Very Sensitive: Fans are asking who will pay?

SENSITIVE QUESTIONS ARE BEING ASKED.



Fans in both Nantes and Cardiff held vigils for the player on Tuesday night but one question that faces both clubs, is who will pay the transfer fee, which represents a substantial amount of money for both clubs.

Wednesday 23rd January 2019

French Media

"The transfer contract is valid as soon as it is registered with FIFA," Alexandra Cohen Jonathan, a lawyer and partner at the Paris firm August Debouzy, told AFP.

"If this is the case, in principle Cardiff must pay the 17 million to Nantes even though the player has disappeared."

According to a source close to FC Nantes, the deal had been finalised.

"The contract was signed Saturday at 5pm and approved Monday," said the source.

Broadly, big clubs take out two types of insurance to cover players.

There is liability cover, against bodily injuries suffered by players which is attributable to the employer.

Then there is 'key man' insurance, originally designed to protect businesses from the sudden loss of important members of the company, which football clubs use to cover themselves in case they lose valuable squad members. It is based on transfer values.

"Nantes had certainly signed a contract of this type, but does this contract still apply when a transfer has already been signed?" asked Cohen Jonathan. "Have Cardiff already taken out this insurance? Had it already come into effect?"

As for the liability insurance, that would only come into play "if one of the two clubs was the organiser of air transport," said Cohen Jonathan, adding that this does not seem to be the case.





Cardiff president Mehmet Dalman said on Wednesday that the club had offered to arrange Sala's trip but the attacker had opted to make "his own arrangements".


https://www.newsnow.co.uk/h/Sport/Footb ... rdiff+City

In plane accidents, the carrier is responsible for compensation but the payout is normally capped at 100,000 euros, said Cohen Jonathan.

But that cap disappears "if you prove the air carrier is at fault," the lawyer added.

"In that case, the right to compensation is complete and full, that is to say that if the damage is 17 million, we have the right to the entire sum in compensation."

The interested parties would need to prove the owner of the plane was to blame and, indeed, to establish who that is.

Shortly before take off, Sala sent relatives a desperate message saying the plane looked like it was "going to fall apart".

That message "will necessarily lead to an examination of the plane's maintenance log" to try to establish a possible fault and the responsibility of the air carrier or, in case of the failure of a component, an equipment manufacturer in case of failure of a component, said the lawyer.

"In any case, someone will have to pay 17 million euros," said Cohen Jonathan.


https://www.newsnow.co.uk/h/Sport/Footb ... rdiff+City

Mr Choo fail to insure. 3 million euro already paid. Still outstand 15 million euro must be paid Nantes FC

Cardiff Chairman here try to recover situation and find way to cover loss.

Was it a flat outright fee or a basic fee with add ons?

Is this genuine or someone making up crap. Do you have a source? Plus not all the money is due to Nantes

We pay what we owe but right now all that matters are the lives of those who were on that plane. Money is irrelevant.

I am sure the club will have a blanket policy for its players etc, however, it will come down to fault. But, until there is a body or he is presumed dead, this may drag on. At the moment he is our player, continues to be our player until we are officially told otherwise. Let’s hope the flares offer a glimmer of hope!

We pay what we owe but right now all that matters are the lives of those who were on that plane. Money is irrelevant.

I'm afraid that money will never be irrelevant in this world. This looks like something which will take years to sort out even if Sala has somehow survived.

I am sure the club will have a blanket policy for its players etc, however, it will come down to fault. But, until there is a body or he is presumed dead, this may drag on. At the moment he is our player, continues to be our player until we are officially told otherwise. Let’s hope the flares offer a glimmer of hope!

I remember there being a poster who dealt with personal injury. He would always use the same phrase "where there is blame there is a claim". On that basis you are completely right this will drag on until blame is established.

We pay what we owe but right now all that matters are the lives of those who were on that plane. Money is irrelevant.

I'm afraid that money will never be irrelevant in this world. This looks like something which will take years to sort out even if Sala has somehow survived.

everyone is guessing, including this solicitor .

nobody knows what cover either club had on Emiliano, what if anything is covered, or from or to what dates.but what ever insurance there is ,its going to take years to sort.


and with the absence of any facts re insurance ,the money debate is a bit tasteless..

It’s bound to come up and people will talk as we move forward, like it or not we still have to move forward and the burning question is bound to be where does this leave us now. No one will like to say it, but the fact it this is where we are.

Not everyone will agree and not everyone will feel it’s the right time so we just have to be respectful as fans and not get drawn into heated discussions. Difficult times are ahead but the club and fans have a game next Tuesday, we still need other signings that hasn’t changed, and of course we are all still hoping for good news, we are clutching straws of something. However the longer it goes on with no news the less likely that good news is coming.

Surely the club has some sort of insurance to cover our players, they are after all an asset if the business is sold.

Last edited by Cardiffcitymad on Thu Jan 24, 2019 9:47 am, edited 1 time in total.

I am sure the club will have a blanket policy for its players etc, however, it will come down to fault. But, until there is a body or he is presumed dead, this may drag on. At the moment he is our player, continues to be our player until we are officially told otherwise. Let’s hope the flares offer a glimmer of hope!

Agree

It’s bound to come up and people will talk as we move forward, like it or not we still have to move forward and the burning question is bound to be where does this leave us now. No one will like to say it, but the fact it this is where we are.

Not everyone will agree and not everyone will feel it’s the right time so we just have to be respectful as fans and not get drawn into heated discussions. Difficult times are ahead but the club and fans have a game next Tuesday, we still need other signings that hasn’t changed, and of course we are all still hoping for good news, we are clutching straws of something. However the longer it goes on with no news the less likely that good news is coming.

yes but it does not have to be now. nobody is getting any insurance pay out by next Tuesday that's for sure, none of us know any facts. and this young man and the pilot are still missing.

If you were injured/killed in a public transport vehicle whether it be taxi/bus/train or plane the carrier bears all responsibility for all cost, they all pay additional insurance premiums to cover passengers. If the aircraft was deemed unfit and the pilot was insured to cover passengers then responsibility lies with pilots insurers if negligent or aircraft owners if was unfit to fly. Which is why nobody is owning up to owning the aircraft.

Such an ugly conversation to be having right now

If you were injured/killed in a public transport vehicle whether it be taxi/bus/train or plane the carrier bears all responsibility for all cost, they all pay additional insurance premiums to cover passengers. If the aircraft was deemed unfit and the pilot was insured to cover passengers then responsibility lies with pilots insurers if negligent or aircraft owners if was unfit to fly. Which is why nobody is owning up to owning the aircraft.

The aircraft will be legally registered to somebody

No it will take months, years for any pay out if at all. The point is that people will talk about it, as they will about signings etc, all of which to some will appear to be distasteful but, it’s natural, we still have a relegation battle on our hands. The key to my point was to be respectful to other poster, opinions will differ, vary and we won’t all agree on when is right to discuss things.

If you were injured/killed in a public transport vehicle whether it be taxi/bus/train or plane the carrier bears all responsibility for all cost, they all pay additional insurance premiums to cover passengers. If the aircraft was deemed unfit and the pilot was insured to cover passengers then responsibility lies with pilots insurers if negligent or aircraft owners if was unfit to fly. Which is why nobody is owning up to owning the aircraft.

The aircraft will be legally registered to somebody

Apparently an offshore company .

No it will take months, years for any pay out if at all. The point is that people will talk about it, as they will about signings etc, all of which to some will appear to be distasteful but, it’s natural, we still have a relegation battle on our hands. The key to my point was to be respectful to other poster, opinions will differ, vary and we won’t all agree on when is right to discuss things.

nobody knows if money has changed hands or if so how much money between clubs.
how the deal was structured { duration of payments }
who holds insurance if there is any as he was between clubs.
what circumstances insurance might be paid..~{talking about the playing value not his life }
who paid for the flight ,if it was infact paid for { possibly a favour }
who owns the plane.
honestly do not see any debate here as no one knows a single fact..
why does anyone want a debate based on wild guesses over such a topic beats me
its nothing like debating a signing. nothing.

No it will take months, years for any pay out if at all. The point is that people will talk about it, as they will about signings etc, all of which to some will appear to be distasteful but, it’s natural, we still have a relegation battle on our hands. The key to my point was to be respectful to other poster, opinions will differ, vary and we won’t all agree on when is right to discuss things.

nobody knows if money has changed hands or if so how much money between clubs.
how the deal was structured { duration of payments }
who holds insurance if there is any as he was between clubs.
what circumstances insurance might be paid..~{talking about the playing value not his life }
who paid for the flight ,if it was infact paid for { possibly a favour }
who owns the plane.
honestly do not see any debate here as no one knows a single fact..
why does anyone want a debate based on wild guesses over such a topic beats me
its nothing like debating a signing. nothing.

I am well aware it’s not like debating a signing. The transfer saga will play out over time as and when is required. I was merely stating that when people discuss this or other matters, such as signings that for some it may be too soon, and appear to be distasteful. I am not trying to compare anything. I am respectful of people’s opinions but I am note quite sure what you are getting at.

If you were injured/killed in a public transport vehicle whether it be taxi/bus/train or plane the carrier bears all responsibility for all cost, they all pay additional insurance premiums to cover passengers. If the aircraft was deemed unfit and the pilot was insured to cover passengers then responsibility lies with pilots insurers if negligent or aircraft owners if was unfit to fly. Which is why nobody is owning up to owning the aircraft.

The aircraft will be legally registered to somebody

Apparently an offshore company .

He is not confirmed as deceased yet, so I can’t see anything happening for a long while. I hope they don’t call off the search so soon hopefully they will find something just for closure for the families involved.

If you were injured/killed in a public transport vehicle whether it be taxi/bus/train or plane the carrier bears all responsibility for all cost, they all pay additional insurance premiums to cover passengers. If the aircraft was deemed unfit and the pilot was insured to cover passengers then responsibility lies with pilots insurers if negligent or aircraft owners if was unfit to fly. Which is why nobody is owning up to owning the aircraft.

Legal entitlement to pursue a claim lies with the relatives of the deceased for the benefit of the deceased's estate.

The reality here is that CCFC would have to be able to argue it can bring a claim at law as although it "owns" or "owned"" the player, do the aircraft owners owe a duty of care to the football club.

However legal compensation for these types of common law claims would not equate to the purchase price paid for the player.

Whether there is a contractual legal entitlement is of course completely unknown as the terms of the contract and/or ownership of the player are not publicly known. It is also not known whether the club takes out insurance on its players value and even if it did, it is not known what an insurance company could raise to void a claim. It may be able to seek eg an indemnity from a third party liable for the accident assuming it was not an "act of god." So it may be a simple case of two insurance companies arguing over this.

Horrible to even think of all this but it is inevitable it will have to be dealt with.

No it will take months, years for any pay out if at all. The point is that people will talk about it, as they will about signings etc, all of which to some will appear to be distasteful but, it’s natural, we still have a relegation battle on our hands. The key to my point was to be respectful to other poster, opinions will differ, vary and we won’t all agree on when is right to discuss things.

nobody knows if money has changed hands or if so how much money between clubs.
how the deal was structured { duration of payments }
who holds insurance if there is any as he was between clubs.
what circumstances insurance might be paid..~{talking about the playing value not his life }
who paid for the flight ,if it was infact paid for { possibly a favour }
who owns the plane.
honestly do not see any debate here as no one knows a single fact..
why does anyone want a debate based on wild guesses over such a topic beats me
its nothing like debating a signing. nothing.

Good post! When it comes to this, its highly irrelevant at this point, impossible to speculate.

Cant we just let the parties involve settle any matter ?
Our 'job' is to support the team / club / each other through these very tricky, delicate and emotional times.

None of us are barristers / contract experts / employment lawyers - and even if we were - best to keep your verdict to yourself for the time being.

We pay what we owe but right now all that matters are the lives of those who were on that plane. Money is irrelevant.

I'm afraid that money will never be irrelevant in this world. This looks like something which will take years to sort out even if Sala has somehow survived.

I'm confident the Vincent Tan will do the honourable thing when the timing/circumstances are right; particularly where Emiliano Sala's family are concerned

It's part of who he is as a person