up to then. :old:
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Re: “ SURELY SURELY ITS A MUST “

Postby bluebird58 » Mon Oct 08, 2018 10:38 am

Any team from 12th downwards are capable of relegation. I'd probably add Watford to that list who got lucky in a couple of games early season and are capable of going months without a win (as is any team in the bottom half of the table).

If I was a betting man (and I am), then I'd say that we are probably going to be in the bottom 3 at the end of the season. But it's not a foregone conclusion as some people seem to think.

As for Warnock, there is no point in getting rid of him at the moment. If we do get relegated, then we need him to get us back up again.There are two occasions when I see the need for Warnock to go :-

1. If we stay up this season, then Warnock should stand down and let a new man come into hopefully move us forward.
2. If we get relegated, then Warnock should go at the end of next season , whether he gets us promoted again or not.
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Re: “ SURELY SURELY ITS A MUST “

Postby TERRYB » Mon Oct 08, 2018 10:51 am

SirJimmySchoular wrote:
Forever Blue wrote:“ SURELY SURELY ITS A MUST “

Win for Cardiff City v Fulham a week on Saturday at home, No ifs or buts, no accepting a hard fought draw , no saying we played well but only just lost, I would rather say Fulham were the better team, but we got the 3pts :thumbright: :bluebird:

We can’t afford the gap to get any bigger or lose our battling performances, We need 3pts end off as the players heads and the fans hearts will sink if we lose or draw again in my opinion.

Our fans deserve at least a small bit of success, a win would build confidence and keep us on a high in the stadium :bluebird:
Anyone disagree?



Fulham’s result today


Yeah, I disagree quite strongly actually.
That sort of talk doesn't do anything but build pressure on the boys . It doesn't make any positive difference to the outcome, which will be whatever it will be. I don't think anyone's unaware that the opportunities are gradually getting smaller , but that's not dependant on one particular result.
They must approach each game in the knowledge that they must improve again form the last and intending to win and providing they continue to improve I think they'll start winning enough games to eventually finish mid table. The most likely thing to bugger that up is the endlessly building pressure and the danger of becoming psychologically overwhelmed by expectation.

There's so much unhelpful comment and target setting, ( quicker and more scathing than I've ever seen it in any other club actually), that Sir Neil will soon be at the stage of having to convince the players to ignore what supporters are saying in the hope that they'll be able to shut it out and continue to perform. That's the edge of a real collapse, by the way.

Think about it - if you were a player, how totally committed could you be to fans who repeatedly belittle your efforts ?
The recent success of this club has been far more about a sense of unity and players putting in 110% for the supporters and the city than spectacular skills, and the potential downfall might be the reverse of that if we're not very very careful.

They know they need to start winning some games I expect , so let's not issuing them with ultimatums. Their heads are really not going to be in the best place for this game if they're being told it's their last chance and, given the fact that they've been trying their very very best for the fans so far , well it'd only be human for them to get subconsciously angry with them if they're constantly belittling the players and managers.

Loyalty breeds loyalty ,and loyalty earns commitment, but like all equations , the opposite is also true. The fans can add something to the performance if they conduct themselves in one way or totally demotivate the team if they offer support with conditions and strings attached.

Of course I'm not suggesting that your comments are disloyal or destructive - that's aimed at some others. I am saying though that talk of " must win" games, however well intentioned, can have the same nett effect.
Col Travis famously told his men at the Alamo that the two alternatives were "death or glory", and we know how well that went. On the other hand, Churchill's message that we should "fight them on the beaches, fight them in the streets and never surrender", even after Dunkirk , was a wiser strategy , expressing as it did a complete faith in the British forces and people to prevail in the end and not be halted in that intention by serious setbacks. Of course that faith and confidence inspired everyone to find hidden reserves when it was needed.

In short, let's send those boys out determined to win, NOT frightened to lose !


The biggest weapon in our armoury is the unbelievable passion, noise and support that this team has received and will continue to get no matter what. Our support home and away has been bloody magnificent and even if we do end up going down it won't be without a fight and I would rather be a proud Bluebird with our phenomenal fans than follow any other team. :bluescarf:
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Re: “ SURELY SURELY ITS A MUST “

Postby SirJimmySchoular » Mon Oct 08, 2018 12:21 pm

That's the spirit !
So pleased to see these last few comments. Let's INTEND to do this and not be daunted by setbacks.
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Re: “ SURELY SURELY ITS A MUST “

Postby OriginalGrangeEndBlue » Tue Oct 09, 2018 8:48 am

It’s a must win game for me. Doesn’t have to be the last game of the season for this to be the case.
We lose, we’re 6 points adrift and with Liverpool away next then the gap will probably get even bigger.
The most IMPORTANT thing is not to get cut adrift this early in the season as we may not be able to claw things back as we’ll need to win a few games to do this and that’s looking almost impossible at the moment.
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Re: “ SURELY SURELY ITS A MUST “

Postby SirJimmySchoular » Tue Oct 09, 2018 9:09 am

OriginalGrangeEndBlue wrote:It’s a must win game for me. Doesn’t have to be the last game of the season for this to be the case.
We lose, we’re 6 points adrift and with Liverpool away next then the gap will probably get even bigger.
The most IMPORTANT thing is not to get cut adrift this early in the season as we may not be able to claw things back as we’ll need to win a few games to do this and that’s looking almost impossible at the moment.


I agree that in the mental state of desperate panic you recommend it would certainly be impossible, and that's why we must remain calm.
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Re: “ SURELY SURELY ITS A MUST “

Postby nubbsy » Tue Oct 09, 2018 1:54 pm

soldierblue1880 wrote:
nubbsy wrote:
Kingyccfc wrote:We lose. Warnock walks.



Mate not being funny who else is going to make a difference?

The problem lies in our team and the lack of quality and lack of depth not in our manager.

Not being funny mate but who is ultimately responsible for the quality and the depth of our squad,yes that's right Warnock!!



I'd give you a balanced answer if I didn't think you were a troll
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Re: “ SURELY SURELY ITS A MUST “

Postby TheHangedMan » Tue Oct 09, 2018 3:38 pm

nubbsy wrote:
soldierblue1880 wrote:
nubbsy wrote:
Kingyccfc wrote:We lose. Warnock walks.



Mate not being funny who else is going to make a difference?

The problem lies in our team and the lack of quality and lack of depth not in our manager.

Not being funny mate but who is ultimately responsible for the quality and the depth of our squad,yes that's right Warnock!!



I'd give you a balanced answer if I didn't think you were a troll

:thumbup:
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Re: “ SURELY SURELY ITS A MUST “

Postby OriginalGrangeEndBlue » Tue Oct 09, 2018 4:52 pm

TheHangedMan wrote:
nubbsy wrote:
soldierblue1880 wrote:
nubbsy wrote:
Kingyccfc wrote:We lose. Warnock walks.



Mate not being funny who else is going to make a difference?

The problem lies in our team and the lack of quality and lack of depth not in our manager.

Not being funny mate but who is ultimately responsible for the quality and the depth of our squad,yes that's right Warnock!!



I'd give you a balanced answer if I didn't think you were a troll

:thumbup:


:laughing6:
Great answer.
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