' Cardiff City Owners '

' Cardiff City Owners '
link
http://www.annisabraham.co.uk/news/

Since 2000, we have had a number of controversial owners, all of whom have split the fan base on certain issues.

Sam Hammam took over in 2000 and inherited a £3million debt on a club in Division 3. During his tenure, we rose through the leagues and at the time of his departure, the club were 6 points clear at the top of the Championship.

During this time, Hammam accrued a £24million debt & started to push through plans for an all new stadium, which, in later years, would eventually come to be the CCS we know and love.

Peter Ridsdale took over the club & continued to keep it afloat, whilst finalising Hammam's work on the new stadium & eventually delivered it. During his time at the club, Ridsdale rose to the heights of FA Cup final appearances and big name signings, to the lows of misleading the fans and several winding up orders over unpaid tax.

Ridsdale spent lots of time looking for outside investment & it came just at the right time. Vincent Tan stepped in and saved the club from a £4million tax bill, days before a high court hearing, which could well have destroyed the club. The Ridsdale era had left the club in £28million of debt.

Prior to investing, I understand Tan had completed due diligence twice & knew of the sorry state of the Cardiff City accounts, as any business man would.

Tan spent one season bankrolling the club, before offering to invest in the club £100million, to clear Langston debt & to secure the long term future of CCFC. He would build a state of the art training ground, clear debt owed to Hammam, transfer his personal debt to equity & invest heavily in the playing squad for a real chance of promotion to the Premier League. The only drawback would be that Tan would enforce his rebrand on the club.

At first, there was outrage. Fans were up in arms. Tan backtracked and said he didn't wish to cause any offence & that the rebrand would be reversed. Personally, however, I doubt that this was ever going to happen, as the club had to submit colours and kits by April of that year, so the rules of the league state they would have to remain in red anyway.

I think it is fair to say that a big majority of these fans were reluctantly willing to accept the rebrand, after the threat of Tan walking away. Only a handful of supporters actively opposed the rebrand.

As he promised, Tan cleared debt owed to Hammam/Langston in July 2013. Him and Hammam came to an agreement which meant CCFC didn't have to pay the full amount owed. This was extremely good deal & credit to Tan for brokering it.

Tan then spoke in the press at how he aimed to make the club debt free, as he said in the original rebrand "agreement". Tan said in the interview that the debt to him at this time was £120million.

Fast forward 11 months and the club have just been relegated from the Premier League after a season of turmoil off the field, where the media have ridiculed the club from every corner. The debt at Cardiff City now stands at approx. £150million & Tan has now changed his thoughts on debt to equity, saying he will only change £50million, despite saying less than 12 months earlier, he aimed to make it totally debt free.

Come August 2014, we will be: -

- Playing in the same league as before the investment.
- A club totally bereft of any traditional identity.
- Totally split as a fan base.
- In more debt than ever before.. Over £100million more in debt prior to Tan's involvement.
- Will have less fans and ST holders supporting the club.

How are we better off?
Who is responsible?

Sam (you could at least list the lies he told as you did in great detail about Tan, just to even it out)

If he hadnt fucked us over then Tan would have been nowhere to be seen.

Last edited by CraigCCFC on Sun Jun 01, 2014 5:58 pm, edited 1 time in total.

One thing wrong here when tan steeped the debt was already far in excess of £28m

' Cardiff City Owners '

Since 2000, we have had a number of controversial owners, all of whom have split the fan base on certain issues.

Sam Hammam took over in 2000 and inherited a £3million debt on a club in Division 3. During his tenure, we rose through the leagues and at the time of his departure, the club were 6 points clear at the top of the Championship.

During this time, Hammam accrued a £24million debt & started to push through plans for an all new stadium, which, in later years, would eventually come to be the CCS we know and love.

Peter Ridsdale took over the club & continued to keep it afloat, whilst finalising Hammam's work on the new stadium & eventually delivered it. During his time at the club, Ridsdale rose to the heights of FA Cup final appearances and big name signings, to the lows of misleading the fans and several winding up orders over unpaid tax.

Ridsdale spent lots of time looking for outside investment & it came just at the right time. Vincent Tan stepped in and saved the club from a £4million tax bill, days before a high court hearing, which could well have destroyed the club. The Ridsdale era had left the club in £28million of debt.

Prior to investing, I understand Tan had completed due diligence twice & knew of the sorry state of the Cardiff City accounts, as any business man would.

Tan spent one season bankrolling the club, before offering to invest in the club £100million, to clear Langston debt & to secure the long term future of CCFC. He would build a state of the art training ground, clear debt owed to Hammam, transfer his personal debt to equity & invest heavily in the playing squad for a real chance of promotion to the Premier League. The only drawback would be that Tan would enforce his rebrand on the club.

At first, there was outrage. Fans were up in arms. Tan backtracked and said he didn't wish to cause any offence & that the rebrand would be reversed. Personally, however, I doubt that this was ever going to happen, as the club had to submit colours and kits by April of that year, so the rules of the league state they would have to remain in red anyway.

I think it is fair to say that a big majority of these fans were reluctantly willing to accept the rebrand, after the threat of Tan walking away. Only a handful of supporters actively opposed the rebrand.

As he promised, Tan cleared debt owed to Hammam/Langston in July 2013. Him and Hammam came to an agreement which meant CCFC didn't have to pay the full amount owed. This was extremely good deal & credit to Tan for brokering it.

Tan then spoke in the press at how he aimed to make the club debt free, as he said in the original rebrand "agreement". Tan said in the interview that the debt to him at this time was £120million.

Fast forward 11 months and the club have just been relegated from the Premier League after a season of turmoil off the field, where the media have ridiculed the club from every corner. The debt at Cardiff City now stands at approx. £150million & Tan has now changed his thoughts on debt to equity, saying he will only change £50million, despite saying less than 12 months earlier, he aimed to make it totally debt free.

Come August 2014, we will be: -

- Playing in the same league as before the investment.
- A club totally bereft of any traditional identity.
- Totally split as a fan base.
- In more debt than ever before.. Over £100million more in debt prior to Tan's involvement.
- Will have less fans and ST holders supporting the club.

How are we better off?
Who is responsible?

Good post, mate. One season in the promised land means that has all been worth it...for some.

One thing wrong here when tan steeped the debt was already far in excess of £28m

When Tan took over we were £28 mill approx in debt.

One thing wrong here when tan steeped the debt was already far in excess of £28m

The accounts shaped a debt of £34m to Langston including naming rights wtc

This without the moeny owed to Michael issacs, PMG and other board members that had been bankrolling the club

Season ricket money had already been spent so tan had to bankroll entire first season at cost of roughly £35m

That's takes u to nearly £100m after first year of him being year before he even proposed the rebrand

Don't let that cloud yor judgement mind you

Sam (you could at least list the lies he told as you did in great detail about Tan, just to even it out)

If he hadnt fucked us over then Tan would have been nowhere to be seen.

Craig, during the start of the Hammam era, I was a teenager who didn't care too much for off the field matters, so therefore do not know as much as I do regarding Tan, to be honest.

One thing wrong here when tan steeped the debt was already far in excess of £28m

When Tan took over we were £28 mill approx in debt.

That's bullshit annis the accounts tell you that

Sam (you could at least list the lies he told as you did in great detail about Tan, just to even it out)

If he hadnt fucked us over then Tan would have been nowhere to be seen.

Craig not sticking for Sam, but we were then £3mill in debt in the year 2000,ready to be closed down and in Division 4.

One thing wrong here when tan steeped the debt was already far in excess of £28m

When Tan took over we were £28 mill approx in debt.

That's bullshit annis the accounts tell you that

Put them on here and I will admit I am in the wrong

you have forgotten previous owner's nearly all has bad in their way as last couple? ahhh well roll on next owner!!

One thing wrong here when tan steeped the debt was already far in excess of £28m

When Tan took over we were £28 mill approx in debt.

you can't have it both ways annis you were saying we owed Sam 35m plus only a few months ago before it was settled,when tan stepped in we had stadium debts ,tax debts and other debts 50 million plus

Fair play to Chuckles he has written a fair and honest account of our owners and yes we are in more shit/trouble than ever and a club without a soul.

Couple of things.
When Sam took over the debt was 1.5 million not 3 and it was 37 million when he was removed from the club
Tan did not step in days before the court case. The court case actually took place and tans lawyers produced a letter and proof of funds from tan to the court. As I have said many times the revenue lawyer was still insisting on winding us up because we were still trading insolvent.
Tan saved the club from liquidation that day but eventually killed the club off as most people knew it.

One thing wrong here when tan steeped the debt was already far in excess of £28m

When Tan took over we were £28 mill approx in debt.

you can't have it both ways annis you were saying we owed Sam 35m plus only a few months ago before it was settled,when tan stepped in we had stadium debts ,tax debts and other debts 50 million plus

Wez, Show me where I have said we owe Sam £35mill plus? Iv always said between £24mill to £28 mill.

How about us all discussing todays debt in 2014? Hmm

One thing wrong here when tan steeped the debt was already far in excess of £28m

When Tan took over we were £28 mill approx in debt.

you can't have it both ways annis you were saying we owed Sam 35m plus only a few months ago before it was settled,when tan stepped in we had stadium debts ,tax debts and other debts 50 million plus

But weren't the other £7m owed to others?

One thing wrong here when tan steeped the debt was already far in excess of £28m

When Tan took over we were £28 mill approx in debt.

you can't have it both ways annis you were saying we owed Sam 35m plus only a few months ago before it was settled,when tan stepped in we had stadium debts ,tax debts and other debts 50 million plus

Exactly wez how can we have owed sam £35m yet only show £38m after ridsdale era

Ridsdale had mortgaged season tickets as well so tan had to put the entire wages transfer and day to day running cost in first year, after his first year alone we would have been £80-90m in debt already

It's poppycock

PMG were owed millions as well nt to mention others who had been loaning the club money at extortionate rates

Couple of things.
When Sam took over the debt was 1.5 million not 3 and it was 37 million when he was removed from the club
Tan did not step in days before the court case. The court case actually took place and tans lawyers produced a letter and proof of funds from tan to the court. As I have said many times the revenue lawyer was still insisting on winding us up because we were still trading insolvent.
Tan saved the club from liquidation that day but eventually killed the club off as most people knew it.

Steve, when Sam left and the Riddler took over it was £24-£28 Mill.

One thing wrong here when tan steeped the debt was already far in excess of £28m

When Tan took over we were £28 mill approx in debt.

It was a lot more than that annis with monies owed to creditors

Couple of things.
When Sam took over the debt was 1.5 million not 3 and it was 37 million when he was removed from the club
Tan did not step in days before the court case. The court case actually took place and tans lawyers produced a letter and proof of funds from tan to the court. As I have said many times the revenue lawyer was still insisting on winding us up because we were still trading insolvent.
Tan saved the club from liquidation that day but eventually killed the club off as most people knew it.

Thanks for correcting any inaccuracies.

"Tan saved the club from liquidation that day but eventually killed the club off as most people knew it."

This sentence is something I feel strongly about.

One thing wrong here when tan steeped the debt was already far in excess of £28m

When Tan took over we were £28 mill approx in debt.

you can't have it both ways annis you were saying we owed Sam 35m plus only a few months ago before it was settled,when tan stepped in we had stadium debts ,tax debts and other debts 50 million plus

But weren't the other £7m owed to others?

I mean, 28m to Sam and 7m to others such as PMG etc

Couple of things.
When Sam took over the debt was 1.5 million not 3 and it was 37 million when he was removed from the club
Tan did not step in days before the court case. The court case actually took place and tans lawyers produced a letter and proof of funds from tan to the court. As I have said many times the revenue lawyer was still insisting on winding us up because we were still trading insolvent.
Tan saved the club from liquidation that day but eventually killed the club off as most people knew it.

Thanks for correcting any inaccuracies.

"Tan saved the club from liquidation that day but eventually killed the club off as most people knew it."

This sentence is something I feel strongly about.

Yes Barry I think that sentence sums it up for most people at the moment

I'm not arguing anything else in his post as he's spot on but to say the club only owed out £28m prior to tans arrival is madness

We were being wound up for gods sake we owed £4m to the tax man let alone the other debts

One thing wrong here when tan steeped the debt was already far in excess of £28m

When Tan took over we were £28 mill approx in debt.

you can't have it both ways annis you were saying we owed Sam 35m plus only a few months ago before it was settled,when tan stepped in we had stadium debts ,tax debts and other debts 50 million plus

But weren't the other £7m owed to others?

pmg were owed 9million on there own with out all the other debts

One thing wrong here when tan steeped the debt was already far in excess of £28m

When Tan took over we were £28 mill approx in debt.

you can't have it both ways annis you were saying we owed Sam 35m plus only a few months ago before it was settled,when tan stepped in we had stadium debts ,tax debts and other debts 50 million plus

But weren't the other £7m owed to others?

I mean, 28m to Sam and 7m to others such as PMG etc

Try adding at least a 2 in front of that 7

The fan base is not split. There are just a group of people sulking because they can't get their own way. Out of every 25,000 Cardiff fans who attended matches last season, 24,000 just turn up and watch the game, then go home and get on with their lives. They are normal people with normal priorities - they probably prefer the team in blue but in the big scheme of their lives, it is not a big enough issue to cause them any concern. Neither is the clubs finances, as long as it doesn't affect their own income they don't really care.

Sometimes you can't get your own way, no matter how much you are in the right and no matter how much you want things to be different. That's life. And many people on here need to get one.

I will fully judge Tan when he leaves. The others left us in shit. For all we know when Tan goes we could be ok, we could not.....we'll have to wait.

Thing that gets me about Sam was his "the debt leaves with me" and the fact we were hours from going under and he refused to sign us over until he got a bit more cash for his brother.

Sam rebranded us, even talk of merging us with Swansea. He lent money to get us promoted, and it wasnt his. The stadium could not go ahead with Sam in charge, council said no. We had a firesale of epic proportions and HMRC wanting us. He brought in the Riddler.

BUT

He got me believing we could be great, he started my dreams about CCFC and what we could achieve.

One thing wrong here when tan steeped the debt was already far in excess of £28m

When Tan took over we were £28 mill approx in debt.

you can't have it both ways annis you were saying we owed Sam 35m plus only a few months ago before it was settled,when tan stepped in we had stadium debts ,tax debts and other debts 50 million plus

But weren't the other £7m owed to others?

pmg were owed 9million on there own with out all the other debts

Yeah exactly borley was owed money from memory

Wasn't isaacs charging silly money on his loans as well

There were a lot of leaches he cleared first season as well without having to pay every penny of the day to day running of the club cos riddler had mortgaged season ticket money

We barely generated any revenue that season we couldn't even pay the compass food people lol

If u estimate we spent around £30-40m In a championship season then tan on top of initial £6m had already put near on £50m in before even mentioning a rebrand

The fan base is not split. There are just a group of people sulking because they can't get their own way. Out of every 25,000 Cardiff fans who attended matches last season, 24,000 just turn up and watch the game, then go home and get on with their lives. They are normal people with normal priorities - they probably prefer the team in blue but in the big scheme of their lives, it is not a big enough issue to cause them any concern. Neither is the clubs finances, as long as it doesn't affect their own income they don't really care.

Sometimes you can't get your own way, no matter how much you are in the right and no matter how much you want things to be different. That's life. And many people on here need to get one.

Totally agree most people just want to see a winning Cardiff team

One thing wrong here when tan steeped the debt was already far in excess of £28m

The accounts shaped a debt of £34m to Langston including naming rights wtc

This without the moeny owed to Michael issacs, PMG and other board members that had been bankrolling the club

Season ricket money had already been spent so tan had to bankroll entire first season at cost of roughly £35m

That's takes u to nearly £100m after first year of him being year before he even proposed the rebrand

Don't let that cloud yor judgement mind you

Now this is where it gets interesting.

I was argued with by many experts on here that the debt to Langston was £15m and up to £9m of naming rights which were not payable by the club but by the stadium name buyer so apparently the debt was only £15m to Langston plus interest which was not due until 2016.

So people can't have the penny and the bun.

Annis and I used to argue that Langston were owed £35m+ because Langston believed with the interest being added and the defaults in agreed payments and settlements meant that loan note 1 was 'back in play' and not the 2nd loan note that was agreed in or around 2006.

PMG's debts were being paid back by Premier Seat money.

So I don't think Chuckles is far wrong with his accounting of events.

Thought provoking read.

But don't let the hatred for Hammam cloud your judgement on what has been written.