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Re: After Tues...No more a Reluctant Red !!!

Fri Feb 22, 2013 11:16 am

Cardiff City as we know it has been systimatically killed off since last August, this is now a brand new club i am afraid :(

Re: After Tues...No more a Reluctant Red !!!

Fri Feb 22, 2013 11:41 am

Blueboys1927 wrote:Cardiff City as we know it has been systimatically killed off since last August, this is now a brand new club i am afraid :(


How?? please exclaim how a change of colour has effected our 114 year history?

Re: After Tues...No more a Reluctant Red !!!

Fri Feb 22, 2013 11:44 am

I you were sat there waving your lovely red award as you watched dancing dragons - you'd soon see that this is Cardiff City in name only.

Re: After Tues...No more a Reluctant Red !!!

Fri Feb 22, 2013 12:08 pm

Barry Chuckle wrote:I you were sat there waving your lovely red award as you watched dancing dragons - you'd soon see that this is Cardiff City in name only.


Slow down with your typing there Chuckles, Ive no idea what you've said.

If your trying to say I was there Tuesday waving my red scarf, you simply aint got a clue. As far as I know the Team and club I support has not changed at all!!

If your daughter or son brought home their new life partner, and they were from a different race or country, would you still love them? get a grip man its a colour, permanent or temporary,this is still CCFC.

CCFC is very much alive and well and I for one cannot wait to start a promotion party when we go up, i might even go Barry Island and reminisce from the days of 93.

Re: After Tues...No more a Reluctant Red !!!

Fri Feb 22, 2013 12:17 pm

if you cant see whats happening then its pointless discussing :ayatollah: :old: :ayatollah:

Re: After Tues...No more a Reluctant Red !!!

Fri Feb 22, 2013 12:27 pm

caerdydd_78 wrote:
Barry Chuckle wrote:I you were sat there waving your lovely red award as you watched dancing dragons - you'd soon see that this is Cardiff City in name only.


Slow down with your typing there Chuckles, Ive no idea what you've said.

If your trying to say I was there Tuesday waving my red scarf, you simply aint got a clue. As far as I know the Team and club I support has not changed at all!!

If your daughter or son brought home their new life partner, and they were from a different race or country, would you still love them? get a grip man its a colour, permanent or temporary,this is still CCFC.

CCFC is very much alive and well and I for one cannot wait to start a promotion party when we go up, i might even go Barry Island and reminisce from the days of 93.


Apologies - I'm on my phone.

Totally different & you know it.

For starters, my daughter wouldn't have changed his skin colour for money.

As I said, yes - it's still Cardiff City. A very different one though.

Re: After Tues...No more a Reluctant Red !!!

Fri Feb 22, 2013 12:59 pm

Barry Chuckle wrote:
caerdydd_78 wrote:
Barry Chuckle wrote:I you were sat there waving your lovely red award as you watched dancing dragons - you'd soon see that this is Cardiff City in name only.


Slow down with your typing there Chuckles, Ive no idea what you've said.

If your trying to say I was there Tuesday waving my red scarf, you simply aint got a clue. As far as I know the Team and club I support has not changed at all!!

If your daughter or son brought home their new life partner, and they were from a different race or country, would you still love them? get a grip man its a colour, permanent or temporary,this is still CCFC.

CCFC is very much alive and well and I for one cannot wait to start a promotion party when we go up, i might even go Barry Island and reminisce from the days of 93.


Apologies - I'm on my phone.

Totally different & you know it.

For starters, my daughter wouldn't have changed his skin colour for money.

As I said, yes - it's still Cardiff City. A very different one though.


Barry, I'm not a ass honestly, maybe stubborn on my opinions but deffo not a ass. Very much like you and all the other so called anti-reds, im not anti red as I can see how he is trying to secure the financial stability of the club, and what a possible re-brand can offer a club like Cardiff. I care for this club and its very hard to see what going on but its also hard to realise is "what are the other options"??

We all know Tan and the board did things wrong, but at the time we didn't have nothing else but aged debt and possible admin. Fans are right it was not Red or Dead, but if i used my personally money like he is doing, he is well within his rights to do what he feels best, in his case he feels that a re-brand will change the future of this football club. We my not be seeing millions of cash flying into this club, and you wont see that until we establish this club in the Premier League. But nobody can deny that this club is far more professional in its approach to things than it has been in the past. We are not the CCFC of the 70's, known to fans are a tough cookie inside and outside the stadium, we are a new club whom have won the family club of the year twice, we are a club reaching out to new fans to prolong the life of this club by attracting families and new fan bases in Malaysia and Asia.

I personally feel with a fair mix of both red and blue, a newer classier design on the badge, will make fans understand. However, i feel that the small changes being made like the Stadium, the new website the general marketing of the club is far more proactive and acute that it has been in the past, and I feel once promotion is secured, we will all really see the benefit of the re-brand. i feel that the best way to resolve this is to allow the fans to air there views, allow a free and open forum for everyone to come together and make changes that suit the business and the financials, as well as the hearts of the fans.

But all this bickering and bullying from both sides needs to stop, understand that the re-brand is pulling on the heartstrings of the fans but it needs to stop as Ive seen actual long term friendships come of blows over it.

That's where fans forums and websites need to put a stop to it rather than keep on posting pages or articles that are not factual just to keep the debate alive.

Re: After Tues...No more a Reluctant Red !!!

Fri Feb 22, 2013 2:15 pm

Hiya mate! Alright? wrote:I've always tried to keep an open mind about the rebrand and way up the pros and cons. I'd prefer to stay blue (as would the vast majority of fans) but in fairness, VT saved our club financially at a time when we were in dire trouble, and he has put his money where his mouth is, so was a bit of compromise a small price to pay for our survival?

I went to the game on Tues, walked in as normal and was handed a red scarf, At this stage I admit, I hadn't made a decision on whether to take it or not, so I took it, rolled it up and put it in my pocket. The more scarfs I saw, the more uncomfortable I began to feel. When I climbed the stairs and walked in to the bar and saw a sea of scarves, I felt empty, for the first time, I no longer recognised my club. For the first time I felt the full force of the rebrand. Red and white scarves everywhere! It was like a Wales Rugby international! I was expecting Max Boyce to jump out any minute shouting Oggy Oggy Oggy :(

So for me, no more a Reluctant Red, Im going back to blue. I totally respect VT for all he has done to save and improve the club, and I respect he wants to do things his way. I also respect long serving fans who "put up with" the rebrand for for the security and success of our future, we all want to see a successful Cardiff City. But surely there's room for compromise? Surely there's a way to embrace both progress and heritage? Surely the new vision of our club doesn't have to mean wiping the slate completely clean of our history and identity?

There must be a better way forward to keep fans both old and new happy? If we can get all major fans groups to work together, then surely we can all do something as a compromise?

this :ayatollah: :ayatollah: :ayatollah: :ayatollah: :ayatollah: :ayatollah: :ayatollah: :ayatollah: :ayatollah:

Re: After Tues...No more a Reluctant Red !!!

Fri Feb 22, 2013 2:42 pm

I'm still undecided about the whole rebrand issue - probably 75% in favour of the rebrand

Yes I took a scarf and wore it in support of our investors who have given Malky and the players what they have needed to be top of the league

Our infrastructure is as good as anything in the Championship, we already have Premier League facilities with huge potential in increasing ground capacity and investment on the pitch

The big plus for me is seeing the people running our club at home games, we are not being controlled from overseas, people have identified huge potential in our club

We have made steady progress in establishing ourselves in the Championship and everything is in place for promotion.

Accepting this huge investment and seeing and being excited by City making progress is not the same as being rolled over by investors, it's looking at the big picture, football is changing, we need to move with it.

Re: After Tues...No more a Reluctant Red !!!

Fri Feb 22, 2013 3:05 pm

caerdydd_78 wrote:Football is a business without a doubt, without the global revenue from marketing and other global projects, and help attract financial muscle from other parts of the world, Barcelona and Real Madrid would have disappeared years ago, that's a fact. Yes the two clubs mentioned are world names and massive clubs in European and world football. but without the constant marketing of countries with billions of fans. they wouldn't be where they are today without penny pinching from Asia, America or China.

Not true though for the 2 teams you mention. The overwhelming majority of the income for those clubs comes from their local area. Barcelona make a particular play on being a Catalan (rather than Spanish) team.

I think every CCFC fan will agree, TAN could have and should have done things differently, he should have consulted the fans and organized a forum or a simple fans vote to test the water. But, he didn't and I think deep down he knows this.

Agreed.

But - Tan also has the experience in the above said countries and I personally think the club as a whole is a lot more professional and he knows what he is doing. Tan owns the McDonalds franchise in Malaysia, he also has recently developed the Biggest Shopping Center in the world in China, (£35b). The Berjeya group is massive and even looking at the website shows you the wealth and business acumen he brings to a football club.

Yes he has lots of experience in the Far East.
He doesn`t own the McDonalds franchise in Malaysia.
The shopping mall in a city outside Beijing is not yet developed. Phase 1 (of 3) is not due to open until the Autumn of this year.
If you look at the Berjaya website , they are massive -as are some of the companies VT has recently "hived off" into personal ownership if you look at the dropdown menu on the site. But that growth and success has been achieved with a proudly displayed blue and gold branding.He has never explained why a need to change to red for CCFC if it is not needed for Berjaya in the same potential markets.Indeed , it would appear to make more sense to use the corporate colours that he has already got recognised and exposed to the market.

To think that out club CCFC, about 10 years ago was playing 3rd tier football in front of a very derelict stadium, goes to show how far we have come. Yes Sam was part of that, yes Sam brought a sense of direction. But our old forum was called the 'Sleeping Giant' and to be fair, Tan has taken advantage of that.

The stadium was already in place before the Malaysian investment came about - part of the attraction to them I am sure.

Think about it a little, sorry to rant on... In the last accounts he has personally (ok a loan @ 7%) £53 million and rising by about £1m per month. If he settled the debt as noted in the last accounts and wiped the slate clean, that will cost him what is it about £85m. He will own outright, a club trading in the best league in the world with massive global and outrageous TV revenues. Own a stadium worth in excess of £45m, and with easy plans to expand from 28k to 60k. Own a very decent and profitable squad and a rapidly expanding youth and academy system. All for what £85m?? these figures may not be spot on but Jesus, you couldn't buy Wigan for less?

I agree it is a potentially lucrative business acquisition for him. Which is why I remain surprised he hasn`t taken advantage of being able to settle the Langston debt for considerably less than its value in the balance sheet and then proceed with a debt for equity swap to get effective shareholder control.

I just think we need to get behind CCFC, as is until things change anyway. Lets just enjoy the ride, ok if you don't like the re-brand, it don't mean the club don't need your support and your fantastic loyalty. Its still CCFC, as Ive said before its choice.

I will always get behind CCFC as a team. I don`t think continuing to question the actions and motives of its biggest creditor excludes me from doing just that.

Lets live and enjoy the dream, I'm sure we all agree its far better than when we were hrs from admin!!!