Peoples Vote/Second Referendum?

Why would anyone want close ties with the French and Germans...they’re extremely odd people.

Google World War I and World War II and then come back and apologise.

I thought most of the countries involved did so by honouring pacts/treaties .

but maybe your mate google { who you seem to constantly talk too } knows better.
the germans not being odd people during WW1 and WW2 is deffinately a bit adrift of conventional thought..maybe you can draw up a list of reasons for their actions being reasonable ? or even copy and paste one.

The question was a simple one (see below) and they now need to honour the will of the people. A second Referendum would be abhorrent and an affront to democracy

In 1707 UK Parliament created as a representative

In the past 311 years there have been 3 UK wide referendums all of them in the last 43 years.

1975 Join EU
2011 Proportional Representation
2016 Leave EU

Referendums have not been a part of our Constitution until very recently.

The 2016 Referendum was advisory and non-binding.

If you are so concerned that the people should be heard then surely you would welcome asking them again? Or maybe you think they will will not be so gullible next time?

the 1975 vote which was to join the Common Market not this EU was also advisory and not legally binding..

You still have not really addressed my points. When did we have the essential emergency budget to save our economy? When did our unemployment rate soar because we voted to leave. How is it our inflation is down to the vote, yet other EU countries have also experienced similar problems. Certain countries were virtually bankrupt despite not even holding referendums to leave the EU. Seems to me as ever since we had the vote, every little change in our economic situation is blamed on that vote. This country has experienced soaring unemployment, high interest rates, high inflation and a weak pound many times in it's history, it's just convenient to lump all the blame on the referendum now. Before the vote every problem was often globally linked, eg banking crisis, since the vote every problem is directly linked to it. I'm surprised climate change is not linked to the referendum.

These were projections based on a benchmark of voting Remain.

With the exception of unemployment they were, to varying degrees reasonable, source: Financial Times. These figure are relative performance to previous years and to similar economies that did not have a Brexit effect.

Your Global warming argument is not very well thought out. Global Issues effect all countries broadly equally, Brexit Issues can be identified as the difference in performance in our economy and those that did not have a referendum or periods before the referendum.

Most of the predictions about our economy have failed to materialise as Steve points out, you are basically saying UK financial ups and downs are the fault of voting out not the fact financial events are manipulated by people out to make money on thr brexit vote..we are at present
Seeing remain scare mongerers saying various things to make people think we will go bankrupt or similar when brexit comes about! The only people likely to go bankrupt is greece,spain,italy and several other countries that rely on richer places like uk to prop up EU
Ps can see you are an expert on brexit by way you present the remain side of things

After being elected.....

We Elect a Government. The Government appoints ministers.

We Elect a Government. The Government appoints ministers to the EU Council.

Please think before you post.

Nice and patronising ending. Well done.

We elect MPs and the party with the largest number form the government. Their elected leader appoint elected MPs to serve roles.


Junker. Tusk and co are totally appointed. There is no election. Why don't you think before you post. And engage rather than patronise. You sum up why this whole thing gets ugly with the way you ended your post.

Appointing non elected officials to the highest office of the EU is not democratic. The parliament is. Buy the council is not

Thing is, half the people who voted to leave didn’t have a clue what exactly they were voting on? I know loads like this, partic old people. If you took over 65’s out of the equation the result would have been overwhelmingly to stay. Lots of people I know who voted to leave regret that now, there was very little info about, it was almost thrown on us and I’m afraid many people in the uk are clueless. A bit like the tw*t sky interviewed in Caerphilly centre the day after, he said he voted to leave what has the EU ever done for us in Caerphilly, the reporter then told him they funded the redevelopment of the town centre. He looked even more daft if possible and said oh I didn’t know that.
You realise May no doubt has all her posh friends lined up for nice trade deals don’t you? Some people are so nieve, why is she so desperate not to have another vote?

But the EU "fund" out of our money. They basically take it. Lob some off. Then say we can have a bit back as long as we spend it on what they tell us we can spend it on.

The EU does not have any of its own money.

Cut the middle man outn make the Welsh assembly earn its own money and empower it to fund local projects with local knowledge of the situation for less total cost. Or better still spend the lot without the EU taking a cut. We have politicians. Make then do the jobs they are elected to do

Thing is, half the people who voted to leave didn’t have a clue what exactly they were voting on? I know loads like this, partic old people. If you took over 65’s out of the equation the result would have been overwhelmingly to stay. Lots of people I know who voted to leave regret that now, there was very little info about, it was almost thrown on us and I’m afraid many people in the uk are clueless. A bit like the tw*t sky interviewed in Caerphilly centre the day after, he said he voted to leave what has the EU ever done for us in Caerphilly, the reporter then told him they funded the redevelopment of the town centre. He looked even more daft if possible and said oh I didn’t know that.
You realise May no doubt has all her posh friends lined up for nice trade deals don’t you? Some people are so nieve, why is she so desperate not to have another vote?

Funny that, I dont know a single person who's changed their mind which ever way they voted in the first place. If any thing they're even more polarised.

Thing is, half the people who voted to leave didn’t have a clue what exactly they were voting on? I know loads like this, partic old people. If you took over 65’s out of the equation the result would have been overwhelmingly to stay. Lots of people I know who voted to leave regret that now, there was very little info about, it was almost thrown on us and I’m afraid many people in the uk are clueless. A bit like the tw*t sky interviewed in Caerphilly centre the day after, he said he voted to leave what has the EU ever done for us in Caerphilly, the reporter then told him they funded the redevelopment of the town centre. He looked even more daft if possible and said oh I didn’t know that.
You realise May no doubt has all her posh friends lined up for nice trade deals don’t you? Some people are so nieve, why is she so desperate not to have another vote?

Read this sort of stuff so many times. Only those who chose remain had the intelligence to know what they were voting for. The majority who voted out must have been so stupid and so old perhaps they should not have been allowed to vote. Of course, those older people have lived through the entire life of the EU, and have seen for themselves the very reasons why they no longer wish to be part of it. Perhaps every future election should be re-run just in case it is only the voters who lose who really have the intelligence to understand politics.

So democracy in this country is dead, a majority voted to leave, and the minority, because they lost the vote to remain now want another referendum. So at the next election, if we do not like who wins it, we should have another election, what a load of Bol****S. If there is another referendum there should only be two choices on the ballot paper (1) accept Mays brexit deal or (2) leave with no deal No way in the world should there be any vote on remaining, the country has already decided to leave.

This is constantly referred to as the 'People's Vote'.

The people have already had their vote and the result was to leave.

This should be more appropriately known as the 'Meddling Politicians Vote'.

Crook vote !!!

The Democratic process is being subverted in our country. We had a referendum, we voted to regain control of our country, we must leave.

Yep!

The Ballot Paper was simple enough to read...

Sven I always laugh when I hear some moaning Remainer state that so and so wasn't on the ballot paper . Just how long did they want the ballot paper to be?

Their bitterness shows no limits, it seems

I am confident their reaction wouldn't have be replicated had the vote gone the other way!

Cameron thought he knew the mood of the British people; the British people gave him a bloody nose and the government had no plan for the eventuality, which left the Remoaners time to regroup but even they didn't account for the complete mess the Maybot would make of it!

Parliament doesn't want it, they insisted in a vote on it so they can try and stop it, your average re-moaner would have given up by now, this is the MP's stopping what the majority voted for !!!!

I thought most of the countries involved did so by honouring pacts/treaties .

but maybe your mate google { who you seem to constantly talk too } knows better.
the germans not being odd people during WW1 and WW2 is deffinately a bit adrift of conventional thought..maybe you can draw up a list of reasons for their actions being reasonable ? or even copy and paste one.

It is inspiring to see you try to make a relevant contribution. Keep trying and someday you will get there.

the 1975 vote which was to join the Common Market not this EU was also advisory and not legally binding..

We actually joined the EU in 1973 by a simple vote if MPs. The referendum was whether to leave and was also advisory.

When I wrote "EU Join" it was a two word reference to the referendum. I was assuming a modicum of intelligence by the reader, apologies for not taking your needs into account.

Most of the predictions about our economy have failed to materialise as Steve points out, you are basically saying UK financial ups and downs are the fault of voting out not the fact financial events are manipulated by people out to make money on thr brexit vote..we are at present

While Britain’s growth rate was among the highest for advanced economies in 2016, it slipped towards the bottom of the 2.3 per cent average of these nations last year as Europe recovered. This year the 1.6 per cent forecast growth rate is poor relative to the 2.5 per cent average in advanced economies.

I am sure both you and Steve are seen as financial geniuses in your own households by repeating crap like this. Unfortunately it doesn't stand up to scrutiny. If you don't think that Brexit has had an economic impact then you are deluding yourselves and as I have said we have not even starting negotiating the future deal yet.

quote="rumpo kid"]Why would anyone want close ties with the French and Germans...they’re extremely odd people.[/quote]

Google World War I and World War II and then come back and apologise.[/quote]

Sorry, the question was mis-leading. Should read:

Why would anyone want to be mastered by France and Germany?

In fact, its the same question. But as Steve points out, you're incapable of responding to any points raised, other than with condescension or another question.

Goats...a bit Gauleiter Corbyn mate... all those who disagree are old or thick, and must be denied a voice.....
in fact........ exterminate...

Does this include Dave, who thinks IQ and intelligence are the same thing.

Most of the predictions about our economy have failed to materialise as Steve points out, you are basically saying UK financial ups and downs are the fault of voting out not the fact financial events are manipulated by people out to make money on thr brexit vote..we are at present

While Britain’s growth rate was among the highest for advanced economies in 2016, it slipped towards the bottom of the 2.3 per cent average of these nations last year as Europe recovered. This year the 1.6 per cent forecast growth rate is poor relative to the 2.5 per cent average in advanced economies.

I am sure both you and Steve are seen as financial geniuses in your own households by repeating crap like this. Unfortunately it doesn't stand up to scrutiny. If you don't think that Brexit has had an economic impact then you are deluding yourselves and as I have said we have not even starting negotiating the future deal yet.

Why is it that that "remoaners" have to resort to insults to get their point of view across. Seems to me that debates can be run sensibly by a lot of people, but there are always a few who have to insult and attempt to belittle people with certain comments. They invariably make themselves look more stupid than those they are insulting, and refuse to accept that a lot of people can have a different point of view to theirs. Only one person on here has mentioned financial genius, everyone else has expressed a point of view. Incidentally, although I am by no means a financial genius, as some on here know, I did spend 33 years in the financial industry including being involved with the finances of CCFC for a few of those years.

Thing is, half the people who voted to leave didn’t have a clue what exactly they were voting on? I know loads like this, partic old people. If you took over 65’s out of the equation the result would have been overwhelmingly to stay. Lots of people I know who voted to leave regret that now, there was very little info about, it was almost thrown on us and I’m afraid many people in the uk are clueless. A bit like the tw*t sky interviewed in Caerphilly centre the day after, he said he voted to leave what has the EU ever done for us in Caerphilly, the reporter then told him they funded the redevelopment of the town centre. He looked even more daft if possible and said oh I didn’t know that.
You realise May no doubt has all her posh friends lined up for nice trade deals don’t you? Some people are so nieve, why is she so desperate not to have another vote?

Funny that, I dont know a single person who's changed their mind which ever way they voted in the first place. If any thing they're even more polarised.

They must just be part of the clueless 52 as they are known, most don’t even know what they were voting for ffs so how can they have an opinion? They just winge on about immigration mainly because they are old and naturally racist. The damage, if that’s what you want to call it, is done already, Blair let in anyone and everyone to try and de Tory the country. They ain’t going anywhere now so just forget it.

Thing is, half the people who voted to leave didn’t have a clue what exactly they were voting on? I know loads like this, partic old people. If you took over 65’s out of the equation the result would have been overwhelmingly to stay. Lots of people I know who voted to leave regret that now, there was very little info about, it was almost thrown on us and I’m afraid many people in the uk are clueless. A bit like the tw*t sky interviewed in Caerphilly centre the day after, he said he voted to leave what has the EU ever done for us in Caerphilly, the reporter then told him they funded the redevelopment of the town centre. He looked even more daft if possible and said oh I didn’t know that.
You realise May no doubt has all her posh friends lined up for nice trade deals don’t you? Some people are so nieve, why is she so desperate not to have another vote?

I live in Caerphilly and that sounds par for the course unfortunately. I agree with your sentiments and whilst I was never in favour of any second referendum I really cannot understand why idiotic Davy Cameron didn't implement two extremely important features:

1. Drop the voting age to 16
2. Insist that a supermajority vote of at least 66% was required to instigate any change in the status quo.

Poor old Davy, look what you've gone and done. You will forever be history's fool.

Junker. Tusk and co are totally appointed. There is no election. Why don't you think before you post. And engage rather than patronise.

The President is elected for a renewable five-year term starting five months after the elections to the European Parliament. These were brought into alignment via the Maastricht Treaty (prior to which the Commission had a four-year term of office) and the elections take place in June every five years (in years ending in 4 and 9). This alignment has led to a closer relationship between the elections and the President himself with the above-mentioned proposals for political parties running with candidates.

The President and his Commission may be removed from office by a vote of censure from Parliament. Parliament has never done this to date, however the imminence of such a vote in 1999, due to allegations of financial mismanagement, led to the Santer Commission resigning on its own accord, before the Parliamentary vote.

The President of the European Council is elected by the leaders in the Council every 2.5 years

Are you just very ill-informed and just happy to lie and hope nobody questions it?

Most of the predictions about our economy have failed to materialise as Steve points out, you are basically saying UK financial ups and downs are the fault of voting out not the fact financial events are manipulated by people out to make money on thr brexit vote..we are at present

While Britain’s growth rate was among the highest for advanced economies in 2016, it slipped towards the bottom of the 2.3 per cent average of these nations last year as Europe recovered. This year the 1.6 per cent forecast growth rate is poor relative to the 2.5 per cent average in advanced economies.

I am sure both you and Steve are seen as financial geniuses in your own households by repeating crap like this. Unfortunately it doesn't stand up to scrutiny. If you don't think that Brexit has had an economic impact then you are deluding yourselves and as I have said we have not even starting negotiating the future deal yet.

Like said an expert at EU economic so why as ftse gone up when in news it's all about no deal being more likely even the EU have set out plans for a no deal? Every man and his dog knows economic markets whatever they are go up and down depending on the world situation oil is good example ect ect,
why do the EU think it's a one way street when it comes to putting in plans for no deal, they are putting in restrictions but Don't EU countries have to export to us or are they assuming we'll just say come on EU the UK is an open border no restrictions?
Can you imagine greece/Spain manage with few bits holidaying there or wine sales from France ect ect . These countries are far more economically screwed than we will be leaving EU. You are obviously pro EU as all UK financial problems are because we want out of EU according to you....

Why is it that that "remoaners" have to resort to insults to get their point of view across.

Why is it that "Brexiteers" have to resort to insulting your intelligence to get their point across?

They lie to you and expect you to believe it.

Why is it that that "remoaners" have to resort to insults to get their point of view across.

Why is it that "Brexiteers" have to resort to insulting your intelligence to get their point across?

They lie to you and expect you to believe it.

Many people respect the fact that not everyone shares the same opinions. You however, appear to believe that anyone who dares to have a different opinion to you must be some sort of lower intelligence being. You arrogance knows no bounds, but maybe one day in the future, you will realise that not every person shares your opinion, and that you will not share the opinion of others. You do not know what will happen when we leave, and neither does anyone else. You could at least accept the fact that the millions who voted leave are not retarded just because they do not share your views.

Fat chance of that with the Stalinistas on here Steve - democracy is an inconvenience for these extremists.

Dave. Junker. Is not. Elected. By. The people! Therefore not in my opinion democratic. So keep your insults to yourself. I havent labelled you with any and won't make any snide comments.

My point is and always has been that the council is not made up of people who have stood for election by the people of Europe. The people of Europe can not vote them out.

Donald trump is elected. Macron elected. May is elected by her constituency. Jeremy Corbyn is even elected!

Donald tusk is not. Jean Claude junker is not.

Guy verhofstadt however is. And no matter how much do I disagree with his rants. At least the people he represents voted for him.

That's been my point all along.

The appointment may well be called an "election" but it's a closed shop.

Why is it that that "remoaners" have to resort to insults to get their point of view across.

Why is it that "Brexiteers" have to resort to insulting your intelligence to get their point across?

They lie to you and expect you to believe it.

Pot kettle? You are the one insulting

Why is it that that "remoaners" have to resort to insults to get their point of view across.

Why is it that "Brexiteers" have to resort to insulting your intelligence to get their point across?

They lie to you and expect you to believe it.

Pot kettle? You are the one insulting

Well obviously people are not insulting his intelligence that's for sure?

Thing is, half the people who voted to leave didn’t have a clue what exactly they were voting on? I know loads like this, partic old people. If you took over 65’s out of the equation the result would have been overwhelmingly to stay. Lots of people I know who voted to leave regret that now, there was very little info about, it was almost thrown on us and I’m afraid many people in the uk are clueless. A bit like the tw*t sky interviewed in Caerphilly centre the day after, he said he voted to leave what has the EU ever done for us in Caerphilly, the reporter then told him they funded the redevelopment of the town centre. He looked even more daft if possible and said oh I didn’t know that.
You realise May no doubt has all her posh friends lined up for nice trade deals don’t you? Some people are so nieve, why is she so desperate not to have another vote?

so you think a reporter that thinks the EU has some sort of jack and the beanstalk money tree and does not get its money from member states including ourselves was not the idiot in this tale..wow
yep there are clueless people out there..
as for May the remain..she has tried to deliver the weakest possible brexit that could still pass as brexit...which i imagine is what every remainer including yourself would want.?

the 1975 vote which was to join the Common Market not this EU was also advisory and not legally binding..

We actually joined the EU in 1973 by a simple vote if MPs. The referendum was whether to leave and was also advisory.

When I wrote "EU Join" it was a two word reference to the referendum. I was assuming a modicum of intelligence by the reader, apologies for not taking your needs into account.

so i was correct again..

I thought most of the countries involved did so by honouring pacts/treaties .

but maybe your mate google { who you seem to constantly talk too } knows better.
the germans not being odd people during WW1 and WW2 is deffinately a bit adrift of conventional thought..maybe you can draw up a list of reasons for their actions being reasonable ? or even copy and paste one.

It is inspiring to see you try to make a relevant contribution. Keep trying and someday you will get there.

so you can not back up the idiotic post then ..

I thought most of the countries involved did so by honouring pacts/treaties .

but maybe your mate google { who you seem to constantly talk too } knows better.
the germans not being odd people during WW1 and WW2 is deffinately a bit adrift of conventional thought..maybe you can draw up a list of reasons for their actions being reasonable ? or even copy and paste one.

It is inspiring to see you try to make a relevant contribution. Keep trying and someday you will get there.

so you can not back up the idiotic post then ..

This guy is sounding more and more like roathy?