Chelsea Guilty and Not Guilty

The last week we seen some harsh sentences dished out for very minor offences when taken in isolation, for the disorder after the Chelsea FA Cup fixture which caused many Chelsea supporters who were charged to change their plea from Guilty to Not guilty taking their chance with a jury. The judicial system is a mess no consistency, appears to be a lack of direction, and more worryingly no common sense. There have been a few reasons banded about why the sentences were so harsh; Wales V England fixture on the horizon, Kings Road up market shopping area, the media interest in the case, to send out a message. My heart goes out to the families and persons who have been on the receiving end of these sentences for what to prove a point, that this type sentencing will stop hooliganism? If the Police, Judges, magistrates, government are stupid enough to believe this then they are wrong. Real football hooligans prefer prison sentences to large fines, and have accepted prison sentences above fines in the past. Many of the supporters caught up in the clashes after the |Chelsea game had never been in trouble in their life for anything. Cardiff main hooligan group that day were nowhere near Stamford Bridge all day and were in another part of London. Most of that group are currently serving 6-10 year banning orders, and done a lot of jail between them. Clearly the previous jail sentences, and bans dished out to them has not prevented them turning up in London that day in the hope of a ruck.

There is plenty of Talk of people changing their plea from Not Guilty to Guilty to reduce their prison sentence if found guilty by a jury, this is ludicrous if you are NOT GUILTY morally you should fight not guilty. Let’s look at the facts of the events of the day as the blame is being firmly put at Cardiff door at the moment;

• Before the game 2 large groups of Chelsea hooligans (many of whom were previously convicted for football disorder) picking off supporters on their way to the ground
• During the game a couple of hundred Chelsea hooligans (many of whom were previously convicted for football disorder) were allowed to congregate opposite the away turnstiles and pub on the Fulham road clearly had not gone to the game
• After the final whistle 6000 Cardiff Supporters pour out the away end to taunts, provocation and sly punches by this Chelsea hooligan group
• Police face Cardiff fans and force them all left up towards the cemetery and pass the pub where the Chelsea hooligans are located
• With only 4 police officers facing a couple of hundred Chelsea hooligans, Chelsea make a surge towards Cardiff supporters those in the front line are forced to defend with many others surging forward to help forcing Chelsea back this last no more than a minute as police charge Cardiff up the road.
• Many supporters are displaced down a side street which is then blocked by a line of police forcing Cardiff Supporters down a side street with no option but to head onto the Kings road at this point no opportunity to get away from being in a group
• On the kings Road Cardiff supporters again are attacked and forced to defend and look out for each other.
• Once the police arrive in numbers fans finally feel safe to disperse, many of whom needed access to the kings Road for a variety of reasons, catch a tube, shopping one of the most famous shopping centres in the world, coaches not parked in coach park but in other areas, or to access their car.


Many of the supporters are charged with Section 2 Violent disorder although many of the offences are only section 5 or 4 at worst. The CPS are saying as Cardiff are in a large group, the public order act states if three or more persons actions make members of the public feel threatened unsafe etc there charges can be increased from section 4 or 5 to section 2 which carries a maximum 5 year Jail sentence, thus the 2 or 3 statements they have from local people who felt threatened are crucial to the CPS case. Without them the charges the Cardiff supporters would be facing would be significantly reduced.

15 -20 minutes after a football match it is absolutely impossible not be in a largest group of fellow supporters.

So if you are NOT GUILTY of section 2 you should plead NOT GUILTY. It’s tough I know but you will be in front of a jury who hopefully will have some common sense. Those of us who were there on the day, and would like to help, and seen what happened or suffered from the Chelsea lads intermingling after the game and dishing out sly punches before running away should make witness statements, I don’t mind collating them.

If you plead guilty as the other boys found out its almost impossible to get your mitigating evidence across as you have admitted to the charge and evidence put before the judge.

As a tax payer I’m infuriated that people with decent jobs contributing to the country have been given custodial sentences for what ARE minor offences in most cases, yes they should be punished but this is a missed opportunity for the country to gain during these tough economic times. £1,000 fines would have been more beneficial to the country with suspended sentences and community service. It cost the tax payer £40,000 a year to keep a prisoner in jail. Also those who have families will be forced onto benefits so we keep them. When they come out many will have no jobs to go to, it maybe years before they work again if at all as it will be more difficult for them to get a job with a jail sentence on their CV, so benefits will be continue.

These harsh sentences will not deter the hardcore hooligans many of them have already served years behind bars and continue to offend. Many of the Cardiff supporters are good people who got themselves caught up in the disorder don’t deserve to be in Jail, they are decent people and not a menace to society, it’s a sad state of affairs.

It’s up to you how you plead and you do need obviously to take legal advice, but the perpetrators on the day were Chelsea hooligans.

These are my personal views and not Cardiff City Supporters Club.

All of what you say is correct Vince, and I truely hope that everyone else who faces trial gets a realistic verdict. Every offence committed that day would hardly constitute fines, never mind jail or banning orders, IF they were taken as individual incidents, Section 5 at most...ofcourse they find a couple of witnesses, pregnant or with a young child, that they can use to turn the incident into a terrifying ordeal that involved large numbers of fans, and force the charges to be changed into very serious section 2 and section 3, where jail sentences are virtually guaranteed if guilty verdicts are given.

We need a fair jury , who will fully understand the implications of given a guilty verdict to any of the lads on trial, and that really is the best hope now...we all know that the judges are primed and ready with they long sentences and nobody will convince me that these decisions were made pre trial and the judges are under orders from above to be as harsh as they like.


Good article Vince and the information in your other post will also be of help to all of us with relatives already in jail.

see you Tomorrow mate

Corky

Right, I've never been involved in violence at football and don't intend to but I have taken an interest in this because I was in the thick of it with my brother and my mum. I have been to a fair amount of away games with my mum and always make sure we stay in a safe place for her benefit.

However, Chelsea was the first time when I honestly felt we were led to the slaughter. I was very concerned that my brother and I would be forced into a situation where we had to defend ourselves to protect our mum. This case has been way too black and white for me. I know out of all the Cardiff lads sentenced there might well be one or two that deserve it but judging by the evidence harsh sentences have been handed out.

I remember one moment when the Chelsea fans rushed us all and our group was majoritively families with kids and women. There was obviously a sinister violent contingent but they were in the minority. The police made no great attempt to protect us innocent fans and it was a horrible experience. I saw a few mates of mine who have never been in trouble or would even think about it who had to climb the fence to avoid getting assaulted. What if they hadn't made the fence? They would have either been battered or had to stand their ground. What if my mum was 10 yards further into the crowd???

Like I said, I don't condone football violence but take exception to this particular case because I was there with my own mum and found it to be a situation where diabolical planning by the met police and Chelsea football club was the reason for it all happening and they jeopardised our safety. There obviously were individuals who didn't help matters but I can't help but feel the wrong people in some situations have been used as scape goats. That what they are, scape goats.

i couldnt agree with you more zabier