Sat Mar 26, 2022 9:23 am
Sat Mar 26, 2022 10:26 am
Sat Mar 26, 2022 10:37 am
castleblue wrote:Abbandonato at his very best.![]()
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At the time of the announcement by the club the statement made was "Subject to International Clearance" and not "Usual clearance from the football authorities. International clearance comes in the form of an International Transfer Certificate.
He claims it is Walesonline understanding that the Welsh FA had "Granted" the ITC by the time of the tragic accident in which ES died. NONSENSE because FIFA regulations dictate that the National Association the player is leaving are responsible for issuing the ITC after receiving a request from the National Association of the club the player is moving to.
The National Association with "Governance" over Cardiff City is The FA and they would have been processing this transfer and having found an error in the transfer contract had not completed the transfer. FIFA stated in their decision on this transfer that the Welsh FA had confirmed they had received the ITC from the French FA.
This is a complex matter clearly indicated by the numbers of Lawyers involved and God alone knows which way the CAS will go with this. But ONLY Abbandonato could claim this represents the FULL STORY.
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Sat Mar 26, 2022 11:07 am
Sat Mar 26, 2022 11:18 am
castleblue wrote:Abbandonato at his very best.![]()
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At the time of the announcement by the club the statement made was "Subject to International Clearance" and not "Usual clearance from the football authorities. International clearance comes in the form of an International Transfer Certificate.
He claims it is Walesonline understanding that the Welsh FA had "Granted" the ITC by the time of the tragic accident in which ES died. NONSENSE because FIFA regulations dictate that the National Association the player is leaving are responsible for issuing the ITC after receiving a request from the National Association of the club the player is moving to.
The National Association with "Governance" over Cardiff City is The FA and they would have been processing this transfer and having found an error in the transfer contract had not completed the transfer. FIFA stated in their decision on this transfer that the Welsh FA had confirmed they had received the ITC from the French FA.
This is a complex matter clearly indicated by the numbers of Lawyers involved and God alone knows which way the CAS will go with this. But ONLY Abbandonato could claim this represents the FULL STORY.
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Sat Mar 26, 2022 11:45 am
JJ1927 wrote:Biggest winners are the lawyers. A sensible compromise should have been agreed by the clubs. City pay 50% of the transfer fee figure of £15 million with the agents told to whistle for their money.
Sat Mar 26, 2022 12:52 pm
Wayne S wrote:JJ1927 wrote:Biggest winners are the lawyers. A sensible compromise should have been agreed by the clubs. City pay 50% of the transfer fee figure of £15 million with the agents told to whistle for their money.
Stop talking common sense.
Cardiff pay half, Nante settle for half.
Or Nante get it all and later get sued for twice as much.
The 50% works for both clubs when you take into account future legal fees.
Sat Mar 26, 2022 12:56 pm
JJ1927 wrote:Biggest winners are the lawyers. A sensible compromise should have been agreed by the clubs. City pay 50% of the transfer fee figure of £15 million with the agents told to whistle for their money.
Sat Mar 26, 2022 2:39 pm
Sven wrote:castleblue wrote:Abbandonato at his very best.![]()
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At the time of the announcement by the club the statement made was "Subject to International Clearance" and not "Usual clearance from the football authorities. International clearance comes in the form of an International Transfer Certificate.
He claims it is Walesonline understanding that the Welsh FA had "Granted" the ITC by the time of the tragic accident in which ES died. NONSENSE because FIFA regulations dictate that the National Association the player is leaving are responsible for issuing the ITC after receiving a request from the National Association of the club the player is moving to.
The National Association with "Governance" over Cardiff City is The FA and they would have been processing this transfer and having found an error in the transfer contract had not completed the transfer. FIFA stated in their decision on this transfer that the Welsh FA had confirmed they had received the ITC from the French FA.
This is a complex matter clearly indicated by the numbers of Lawyers involved and God alone knows which way the CAS will go with this. But ONLY Abbandonato could claim this represents the FULL STORY.
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Great post and throws it back at him, Garry...![]()
It is well known that a number of 'journos' are now writing what they are told to by a certain element at the club and this may well be one such instance?
The 'ruling' is going to be intriguing, as the overall 'story' appears to cast doubt on the completion of the transfer but will that be the conclusion of CAS under any of the three juristrictions (French, Swiss and UK) where the specific elements involved are set in Law
Sat Mar 26, 2022 3:28 pm
castleblue wrote:Sven wrote:castleblue wrote:Abbandonato at his very best.![]()
![]()
At the time of the announcement by the club the statement made was "Subject to International Clearance" and not "Usual clearance from the football authorities. International clearance comes in the form of an International Transfer Certificate.
He claims it is Walesonline understanding that the Welsh FA had "Granted" the ITC by the time of the tragic accident in which ES died. NONSENSE because FIFA regulations dictate that the National Association the player is leaving are responsible for issuing the ITC after receiving a request from the National Association of the club the player is moving to.
The National Association with "Governance" over Cardiff City is The FA and they would have been processing this transfer and having found an error in the transfer contract had not completed the transfer. FIFA stated in their decision on this transfer that the Welsh FA had confirmed they had received the ITC from the French FA.
This is a complex matter clearly indicated by the numbers of Lawyers involved and God alone knows which way the CAS will go with this. But ONLY Abbandonato could claim this represents the FULL STORY.
![]()
![]()
Great post and throws it back at him, Garry...![]()
It is well known that a number of 'journos' are now writing what they are told to by a certain element at the club and this may well be one such instance?
The 'ruling' is going to be intriguing, as the overall 'story' appears to cast doubt on the completion of the transfer but will that be the conclusion of CAS under any of the three juristrictions (French, Swiss and UK) where the specific elements involved are set in Law
Chris it's typical Abbandonato claiming the FULL STORY but a basic level of investigation would point him in the direction of the FIFA Transfer Matching System which monitors ALL International transfers. I have been lucky enough to have seen this in operation and trust me there is a box to tick which states "Transfer Complete".
ITC and player contracts are both part of the TMS and given we know the Premier League had requested an amendment to the terms in the player contract in my opinion it beggars belief that the TMS would have shown transfer complete.
https://www.premierleague.com/news/597059
This is a massive decision for the CAS as I believe there is no precedent to cover what happened here and it goes beyond FIFA Regulations. But one thing is certain FIFA and their member associations will have to revisit the regulations on International Transfers and when they are complete.
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Sat Mar 26, 2022 7:17 pm
Sat Mar 26, 2022 9:00 pm
JJ1927 wrote:Biggest winners are the lawyers. A sensible compromise should have been agreed by the clubs. City pay 50% of the transfer fee figure of £15 million with the agents told to whistle for their money.
Sat Mar 26, 2022 9:06 pm
M4 Exile wrote:JJ1927 wrote:Biggest winners are the lawyers. A sensible compromise should have been agreed by the clubs. City pay 50% of the transfer fee figure of £15 million with the agents told to whistle for their money.
Shouldn’t even have to pay 50% it’s entirely on Nantes involving the McKays. I’d be amazed if we actually had offered a compromise and even more so amazed if Nantes turned it down.
Sat Mar 26, 2022 9:46 pm
M4 Exile wrote:JJ1927 wrote:Biggest winners are the lawyers. A sensible compromise should have been agreed by the clubs. City pay 50% of the transfer fee figure of £15 million with the agents told to whistle for their money.
Shouldn’t even have to pay 50% it’s entirely on Nantes involving the McKays. I’d be amazed if we actually had offered a compromise and even more so amazed if Nantes turned it down.
Sun Mar 27, 2022 5:03 am
Sun Mar 27, 2022 8:26 am
wez1927 wrote:Agree mckays we're nantes selling agent ,100% the agent and nantes should pay compensation to cardiff .
Sun Mar 27, 2022 9:00 am
Wayne S wrote:wez1927 wrote:Agree mckays we're nantes selling agent ,100% the agent and nantes should pay compensation to cardiff .
Buy wasn't the McKay that Nante employed NOT the McKay that hired the plane?
Willie McKay was not the agent as he was banned.
It may mean we go after Willie McKay personally and that is never gonna end with us getting our money back.
Sun Mar 27, 2022 9:20 am
Sun Mar 27, 2022 9:40 am
Simplesimon wrote:Wayne S wrote:wez1927 wrote:Agree mckays we're nantes selling agent ,100% the agent and nantes should pay compensation to cardiff .
Buy wasn't the McKay that Nante employed NOT the McKay that hired the plane?
Willie McKay was not the agent as he was banned.
It may mean we go after Willie McKay personally and that is never gonna end with us getting our money back.
Willie McKay held himself out as being Nantes agent. Saying he was working for his son. If CCFC genuinely thought that to be the case thst means his son is liable for his fathers actions. As his son was Nantes agent He is deemed to be acting under their instructions, and they are liable for his cock ups.
Sun Mar 27, 2022 1:10 pm
Wayne S wrote:Simplesimon wrote:Wayne S wrote:wez1927 wrote:Agree mckays we're nantes selling agent ,100% the agent and nantes should pay compensation to cardiff .
Buy wasn't the McKay that Nante employed NOT the McKay that hired the plane?
Willie McKay was not the agent as he was banned.
It may mean we go after Willie McKay personally and that is never gonna end with us getting our money back.
Willie McKay held himself out as being Nantes agent. Saying he was working for his son. If CCFC genuinely thought that to be the case thst means his son is liable for his fathers actions. As his son was Nantes agent He is deemed to be acting under their instructions, and they are liable for his cock ups.
Just playing devils advocate as we are fully aware how lawyers will manipulate the facts.
We are talking about Cardiff vs Nante here and Nante may well say they employed McKay's son and would be well within their rights to assume they wouldn't be employing a banned agent.
Nante not at fault, they require payment and it is up to us to go after Willie McKay for his involvement in something that had nothing to do with him.
Sun Mar 27, 2022 1:54 pm
Wayne S wrote:Simplesimon wrote:Wayne S wrote:wez1927 wrote:Agree mckays we're nantes selling agent ,100% the agent and nantes should pay compensation to cardiff .
Buy wasn't the McKay that Nante employed NOT the McKay that hired the plane?
Willie McKay was not the agent as he was banned.
It may mean we go after Willie McKay personally and that is never gonna end with us getting our money back.
Willie McKay held himself out as being Nantes agent. Saying he was working for his son. If CCFC genuinely thought that to be the case thst means his son is liable for his fathers actions. As his son was Nantes agent He is deemed to be acting under their instructions, and they are liable for his cock ups.
Just playing devils advocate as we are fully aware how lawyers will manipulate the facts.
We are talking about Cardiff vs Nante here and Nante may well say they employed McKay's son and would be well within their rights to assume they wouldn't be employing a banned agent.
Nante not at fault, they require payment and it is up to us to go after Willie McKay for his involvement in something that had nothing to do with him.
Sun Mar 27, 2022 4:55 pm
piledriver64 wrote:Wayne S wrote:Simplesimon wrote:Wayne S wrote:wez1927 wrote:Agree mckays we're nantes selling agent ,100% the agent and nantes should pay compensation to cardiff .
Buy wasn't the McKay that Nante employed NOT the McKay that hired the plane?
Willie McKay was not the agent as he was banned.
It may mean we go after Willie McKay personally and that is never gonna end with us getting our money back.
Willie McKay held himself out as being Nantes agent. Saying he was working for his son. If CCFC genuinely thought that to be the case thst means his son is liable for his fathers actions. As his son was Nantes agent He is deemed to be acting under their instructions, and they are liable for his cock ups.
Just playing devils advocate as we are fully aware how lawyers will manipulate the facts.
We are talking about Cardiff vs Nante here and Nante may well say they employed McKay's son and would be well within their rights to assume they wouldn't be employing a banned agent.
Nante not at fault, they require payment and it is up to us to go after Willie McKay for his involvement in something that had nothing to do with him.
I think that’s the most likely outcome and the main reason the club have taken this to CAS.
They are looking for a finding that tied McKay in therefore makes it virtually impossible for a court not to find against us when we take another action against him.
Unlike many I don’t think the CAS finding will be the end of this. It’s just part of the club building up a case. We may well have to pay Nantes but then look to recover that from the agent.
Mon Mar 28, 2022 6:42 am
piledriver64 wrote:Wayne S wrote:Simplesimon wrote:Wayne S wrote:wez1927 wrote:Agree mckays we're nantes selling agent ,100% the agent and nantes should pay compensation to cardiff .
Buy wasn't the McKay that Nante employed NOT the McKay that hired the plane?
Willie McKay was not the agent as he was banned.
It may mean we go after Willie McKay personally and that is never gonna end with us getting our money back.
Willie McKay held himself out as being Nantes agent. Saying he was working for his son. If CCFC genuinely thought that to be the case thst means his son is liable for his fathers actions. As his son was Nantes agent He is deemed to be acting under their instructions, and they are liable for his cock ups.
Just playing devils advocate as we are fully aware how lawyers will manipulate the facts.
We are talking about Cardiff vs Nante here and Nante may well say they employed McKay's son and would be well within their rights to assume they wouldn't be employing a banned agent.
Nante not at fault, they require payment and it is up to us to go after Willie McKay for his involvement in something that had nothing to do with him.
I think that’s the most likely outcome and the main reason the club have taken this to CAS.
They are looking for a finding that tied McKay in therefore makes it virtually impossible for a court not to find against us when we take another action against him.
Unlike many I don’t think the CAS finding will be the end of this. It’s just part of the club building up a case. We may well have to pay Nantes but then look to recover that from the agent.
Mon Mar 28, 2022 7:28 am
Sven wrote:piledriver64 wrote:Wayne S wrote:Simplesimon wrote:Wayne S wrote:wez1927 wrote:Agree mckays we're nantes selling agent ,100% the agent and nantes should pay compensation to cardiff .
Buy wasn't the McKay that Nante employed NOT the McKay that hired the plane?
Willie McKay was not the agent as he was banned.
It may mean we go after Willie McKay personally and that is never gonna end with us getting our money back.
Willie McKay held himself out as being Nantes agent. Saying he was working for his son. If CCFC genuinely thought that to be the case thst means his son is liable for his fathers actions. As his son was Nantes agent He is deemed to be acting under their instructions, and they are liable for his cock ups.
Just playing devils advocate as we are fully aware how lawyers will manipulate the facts.
We are talking about Cardiff vs Nante here and Nante may well say they employed McKay's son and would be well within their rights to assume they wouldn't be employing a banned agent.
Nante not at fault, they require payment and it is up to us to go after Willie McKay for his involvement in something that had nothing to do with him.
I think that’s the most likely outcome and the main reason the club have taken this to CAS.
They are looking for a finding that tied McKay in therefore makes it virtually impossible for a court not to find against us when we take another action against him.
Unlike many I don’t think the CAS finding will be the end of this. It’s just part of the club building up a case. We may well have to pay Nantes but then look to recover that from the agent.
Sorry, Tim; (quote) "impossible for a Court not to find against us..."?![]()
Is that what you wanted to say?![]()
Personally, I think it's too tough to call but 'the end' may certainly not be nigh, if our club are not 'happy' with the outcome
I know from an impeccable source that Vincent Tan is not happy with much of went on before, during and after the awful event and also certain individuals involved; and I don't blame him for believing the club have been hard done by and potentially duped (more on that another time)
Mon Mar 28, 2022 9:41 am
Mon Mar 28, 2022 10:51 am