Peoples Vote/Second Referendum?

If the people want Brexit then what is there to fear about a 2nd referendum?

If i play roulette and put £500 on black i cant then when i lose say oh i meant red

Why would anyone want close ties with the French and Germans...they’re extremely odd people.

Serious question. The remain campaign repeatedly say we as leave voters were conned. What precisely were we conned over? I voted to leave the political European Union. Is that not possible? Why not? Because our politicians are incompetent? That doesnt make it impossible. It makes it clear that decades of passing off powers to Europe have given us poor representatives. Maybe if some of them had proper jobs first rather than PPE degrees from metropolitan universities they may be more prepared.

Numbers on sides of busses? First I didn't vote for that. I voted to regain sovereignty from the European parliament and council. Second. What does they have to do with wanting to leave a political union?

Some on the remain side. Please explain to me why wanting to leave a political union that we have only recently been shoe horned in to is a bad thing?

For my view you could check out the libertarian party perspective who sum it up well.

P.s. can we have a second referendum to scrap the Welsh assembly? I didn't get the result I wanted the first time around.

The truth is we voted 'out' in its simplest form and that is what needs to be delivered

The question was a simple one (see below) and they now need to honour the will of the people. A second Referendum would be abhorrent and an affront to democracy

Some say we are more informed now but that isn't the case. We still don't 'know' the facts of what is to come, as the real negotiation is still to be carried out. There are currently no promises, no guarantees and no consensus amongst either party in both the UK and in the EU

The people (by the simple and democratic majority vote required) made a decision and it's time to honour it...

In one sense your correct of course but the wording of that ballot paper is to blame in my view.Not only that but everyone on this thread seems to be ignoring the fact that no deal whatsoever can be done without taking account of the Good Friday agreement,something that was not considered when drawing up the wording of this ballot paper.I would like to see what plans Boris,JRM and the other hard line brexiteers have for this problem because a boarder of any kind contravenes the law as set out in the GFA.

Several times technology has been suggested as a solution to the Northern Ireland border but the EU reject this because they believe the technology doesn't exist. That might be true now but if technology can be developed to send spaceships and lander's to Mars then surely it can be developed for customs checks at the Ulster border?

Also JRM/Boris etc. have always said they have no intention of erecting a hard border between North/South Ireland it is the EU which wants a hard border to 'protect the integrity of the single market'

Therefore if we leave with a no deal and the a hard border appears in Ireland then it would be due to the EU and they would be the ones guilty of breaking the Belfast Agreement

Well if the EU were bound by the GF agreement you may have a point.

So basically. In order to maintain the good Friday agreement within one island between northern Ireland and the Republic. We as a united kingdom must stay in a political union with 27 other countries. None of which occupy the same land mass as either great Britain, northern Ireland or the Republic?

My view. We were asked to vote on a)leave the EU or b) stay in it.

The result was to leave. It was not to negotiate a deal. It was to leave.

There was no shade of brexit. There was no hard or soft. It was leave.

Deals got manouvered in after. Fine. I understand the logic.

I find the proposal of another referendum offensive especially when leave voters are branded ignorant. Racist. Stupid. Various adjectives. It feels like "vote again until you get it right".

The only referendum I would be happy with us to vote on Mays deal. Or leave without one. That's the only way past the impasse. Parliament has already voted to leave and the people have voted to leave. So we should leave.

If you want to remain then campaign to go back in by all means. But allow those that voted to leave the chance to make the best of being out.

I didn't see all this fuss when parliament took us further and further in to the EU....

Absolutely spot on

Now that cretin corbyn is putting forward a vote of no confidence in may! Not for political reason but personal ones? Wtf haven't mp's got more to think about than a meaningless witch hunt that will make no difference to situation with brexit and people trust him to do right things in power....

We voted out and now the establishment is screwing those who did so. We have had a people's vote. We voted out to take back control from fat unelected bureaucrats. This is exactly what they did to the Irish. Keep up the balloting until you get the answer you want. Dead right when someone earlier on this post talked about the powerful getting their way. Who cares what we think there ?

There’s one of the lies “unelected bureaucrats”. What do the European elections do? They elect politicians. People are too bone idle to use Wikipedia

The only referendum I would be happy with us to vote on Mays deal. Or leave without one. That's the only way past the impasse. Parliament has already voted to leave and the people have voted to leave. So we should leave.

My thoughts exactly. Very well put

We voted out and now the establishment is screwing those who did so. We have had a people's vote. We voted out to take back control from fat unelected bureaucrats. This is exactly what they did to the Irish. Keep up the balloting until you get the answer you want. Dead right when someone earlier on this post talked about the powerful getting their way. Who cares what we think there ?

There’s one of the lies “unelected bureaucrats”. What do the European elections do? They elect politicians. People are too bone idle to use Wikipedia

I would'nt believe everything you read on there. You can write or edit an article on there yourself if you want. I have seen some stuff on there that is about as accurate as a Sun newspaper article. Have to admit, I don't think I have used it to read about Brexit though, and have no idea what it says about the EU so not going to disagree with you on that. Still worth remembering, the Remain campaign were full of lies as well, as I mentioned previously on this thread.

We voted out and now the establishment is screwing those who did so. We have had a people's vote. We voted out to take back control from fat unelected bureaucrats. This is exactly what they did to the Irish. Keep up the balloting until you get the answer you want. Dead right when someone earlier on this post talked about the powerful getting their way. Who cares what we think there ?

There’s one of the lies “unelected bureaucrats”. What do the European elections do? They elect politicians. People are too bone idle to use Wikipedia

bloody hell

Now that cretin corbyn is putting forward a vote of no confidence in may! Not for political reason but personal ones? Wtf haven't mp's got more to think about than a meaningless witch hunt that will make no difference to situation with brexit and people trust him to do right things in power....

what a f*cking nerve...his own MPs have actually voted no confidence in him...

Unelected burocrats of the EU.

Well Donald tusk. Junker. 2 names regularly in the media and drivers of the European line. Neither have been elected.

The council directs policy for the parliament to vote on but all they can do it make amendments. The council is appointed not elected. Therefore there is a significant democratic deficiency in my opinion.

I hear comments such as "yes its not perfect but we should change it from within".

It was set up that way! Why would they want to change it when it's by design?

Now that cretin corbyn is putting forward a vote of no confidence in may! Not for political reason but personal ones? Wtf haven't mp's got more to think about than a meaningless witch hunt that will make no difference to situation with brexit and people trust him to do right things in power....

what a f*cking nerve...his own MPs have actually voted no confidence in him...

Pathetic man and people think mps act in their best intetests over brexit? It's total self Interest trying to get politcal points instead of working together to get best deal on leaving

We voted out and now the establishment is screwing those who did so. We have had a people's vote. We voted out to take back control from fat unelected bureaucrats. This is exactly what they did to the Irish. Keep up the balloting until you get the answer you want. Dead right when someone earlier on this post talked about the powerful getting their way. Who cares what we think there ?

There’s one of the lies “unelected bureaucrats”. What do the European elections do? They elect politicians. People are too bone idle to use Wikipedia

bloody hell

And what's in Wikipedia is totally the truth?

We voted out and now the establishment is screwing those who did so. We have had a people's vote. We voted out to take back control from fat unelected bureaucrats. This is exactly what they did to the Irish. Keep up the balloting until you get the answer you want. Dead right when someone earlier on this post talked about the powerful getting their way. Who cares what we think there ?

There’s one of the lies “unelected bureaucrats”. What do the European elections do? They elect politicians. People are too bone idle to use Wikipedia

the big lie or con is how inch by inch we became part of the EU..

Hilarius and pretty much sums it all up...

https://www.thepoke.co.uk/2018/12/18/jo ... o-Cvs4rMLw

When exactly did leave campaigners promise we could leave with all the benefits of remaining? That's another lie trotted out by people wishing to muddy the water. We were not told any of the sort. We were told we should have a strong hand for negotiation of trade deals. But that was never a promise. We actually do have a strong hand ... When dealing with anyone in normal circumstances. But the EU would rather damage themselves than risk a compromise to the project. They may come around. Who knows. But don't lose sight of the actual reality that leave voters voted this way to escape political union. To stop being issued regulation and dictats etc

Interested in hearing other peoples opinion on this? Seems a lot of politicians and the mainstream media are pushing for this big time now as theresa mays deal looks unlikely going through parliament.

For me it was be an absolout insult to the british people and i think it would be basically living under dictatorship and not a democracy. Would it spark outrage and riots from the people if this happened? Rioting against a dictatorship government who have conned the people would be what is needed and would be great imo. Opinions?

It's not a game of best of 3! We did the vote, even if we did another one and the result was remain it would be 1-1 and people would call for a 3rd. We did the vote over 2 years ago now get on with it!

In the event of a leave vote, an emergency budget would be needed within weeks to save the British economy from total collapse. Unemployment would soar, the stock market would plummet, and the pound collapse. The lies did not come from just one side. Had we voted remain, the leavers would be saying we were conned when they found all the above to be completely false.

Source

The U.K.'s exit from the European Union has already cost the U.K. a chunk of its economic output, according to the latest analysis by economists at UBS.
"U.K. gross domestic product (GDP) is already 2.1 percent lower in level terms than where it would have been without Brexit," UBS economists said.
"Investment is 4 percent weaker, inflation 1.5 percent higher, consumption is 1.7 percent lower and the REER (the real effective exchange rate) is 12 percent more depreciated," the report added.

Nothing has changed yet we are still in the EU - this decline is just as a result of the vote"

I don't see why I should have to pay for reckless ideologies of the Extreme Brexiteers.

It is the likes of you and me that will pay the price while Jacob Rees-Mogg just relocates his business to Ireland and if it goes tits up then he can always fall back on the £150+ million he has in the bank.

There will be a big dividend for voting remain in a second referendum. It is just a pity that we will not be able to re-coup the £2 billion already spent in lawyers negotiating the current lame duck deal brought about to appease the the lunatic right of the Tory party.

The question was a simple one (see below) and they now need to honour the will of the people. A second Referendum would be abhorrent and an affront to democracy

In 1707 UK Parliament created as a representative

In the past 311 years there have been 3 UK wide referendums all of them in the last 43 years.

1975 Join EU
2011 Proportional Representation
2016 Leave EU

Referendums have not been a part of our Constitution until very recently.

The 2016 Referendum was advisory and non-binding.

If you are so concerned that the people should be heard then surely you would welcome asking them again? Or maybe you think they will will not be so gullible next time?

At the time of the referendum only 25% of MP's supported an exit from the EU so its no surprise that given the opportunity to ride roughshod over the public vote they're doing exactly that.

At the time of the referendum only 25% of MP's supported an exit from the EU so its no surprise that given the opportunity to ride roughshod over the public vote they're doing exactly that.

Why would anyone want close ties with the French and Germans...they’re extremely odd people.

Google World War I and World War II and then come back and apologise.

The council is appointed not elected. Therefore there is a significant democratic deficiency in my opinion.

The UK Cabinet is appointed not elected!

The council is appointed not elected. Therefore there is a significant democratic deficiency in my opinion.

The UK Cabinet is appointed not elected!

After being elected.....

In the event of a leave vote, an emergency budget would be needed within weeks to save the British economy from total collapse. Unemployment would soar, the stock market would plummet, and the pound collapse. The lies did not come from just one side. Had we voted remain, the leavers would be saying we were conned when they found all the above to be completely false.

Source

The U.K.'s exit from the European Union has already cost the U.K. a chunk of its economic output, according to the latest analysis by economists at UBS.
"U.K. gross domestic product (GDP) is already 2.1 percent lower in level terms than where it would have been without Brexit," UBS economists said.
"Investment is 4 percent weaker, inflation 1.5 percent higher, consumption is 1.7 percent lower and the REER (the real effective exchange rate) is 12 percent more depreciated," the report added.

Nothing has changed yet we are still in the EU - this decline is just as a result of the vote"

I don't see why I should have to pay for reckless ideologies of the Extreme Brexiteers.

It is the likes of you and me that will pay the price while Jacob Rees-Mogg just relocates his business to Ireland and if it goes tits up then he can always fall back on the £150+ million he has in the bank.

There will be a big dividend for voting remain in a second referendum. It is just a pity that we will not be able to re-coup the £2 billion already spent in lawyers negotiating the current lame duck deal brought about to appease the the lunatic right of the Tory party.

You still have not really addressed my points. When did we have the essential emergency budget to save our economy? When did our unemployment rate soar because we voted to leave. How is it our inflation is down to the vote, yet other EU countries have also experienced similar problems. Certain countries were virtually bankrupt despite not even holding referendums to leave the EU. Seems to me as ever since we had the vote, every little change in our economic situation is blamed on that vote. This country has experienced soaring unemployment, high interest rates, high inflation and a weak pound many times in it's history, it's just convenient to lump all the blame on the referendum now. Before the vote every problem was often globally linked, eg banking crisis, since the vote every problem is directly linked to it. I'm surprised climate change is not linked to the referendum.

You still have not really addressed my points. When did we have the essential emergency budget to save our economy? When did our unemployment rate soar because we voted to leave. How is it our inflation is down to the vote, yet other EU countries have also experienced similar problems. Certain countries were virtually bankrupt despite not even holding referendums to leave the EU. Seems to me as ever since we had the vote, every little change in our economic situation is blamed on that vote. This country has experienced soaring unemployment, high interest rates, high inflation and a weak pound many times in it's history, it's just convenient to lump all the blame on the referendum now. Before the vote every problem was often globally linked, eg banking crisis, since the vote every problem is directly linked to it. I'm surprised climate change is not linked to the referendum.

These were projections based on a benchmark of voting Remain.

With the exception of unemployment they were, to varying degrees reasonable, source: Financial Times. These figure are relative performance to previous years and to similar economies that did not have a Brexit effect.

Your Global warming argument is not very well thought out. Global Issues effect all countries broadly equally, Brexit Issues can be identified as the difference in performance in our economy and those that did not have a referendum or periods before the referendum.

After being elected.....

We Elect a Government. The Government appoints ministers.

We Elect a Government. The Government appoints ministers to the EU Council.

Please think before you post.