' POLL ' How would you vote on eu today?

I love how the government loves to spread the doom and gloom as to what would (not could) happen if we left the EU. Anyone remember 16 years ago when the government and economists wanted us to join the euro. How do you think that would have gone for us?

It is all simply propaganda and spin doctors at work. They are twisting every figure in desperation and calling in lots of favours from celebs etc. The remain campaign stinks!

No-one can say we would be worse off as a nation outside the EU. We would have our say in whether the NHS privatises. The talks currently going on between the EU and US under TTIP are looking at privatising all health services within the EU. The EU makes that decision. We are not likely to have any say in the matter.

We are also, with Germany, the only net contributors within the EU. The only 2 countries that pay in more than they take out. All the rest are scrounging from us with another 5 countries to be admitted soon that will also scrounge from us. The EU needs us a hell of a lot more than we need them.

Have a look at how Norway are doing outside the EU. They still trade with the EU and have a €50bn trade surplus with the EU. That could be us in 5 years time.

There are dozens of other reasons to leave but one of the best is that Cameron will most likely have to resign. Is that not a good enough reason to vote leave on its own?

There are dozens of other reasons to leave but one of the best is that Cameron will most likely have to resign. Is that not a good enough reason to vote leave on its own?

Paving the way for Boris to take over. Brilliant.

I guess as far as the polls are concerned not many on this forum have been contacted. 37 out of 128 in favour of staying in is not in line with what we are being told every day.

If we all vote IN its basically giving the green light for the 751 bureaucrats in Brussels, who run a major part of our lives already, to do what they want and WE in the UK will be totally powerless to stop them.

Federal European state - that has always been the idea.

We have this FINAL chance to get back our independence.

Come on people - look further than your nose !!

VOTE LEAVE

All serious economic forecasts from the Bnak of England, to the OECD, to the IMF predict economic woe if we leave. Are you suggesting they are all wrong/ a mass conspiracy?

I agree figures can be decieving. For example, As a Brit you'd save £150 per head if vote leave. Yet, as a Welshman you'd lose £80! This is because the media aren't doing a good enough job separating the debate. Economically, British means English and they get a bad deal.

However, Wales benefits massively from the EU to the tune of £250m extra every year. The funding we would lose would not be replaced by a UK Government. What then?

But UK won't have to put in bilions into the EU! large amount funding to wales is wasted on stupid projects like cycle paths to nowhere! Don't forget the money Europe gives us is given to Europe from UK govmnt so it's swings and roundabouts.

2 LL'S in billions alien

And it's Allan (that's with a capital A and spelled A-L-L-A-N) oh finicky one!

All serious economic forecasts from the Bnak of England, to the OECD, to the IMF predict economic woe if we leave. Are you suggesting they are all wrong/ a mass conspiracy?

I agree figures can be decieving. For example, As a Brit you'd save £150 per head if vote leave. Yet, as a Welshman you'd lose £80! This is because the media aren't doing a good enough job separating the debate. Economically, British means English and they get a bad deal.

However, Wales benefits massively from the EU to the tune of £250m extra every year. The funding we would lose would not be replaced by a UK Government. What then?

But UK won't have to put in bilions into the EU! large amount funding to wales is wasted on stupid projects like cycle paths to nowhere! Don't forget the money Europe gives us is given to Europe from UK govmnt so it's swings and roundabouts.

2 LL'S in billions alien

And it's Allan (that's with a capital A and spelled A-L-L-A-N) oh finicky one!

Sven He just derails any thread I am on with this childish behaviour, and as no respect for people who use this board!

I've been wanting OUT for over a long 25 years!!!

The EU does not do democracy , in fact, the only way for it to become a USE is by subverting democracy.

There are dozens of other reasons to leave but one of the best is that Cameron will most likely have to resign. Is that not a good enough reason to vote leave on its own?

Paving the way for Boris to take over. Brilliant.

Give me a clown over a pig shagging lying conniving b*stard any day.

With Boris what you see is what you get. I will never trust a word that piece of shit Cameron says.

Blue Gog in spreading lies and half truths shocker.

Notice in that little map he shared it says until 2020? Well guess what happens in 2019. The EU are negotiating the next round of funding and sadly for Wales we are likely to be not receive that amount again. We were lucky too last time, with every poorer regions joining the Union we are going to get bumped up.

I understand why people want to remain for the funding aspect and agree that Westminster are unlikely to invest that much into South Wales. However this funding is going to stop in a few years and we will be saddled with all the negatives of the EU without much of the positives for that I am voting to LEAVE.

Talking of spreading lies and half truths...

It will stop, they are reviewing it in 2019 and we were very close to losing top funding status back when it was last reviewed. At the moment we are getting a lot of money, that point I will concede. However this money will dry up and with all the shit holes joining the EU we will be budged up a bit.

Too much talk about immigration in this thread and others regarding the EU. If you are genuinely out, stop talking about immigration because it's turning many potential out voters off. There's plenty of arguments to leave the EU.

I have seen no fact based information that supports leaving, so if you have some I would be glad to see it Sven.

The EU is 100% un democratic and is a dictatorship at Brussels who wasn't elected or can't be sacked. Tell me that is not true Chief.

I don't like the way it is either, but it is "vaguely democratic".

There are elected MEP's , but I agree there are issues with the election of the top officials. These officials are elected by the national government representatives who are themselves elected. I don't agree with this process, it would be better to have a more open system.

The main issues with the EU are:
1) Their scope is too big. Single Market is a good idea. Political Union is not.
2) National Governments have different interpretations of how to implement EU legislation
3) It's top officials DO appear like a JUNTA

Perhaps there real issue is that if Britain had a less elite political system, the ordinary people might be better served in the UK and in Europe!!

I am completely in favour of staying in the EU, however that is not to say I don't think it needs overhauling in certain areas.

In terms of leaving I just don't think we understand the ramifications of it - there has been so little 'facts' based research on short, medium and long term ramifications. In the absence of this research people are very 'emotionally' motivated about leaving rather than making a considered decision.

Having a referendum at this stage is nonsense and there should have been much more consultation and research.

I have seen no fact based information that supports leaving, so if you have some I would be glad to see it Sven.

The EU is 100% un democratic and is a dictatorship at Brussels who wasn't elected or can't be sacked. Tell me that is not true Chief.

I don't like the way it is either, but it is "vaguely democratic".

There are elected MEP's , but I agree there are issues with the election of the top officials. These officials are elected by the national government representatives who are themselves elected. I don't agree with this process, it would be better to have a more open system.

The main issues with the EU are:
1) Their scope is too big. Single Market is a good idea. Political Union is not.
2) National Governments have different interpretations of how to implement EU legislation
3) It's top officials DO appear like a JUNTA

Perhaps there real issue is that if Britain had a less elite political system, the ordinary people might be better served in the UK and in Europe!!

1,they want complete union
2, implementation means we are only gvmnt to abide by legislation, others don't if doesn't suite them.
3, top officials are usually chosen by corupt officials from governments

Blue Gog in spreading lies and half truths shocker.

Notice in that little map he shared it says until 2020? Well guess what happens in 2019. The EU are negotiating the next round of funding and sadly for Wales we are likely to be not receive that amount again. We were lucky too last time, with every poorer regions joining the Union we are going to get bumped up.

I understand why people want to remain for the funding aspect and agree that Westminster are unlikely to invest that much into South Wales. However this funding is going to stop in a few years and we will be saddled with all the negatives of the EU without much of the positives for that I am voting to LEAVE.

Talking of spreading lies and half truths...

It will stop, they are reviewing it in 2019 and we were very close to losing top funding status back when it was last reviewed. At the moment we are getting a lot of money, that point I will concede. However this money will dry up and with all the shit holes joining the EU we will be budged up a bit.

Too much talk about immigration in this thread and others regarding the EU. If you are genuinely out, stop talking about immigration because it's turning many potential out voters off. There's plenty of arguments to leave the EU.

What Utter nonsense it is to suggest that talking about immigration it turning people off voting for Brexit,I would suggest the opposite is true,people who want less immigration will definetly vote leave

Blue Gog in spreading lies and half truths shocker.

Notice in that little map he shared it says until 2020? Well guess what happens in 2019. The EU are negotiating the next round of funding and sadly for Wales we are likely to be not receive that amount again. We were lucky too last time, with every poorer regions joining the Union we are going to get bumped up.

I understand why people want to remain for the funding aspect and agree that Westminster are unlikely to invest that much into South Wales. However this funding is going to stop in a few years and we will be saddled with all the negatives of the EU without much of the positives for that I am voting to LEAVE.

Talking of spreading lies and half truths...

It will stop, they are reviewing it in 2019 and we were very close to losing top funding status back when it was last reviewed. At the moment we are getting a lot of money, that point I will concede. However this money will dry up and with all the shit holes joining the EU we will be budged up a bit.

Too much talk about immigration in this thread and others regarding the EU. If you are genuinely out, stop talking about immigration because it's turning many potential out voters off. There's plenty of arguments to leave the EU.

What Utter nonsense it is to suggest that talking about immigration it turning people off voting for Brexit,I would suggest the opposite is true,people who want less immigration will definetly vote leave

Its not nonsense at all.If your talking about the kind of males you get on this board(generaly white between 17 and 60) then I would agree,however,the population of this country is made up of many ethnic minorities,many millions of which most are second or third generation and are all British citizens.Most of these fellow Brits are becoming increasingly uneasy about the way the Brexit campain is currently conducting itself on the Migrant/Immigration issue and almost all that I know think they will now vote remain after changing their minds.

Oh and the other thing that you won't get the bigoted Tory politicians to admit is that for generations now the immigrant population have always and without exception paid their way and had a positive effect on the economy(balance sheet).

What Utter nonsense it is to suggest that talking about immigration it turning people off voting for Brexit,I would suggest the opposite is true,people who want less immigration will definetly vote leave

Look at the bigger picture you moron, you have just said that everyone who thinks there's too much immigration will vote to leave so why keep laboruing the point? Everytime people rant about immigration there's a few hundred people watching thinking (wrongy) that it's racist. There's plenty of reasons to leave the EU, not just immigration. I am sick off hearing about it from the likes of UKIP, we already know kippers will vote to leave as well as those Labour voters sick of being swamped by immigrants. Now we need the people in between.

What Utter nonsense it is to suggest that talking about immigration it turning people off voting for Brexit,I would suggest the opposite is true,people who want less immigration will definetly vote leave

Look at the bigger picture you moron, you have just said that everyone who thinks there's too much immigration will vote to leave so why keep laboruing the point? Everytime people rant about immigration there's a few hundred people watching thinking (wrongy) that it's racist. There's plenty of reasons to leave the EU, not just immigration. I am sick off hearing about it from the likes of UKIP, we already know kippers will vote to leave as well as those Labour voters sick of being swamped by immigrants. Now we need the people in between.

Is it beyond your limited education to conduct a debate without resorting to name calling

Blue Gog in spreading lies and half truths shocker.

Notice in that little map he shared it says until 2020? Well guess what happens in 2019. The EU are negotiating the next round of funding and sadly for Wales we are likely to be not receive that amount again. We were lucky too last time, with every poorer regions joining the Union we are going to get bumped up.

I understand why people want to remain for the funding aspect and agree that Westminster are unlikely to invest that much into South Wales. However this funding is going to stop in a few years and we will be saddled with all the negatives of the EU without much of the positives for that I am voting to LEAVE.

Talking of spreading lies and half truths...

It will stop, they are reviewing it in 2019 and we were very close to losing top funding status back when it was last reviewed. At the moment we are getting a lot of money, that point I will concede. However this money will dry up and with all the shit holes joining the EU we will be budged up a bit.

Too much talk about immigration in this thread and others regarding the EU. If you are genuinely out, stop talking about immigration because it's turning many potential out voters off. There's plenty of arguments to leave the EU.

What Utter nonsense it is to suggest that talking about immigration it turning people off voting for Brexit,I would suggest the opposite is true,people who want less immigration will definetly vote leave

if people vote soley on the immigration policy then they fools. to change our whole countries future on one issue. that lets be honest we all know it wont change a bit if we vote to leave. you being naive if you think that will happen

Blue Gog in spreading lies and half truths shocker.

Notice in that little map he shared it says until 2020? Well guess what happens in 2019. The EU are negotiating the next round of funding and sadly for Wales we are likely to be not receive that amount again. We were lucky too last time, with every poorer regions joining the Union we are going to get bumped up.

I understand why people want to remain for the funding aspect and agree that Westminster are unlikely to invest that much into South Wales. However this funding is going to stop in a few years and we will be saddled with all the negatives of the EU without much of the positives for that I am voting to LEAVE.

Talking of spreading lies and half truths...

It will stop, they are reviewing it in 2019 and we were very close to losing top funding status back when it was last reviewed. At the moment we are getting a lot of money, that point I will concede. However this money will dry up and with all the shit holes joining the EU we will be budged up a bit.

Too much talk about immigration in this thread and others regarding the EU. If you are genuinely out, stop talking about immigration because it's turning many potential out voters off. There's plenty of arguments to leave the EU.

What Utter nonsense it is to suggest that talking about immigration it turning people off voting for Brexit,I would suggest the opposite is true,people who want less immigration will definetly vote leave

if people vote soley on the immigration policy then they fools. to change our whole countries future on one issue. that lets be honest we all know it wont change a bit if we vote to leave. you being naive if you think that will happen

People tend to vote on what matters most or what is very topical! immigration is high on the agenda and will sway people's views

Blue Gog in spreading lies and half truths shocker.

Notice in that little map he shared it says until 2020? Well guess what happens in 2019. The EU are negotiating the next round of funding and sadly for Wales we are likely to be not receive that amount again. We were lucky too last time, with every poorer regions joining the Union we are going to get bumped up.

I understand why people want to remain for the funding aspect and agree that Westminster are unlikely to invest that much into South Wales. However this funding is going to stop in a few years and we will be saddled with all the negatives of the EU without much of the positives for that I am voting to LEAVE.

Talking of spreading lies and half truths...

It will stop, they are reviewing it in 2019 and we were very close to losing top funding status back when it was last reviewed. At the moment we are getting a lot of money, that point I will concede. However this money will dry up and with all the shit holes joining the EU we will be budged up a bit.

Too much talk about immigration in this thread and others regarding the EU. If you are genuinely out, stop talking about immigration because it's turning many potential out voters off. There's plenty of arguments to leave the EU.

What Utter nonsense it is to suggest that talking about immigration it turning people off voting for Brexit,I would suggest the opposite is true,people who want less immigration will definetly vote leave

if people vote soley on the immigration policy then they fools. to change our whole countries future on one issue. that lets be honest we all know it wont change a bit if we vote to leave. you being naive if you think that will happen

People tend to vote on what matters most or what is very topical! immigration is high on the agenda and will sway people's views

I totally agree with you allan. but just saying immigration wont change if we leave. pretty much everything they voting to leave for wont change.

Let's have a vote to discontinue the English/German royals and vote proper elected people in. Royals out asap

Blue Gog in spreading lies and half truths shocker.

Notice in that little map he shared it says until 2020? Well guess what happens in 2019. The EU are negotiating the next round of funding and sadly for Wales we are likely to be not receive that amount again. We were lucky too last time, with every poorer regions joining the Union we are going to get bumped up.

I understand why people want to remain for the funding aspect and agree that Westminster are unlikely to invest that much into South Wales. However this funding is going to stop in a few years and we will be saddled with all the negatives of the EU without much of the positives for that I am voting to LEAVE.

Talking of spreading lies and half truths...

It will stop, they are reviewing it in 2019 and we were very close to losing top funding status back when it was last reviewed. At the moment we are getting a lot of money, that point I will concede. However this money will dry up and with all the shit holes joining the EU we will be budged up a bit.

Too much talk about immigration in this thread and others regarding the EU. If you are genuinely out, stop talking about immigration because it's turning many potential out voters off. There's plenty of arguments to leave the EU.

What Utter nonsense it is to suggest that talking about immigration it turning people off voting for Brexit,I would suggest the opposite is true,people who want less immigration will definetly vote leave

if people vote soley on the immigration policy then they fools. to change our whole countries future on one issue. that lets be honest we all know it wont change a bit if we vote to leave. you being naive if you think that will happen

People tend to vote on what matters most or what is very topical! immigration is high on the agenda and will sway people's views

I totally agree with you allan. but just saying immigration wont change if we leave. pretty much everything they voting to leave for wont change.

Won't change because we got a spineless bunch of mps who can't say no to Europe!

Out - save Britain from the EUSSR.

Wales wont lose a penny - Britain sends 8bn net a year to the Reich, Wales gets granted £2bn over 6 years (money thats ours anyway).

We'll still trade with the EU, the rest of the world seems to mange it quite comfortably. Immigration on a points based visa system, and deport thousands of foreign criminals who are nothing to do with this country.

Cameron is a a dead man walking..

Wales independence and stay in,Europe!!

I am completely in favour of staying in the EU, however that is not to say I don't think it needs overhauling in certain areas.

In terms of leaving I just don't think we understand the ramifications of it - there has been so little 'facts' based research on short, medium and long term ramifications. In the absence of this research people are very 'emotionally' motivated about leaving rather than making a considered decision.

Having a referendum at this stage is nonsense and there should have been much more consultation and research.

Now that is the problem Chief you can't overhaul something that isn't a democracy and is run like a communist style dictatorship. Cameron tried to overhaul it didn't he ? What happened there ? Yeah they took the piss out of him and he came away with jack shit and believe me he had leverage.
What I don't understand is that most don't realise it isn't democratic and you can't change or even attempt to change the EU laws.
In principle the EU is a good idea but it's ruined by by power hungry Marxist style dictators running the show.
In the world more country's ain't in the EU and do just fine.

Odds on Leaving the EU

https://uk.news.yahoo.com/pictures-week ... 70080.html


Says it all really.

I am completely in favour of staying in the EU, however that is not to say I don't think it needs overhauling in certain areas.

In terms of leaving I just don't think we understand the ramifications of it - there has been so little 'facts' based research on short, medium and long term ramifications. In the absence of this research people are very 'emotionally' motivated about leaving rather than making a considered decision.

Having a referendum at this stage is nonsense and there should have been much more consultation and research.

Now that is the problem Chief you can't overhaul something that isn't a democracy and is run like a communist style dictatorship. Cameron tried to overhaul it didn't he ? What happened there ? Yeah they took the piss out of him and he came away with jack shit and believe me he had leverage.
What I don't understand is that most don't realise it isn't democratic and you can't change or even attempt to change the EU laws.
In principle the EU is a good idea but it's ruined by by power hungry Marxist style dictators running the show.
In the world more country's ain't in the EU and do just fine.

I agree with most of that Nukes, Marxist dictators would probably be MORE democratic than this lot, and that for me is the biggest reason for voting leave, the ABSOLUTE undemocratic nature of the political system of the EU. I voted in the last referendum after the Harold Wilson government attempted to renegotiate the terms of membership. Since the Margaret Thatcher, Major, Blair, Brown and now Cameron have tried to either renegotiate or get agreement on the overhaul of the non democratic political system of the EU. Still our politicians say "Well it isn't perfect but we are better off inside trying to change the EU". BOLLOCKS it will NEVER change whilst the main "Council Of The EU" , the body that negotiates and implements EU Law is made up of non elected political appointments. In my opinion not since the "Doges of Venice" has there been such an undemocratic system of government but one after another our political leaders have shown a complete lack of desire to deal with this. It's UNBELIEVEABLE.

There are many examples of where the law created by this unelected "Council Of The EU" have had a negative effect on the UK and, in my opinion, the biggest relates to the "Free Movement Of Labour". This gives ABSOLUTE freedom for the migration of people across the EU and we now know that as a result the population of the UK has increased by over 2m in the last 5 years.

Unfortunately the LEAVE campaign continually talk about IMMIGRATION in relation to this issue, but immigration means the movement of people across International borders, a process where the UK still has complete control, whist migration means the movement of people within the borders of a single state, a process over which the UK has ABSOLUTELY NO CONTROL thanks to EU law so when people like Nigel Farage say we have lost of our borders he is only saying the truth. For that he is dubbed a racist. Unbelieveable.

Blair had the power to VETO this but he didn't and Cameron talks about us being outside the "Schengen" zone and claims as a result we still control our borders, A LIE, but still people are not waking up to the problems that are ahead of us if we do not get control of our borders back.

Almost ALL areas of our society are being put under pressure because of the level of uncontrolled migration into this country, housing, education, health, transport and employment are suffering and the only way to correct this is to get back control of our borders. To do this we need to exit the EU and as soon as possible.

I am not a racist and I honestly believe that controlled immigration has in the past, is today and will be in the future a massive positive for the UK and absolutely must continue. What has to STOP is the uncontrolled mass migration of people across the EU.

Vote leave and lets get back to the great democratic political system we enjoyed prior to joining this nutcase undemocratic EU we were mad enough to join over 40 years ago.

I am completely in favour of staying in the EU, however that is not to say I don't think it needs overhauling in certain areas.

In terms of leaving I just don't think we understand the ramifications of it - there has been so little 'facts' based research on short, medium and long term ramifications. In the absence of this research people are very 'emotionally' motivated about leaving rather than making a considered decision.

Having a referendum at this stage is nonsense and there should have been much more consultation and research.

Now that is the problem Chief you can't overhaul something that isn't a democracy and is run like a communist style dictatorship. Cameron tried to overhaul it didn't he ? What happened there ? Yeah they took the piss out of him and he came away with jack shit and believe me he had leverage.
What I don't understand is that most don't realise it isn't democratic and you can't change or even attempt to change the EU laws.
In principle the EU is a good idea but it's ruined by by power hungry Marxist style dictators running the show.
In the world more country's ain't in the EU and do just fine.

I agree with most of that Nukes, Marxist dictators would probably be MORE democratic than this lot, and that for me is the biggest reason for voting leave, the ABSOLUTE undemocratic nature of the political system of the EU. I voted in the last referendum after the Harold Wilson government attempted to renegotiate the terms of membership. Since the Margaret Thatcher, Major, Blair, Brown and now Cameron have tried to either renegotiate or get agreement on the overhaul of the non democratic political system of the EU. Still our politicians say "Well it isn't perfect but we are better off inside trying to change the EU". BOLLOCKS it will NEVER change whilst the main "Council Of The EU" , the body that negotiates and implements EU Law is made up of non elected political appointments. In my opinion not since the "Doges of Venice" has there been such an undemocratic system of government but one after another our political leaders have shown a complete lack of desire to deal with this. It's UNBELIEVEABLE.

There are many examples of where the law created by this unelected "Council Of The EU" have had a negative effect on the UK and, in my opinion, the biggest relates to the "Free Movement Of Labour". This gives ABSOLUTE freedom for the migration of people across the EU and we now know that as a result the population of the UK has increased by over 2m in the last 5 years.

Unfortunately the LEAVE campaign continually talk about IMMIGRATION in relation to this issue, but immigration means the movement of people across International borders, a process where the UK still has complete control, whist migration means the movement of people within the borders of a single state, a process over which the UK has ABSOLUTELY NO CONTROL thanks to EU law so when people like Nigel Farage say we have lost of our borders he is only saying the truth. For that he is dubbed a racist. Unbelieveable.

Blair had the power to VETO this but he didn't and Cameron talks about us being outside the "Schengen" zone and claims as a result we still control our borders, A LIE, but still people are not waking up to the problems that are ahead of us if we do not get control of our borders back.

Almost ALL areas of our society are being put under pressure because of the level of uncontrolled migration into this country, housing, education, health, transport and employment are suffering and the only way to correct this is to get back control of our borders. To do this we need to exit the EU and as soon as possible.

I am not a racist and I honestly believe that controlled immigration has in the past, is today and will be in the future a massive positive for the UK and absolutely must continue. What has to STOP is the uncontrolled mass migration of people across the EU.

Vote leave and lets get back to the great democratic political system we enjoyed prior to joining this nutcase undemocratic EU we were mad enough to join over 40 years ago.

I wonder if either you or nuclear blue could actually tell us how the EU works without having to rescherch it first.Last time I looked we had our own unelected body which has been responsible for many changes to government proposed law and when all things are considered haven't done a bad job.

I am completely in favour of staying in the EU, however that is not to say I don't think it needs overhauling in certain areas.

In terms of leaving I just don't think we understand the ramifications of it - there has been so little 'facts' based research on short, medium and long term ramifications. In the absence of this research people are very 'emotionally' motivated about leaving rather than making a considered decision.

Having a referendum at this stage is nonsense and there should have been much more consultation and research.

Now that is the problem Chief you can't overhaul something that isn't a democracy and is run like a communist style dictatorship. Cameron tried to overhaul it didn't he ? What happened there ? Yeah they took the piss out of him and he came away with jack shit and believe me he had leverage.
What I don't understand is that most don't realise it isn't democratic and you can't change or even attempt to change the EU laws.
In principle the EU is a good idea but it's ruined by by power hungry Marxist style dictators running the show.
In the world more country's ain't in the EU and do just fine.

I agree with most of that Nukes, Marxist dictators would probably be MORE democratic than this lot, and that for me is the biggest reason for voting leave, the ABSOLUTE undemocratic nature of the political system of the EU. I voted in the last referendum after the Harold Wilson government attempted to renegotiate the terms of membership. Since the Margaret Thatcher, Major, Blair, Brown and now Cameron have tried to either renegotiate or get agreement on the overhaul of the non democratic political system of the EU. Still our politicians say "Well it isn't perfect but we are better off inside trying to change the EU". BOLLOCKS it will NEVER change whilst the main "Council Of The EU" , the body that negotiates and implements EU Law is made up of non elected political appointments. In my opinion not since the "Doges of Venice" has there been such an undemocratic system of government but one after another our political leaders have shown a complete lack of desire to deal with this. It's UNBELIEVEABLE.

There are many examples of where the law created by this unelected "Council Of The EU" have had a negative effect on the UK and, in my opinion, the biggest relates to the "Free Movement Of Labour". This gives ABSOLUTE freedom for the migration of people across the EU and we now know that as a result the population of the UK has increased by over 2m in the last 5 years.

Unfortunately the LEAVE campaign continually talk about IMMIGRATION in relation to this issue, but immigration means the movement of people across International borders, a process where the UK still has complete control, whist migration means the movement of people within the borders of a single state, a process over which the UK has ABSOLUTELY NO CONTROL thanks to EU law so when people like Nigel Farage say we have lost of our borders he is only saying the truth. For that he is dubbed a racist. Unbelieveable.

Blair had the power to VETO this but he didn't and Cameron talks about us being outside the "Schengen" zone and claims as a result we still control our borders, A LIE, but still people are not waking up to the problems that are ahead of us if we do not get control of our borders back.

Almost ALL areas of our society are being put under pressure because of the level of uncontrolled migration into this country, housing, education, health, transport and employment are suffering and the only way to correct this is to get back control of our borders. To do this we need to exit the EU and as soon as possible.

I am not a racist and I honestly believe that controlled immigration has in the past, is today and will be in the future a massive positive for the UK and absolutely must continue. What has to STOP is the uncontrolled mass migration of people across the EU.

Vote leave and lets get back to the great democratic political system we enjoyed prior to joining this nutcase undemocratic EU we were mad enough to join over 40 years ago.

I wonder if either you or nuclear blue could actually tell us how the EU works without having to rescherch it first.Last time I looked we had our own unelected body which has been responsible for many changes to government proposed law and when all things are considered haven't done a bad job.

Having the House of Lords review legislation is one of the things that makes our political system great although I accept your point that nowadays there are so many political appoints that it can look like an institution created by vested interest.But the main LAW making body of this country remains the House of Commons and that is a directly elected democratic body.

Can you seriously claim that the Council of the EU is the same as the House Of Lords.

How can you say the House of Lords is "great"? They are unelected!

The whole problem with the UK system is that it is "elitist".
Additionally the Media influence political sway, they are also unelected.
As for the House of Commons it is a Public School play ground.

The House of Commons should work on the premise of local communities suggesting local candidates to the parties. It doesn't work this way, the parties suggest candidates to the local communities. This is not "real" democracy.

"Real democracy" starts with the local communities - a bottom up approach, not a top down approach.

I'm all for more referendums - Swiss style democracy. This way the people get a say more often.

This referendum is good because it gets people thinking about politics. Although I am for "staying in the EU", I think that some good points for "exit" have been raised on this forum.