This is nothing personal against Joe Ledley, but...

After watching the Wales friendly the other day, i have no idea how he is making the team over the likes of Jack Collison or Andy King...

this is nothing to do with the fact that "im bitter because he left Cardiff for Celtic" or any of that rubbish, im basing it purely on the fact that i have NEVER rated him as a central midfielder, and the fact that i feel Collison and King are extremely good players...

he offers nothing, in my opinion... he cant pass and goes missing for long periods of games, granted he does work hard and was a great servant for Cardiff and i'll always appreciate that, but I wouldn't take him back at Cardiff - not now, not ever - because i genuinely dont think hes good enough at even Championship level as a central midfielder...

any one else agree/disagree?

with regards to Wales, i dont know how many of you watched the game but i would much prefer if we played with 1 holding midfielder (Vaughan) and 2 in between the midfield and attack in the same mould as Xavi and Iniesta play (Collison/King & Ramsey) and with Bellamy and Bale on either wing, i feel we would then be far more effective and have a genuine chance of competing in the next World Cup qualifiers

I was at the game and Wales were just slow, that's all. Pretty simple but they just needed to move the ball quicker. I was staggered Earnshaw started up front to be honest - he's not a lone striker at all, far from it !

Andy King is a very good player but I'm not sure about him with regards to international football at the minute. Collison has more experience and is just as good a prospect as King IMO. I thought he livened things up considerably when he came on.

Joe's a cracking player. Fair enough he wasn't in outstanding form on Wednesday but then again neither was anyone else.

Wales should stick with the formation and the midfield they have at the moment, but I'd like to see Joe Allen given more of a go - I thought he was excellent when he came on and he will only get better with experience in the Premier League. Him, Ledley and Ramsey as the future midfield trio possibly ? I rate David Vaughan and was appalled that Speed didn't start him against England instead of Crofts, but I feel that we need something different at present; more urgency. Allen would give us that as he has the energy and the legs since he is younger than Vaughan. It'll be interesting to see how Vaughan does with Sunderland instead of Blackpool this season !

I agree that he shouldnt be in the team ahead of King or Collison...I believe one of the two will replace him eventually - they offer more match winning qualities.

I personally think that Ledley should move back out wide again. He was quality out wide for us, and only filled in in the middle when Dave Jones had no other options. He's stayed centrally ever since, but for me he's never improved or developed since moving inside and it basically nullified what he can offer. Joe had a sweet left footed cross on him for a winger and also had the brain to make some intelligent runs, culminating in a few goals.

I see him as backup -

personally I'd like a midfield 3 of vaughan, collison & ramsey with bellamy (for the time being) and bale either side - with just a big man up top. (not too sure about morrison if i'm being honest - but he might be te right 'fit' at the minute

again - i see earnie as backup (same as i do for cardiff) coming on after 65-70 mins to do some damage

then its hennesey, collins x 2, matthews, williams.

but bottom line, just let them play, play and play - this country needs a team to gel, and they'll only get that by sticking with a tight 14-15 players .....

I agree that he shouldnt be in the team ahead of King or Collison...I believe one of the two will replace him eventually - they offer more match winning qualities.

I personally think that Ledley should move back out wide again. He was quality out wide for us, and only filled in in the middle when Dave Jones had no other options. He's stayed centrally ever since, but for me he's never improved or developed since moving inside and it basically nullified what he can offer. Joe had a sweet left footed cross on him for a winger and also had the brain to make some intelligent runs, culminating in a few goals.

Interesting opinion. Could a few years away from the left hinder him if he were to ever move back there in future do you think ?

Keep him in the Wales side like I said. Play Joe Allen alongside him and it'll give us more energy in the middle

I agree that he shouldnt be in the team ahead of King or Collison...I believe one of the two will replace him eventually - they offer more match winning qualities.

I personally think that Ledley should move back out wide again. He was quality out wide for us, and only filled in in the middle when Dave Jones had no other options. He's stayed centrally ever since, but for me he's never improved or developed since moving inside and it basically nullified what he can offer. Joe had a sweet left footed cross on him for a winger and also had the brain to make some intelligent runs, culminating in a few goals.

I agree with the above, nail hit and on head.

Joe is another player who seems to find it hard to make the neccesary accurate small passes from centre mid but can ping great balls from out wide.

The reason he's been in the team ahead of Collison is because the lad hasn't kicked a ball in a year. He missed the whole of last season.

I agree that he shouldnt be in the team ahead of King or Collison...I believe one of the two will replace him eventually - they offer more match winning qualities.

I personally think that Ledley should move back out wide again. He was quality out wide for us, and only filled in in the middle when Dave Jones had no other options. He's stayed centrally ever since, but for me he's never improved or developed since moving inside and it basically nullified what he can offer. Joe had a sweet left footed cross on him for a winger and also had the brain to make some intelligent runs, culminating in a few goals.

Interesting opinion. Could a few years away from the left hinder him if he were to ever move back there in future do you think ?

Keep him in the Wales side like I said. Play Joe Allen alongside him and it'll give us more energy in the middle

He has been away from the position a long time, but its where he learned his trade - nothing a good run in that position wouldnt fix. If I was him I would seriously consider it..

I agree that he shouldnt be in the team ahead of King or Collison...I believe one of the two will replace him eventually - they offer more match winning qualities.

I personally think that Ledley should move back out wide again. He was quality out wide for us, and only filled in in the middle when Dave Jones had no other options. He's stayed centrally ever since, but for me he's never improved or developed since moving inside and it basically nullified what he can offer. Joe had a sweet left footed cross on him for a winger and also had the brain to make some intelligent runs, culminating in a few goals.

I agree with the above, nail hit and on head.

Joe is another player who seems to find it hard to make the neccesary accurate small passes from centre mid but can ping great balls from out wide.

Exactly mate, playing centrally completely nullifies what he can offer. He deliberately sits and drops back because hes conscious that he doesnt have the positional awareness or skills to play further up the pitch through the middle.

However, out wide he's more than comfortable in the final third and is a real asset...with his crossing and timing of runs from the flanks he was can be really effective