" OFFICIAL - CCFC: PRECARIOUS POSITION AS A GOING CONCERN"

So, is Dalman worried about his loan?

I'm not even sure it's his money , it's unsecured seems weird his wages were basically taken down by 80% at the same point too .hmmmmmm

The truth is your not sure about anything and make it up as you go to protect your heroes

I know as much as you annis , your not itk as much as anyone else, we all got a player or journalist or coach we talk to but 99% of the time as proved on all the breaking news topics recently it turns out to be just that rumours ! . I love this board but come on its getting a bit tiresome of rehashed stories most of which if you delve into can be proven to be bullshit .

The difference is Wez,

I am Honest and Tan and his cronies are running our club like a circus.

Everyone but you can see this and Tan does not care or give a shit about Our Club

Tell me what I've said that isn't honest? ,

99% is disillunal in what you say

Oh the irony on that , come on annis , if there's a way to try and spin an anti board agenda you will try it . If this is what it's going to be all closed season then I'm out of here untill thecseadon starts , then you can have a load of minions licking your ass mate , but I think you need posters like be to balance your hatred out .

Certain people are missing the whole point by a country mile, as has Wez, little knowledge is a dangerous thing.


We know most clubs like a lot of businesses are run on debt that has to be serviced.

What they are somehow missing is the level of growing liability compared to Tans wealth and the omission of his being guarantor etc as this goes up.

His comment about the last 15 years is clueless as the picture has worsened to the point of what's been stated in both reports and also Tan not addressing it by a statement, which causes doubt.

Paul, I see Why you wrote it like that. Some will say all clubs are in the same position etc which is crazy, as it us we are concerned about, not them.


Heads in the sand, clueless and will blindly accept the current situation as they think all clubs are the same. We should be where the likes of Brighton are now, actually better. There's are no excuses and this could all change tomorrow with a phone call.

Certain people are missing the whole point by a country mile, as has Wez, little knowledge is a dangerous thing.


We know most clubs like a lot of businesses are run on debt that has to be serviced.

What they are somehow missing is the level of growing liability compared to Tans wealth and the omission of his being guarantor etc as this goes up.

His comment about the last 15 years is clueless as the picture has worsened to the point of what's been stated in both reports and also Tan not addressing it by a statement, which causes doubt.

The liability is mostly to the owner annis which you keep ignoring, its in every accounts for years I would ask keith to comment but you hounded him off here .the accounts have been out for ages and only today you've got someone else to post this topic . Is this going to be the theme all summer on this board ? .

So, is Dalman worried about his loan?

I'm not even sure it's his money , it's unsecured seems weird his wages were basically taken down by 80% at the same point too .hmmmmmm

The truth is your not sure about anything and make it up as you go to protect your heroes

I know as much as you annis , your not itk as much as anyone else, we all got a player or journalist or coach we talk to but 99% of the time as proved on all the breaking news topics recently it turns out to be just that rumours ! . I love this board but come on its getting a bit tiresome of rehashed stories most of which if you delve into can be proven to be bullshit .

The difference is Wez,

I am Honest and Tan and his cronies are running our club like a circus.

Everyone but you can see this and Tan does not care or give a shit about Our Club

I think you both share a desire like all of us and I mean all of us that we want Tan gone. The difference is in your expectations of how that should happen.

Of course he is putting his interests above that of the clubs . One of you expects Tan to go and lose loads of money and the other sees it as reasonable that he should do so on his own terms.

Didn’t I see you drinking together recently. Don’t let this come between you. You both love CCFC, just see things differently, as we all do on this board

Well said bluelover, there is no question in my mind that Tan wants out but that is not going to happen until the Sala court case is concluded. Best case scenario for all of us is that Tan wins the case with a substantial sum of money, he can then lower his asking price for the club and then hopefully attracting new buyers.

Certain people are missing the whole point by a country mile, as has Wez, little knowledge is a dangerous thing.


We know most clubs like a lot of businesses are run on debt that has to be serviced.

What they are somehow missing is the level of growing liability compared to Tans wealth and the omission of his being guarantor etc as this goes up.

His comment about the last 15 years is clueless as the picture has worsened to the point of what's been stated in both reports and also Tan not addressing it by a statement, which causes doubt.

The liability is mostly to the owner annis which you keep ignoring, its in every accounts for years I would ask keith to comment but you hounded him off here .the accounts have been out for ages and only today you've got someone else to post this topic . Is this going to be the theme all summer on this board ? .

The Owner Wez is now borrowing all the time and charging us interest.

Plus these until we are properly run and know our true future YES it will be.

So where’s the details of the investers who supposedly wanted to buy into City but no longer are?

I thought we were going to have that clarified today!

All we have had is old news rehashed. We all know we are in the shit if pulls the plug..we’ve known that for years!!!

So I assume these supposed investors don’t exist then ??

Nothing new here really but a good reminder of where we are as is the case for many football clubs.

You really do have to be nuts to invest in a football club. Tan knew nothing about football when he saved us and unfortunately has learned nothing since that time. Will always be grateful he did but he really should have put a Director of football in charge from day one.

It’s perfectly understandable he wants his money back as he didn’t do this out of his love for CCFC, and he’s simply not going to sell the club until the Sala case is finally concluded as have no doubts that’s been taken into account re his inflated £200m valuation. The calls for him to sell up to likes of Sam and others for a lesser sum are just pointless at this time.

He isn’t likely to get it via promotion before then unless he finds a manager this season who can work miracles on a budget like McKenna. The alternative would be to gamble money on Bulut and quite frankly in his position that would be utter madness based on the past season.

I think we are all just have to accept that this season is going to be a write off unfortunately unless we can somehow unearth a McKenna like appointment.

Again, like others, you miss the point and the fact that this really is new news where both Directors and Auditors call the club in a 'precarious' position with no written guarantee from the owner...

No one has said we will go under. Indeed, even Tan's fiercest critic states he won't let that happen but the current direction without a touch of the Warnock luck is at best stagnation and probably a slip back to the relegatiin fight and/or worse...

Something needs to happen and it's currently all in one man's hands...

It’s not new news at all though. Have a look at the previous accounts for 2020, 2021 and 2022. Same statement in the accounts. See this all the time as I review annual accounts regularly in my job. It’s not good but not unusual for companies being propped up by wealthy owners, especially unsuccessfully run football clubs which unfortunately there are many with such a differential in money available in the top tier.

Thank you for your interesting response

Where I believe the error is being made is that this is not 'old news' as the 'big picture' has changed massively...

The owner's 'liability' was low 15 years ago and a smaller percentage of his given wealth, so the 'macro picture' now is completely different because 'the club' technically owes him around a quarter of his (now) family's wealth; something we already know they are not 'happy' with and would like an early return on...

He/they do not want him to take more 'risk' by risking what they deem more 'unecessary' money, which leaves him with only the financial 'loan' market to play with (this is what I believe he has done with his so called 'loans' from Dalman and another third party) in order to pay off existing loans, service 'debt', buy/loan players, etc.

What we all (should) know is that we won't go into Administration; but what we do know is that people with credibility in the area plus the Directors and Auditors have stated we are in a 'precarious position as a going concern' (it's in the papers) and 'debts and liabilities are still rising'

As the OP's statement asks, "How long will VT continue to fund us?", "How long will he continue to fund us?", and "What is his plan to get a return on his money and make a graceful exit?"

For me and other, this is now a serious situation...

Certain people are missing the whole point by a country mile, as has Wez, little knowledge is a dangerous thing.


We know most clubs like a lot of businesses are run on debt that has to be serviced.

What they are somehow missing is the level of growing liability compared to Tans wealth and the omission of his being guarantor etc as this goes up.

His comment about the last 15 years is clueless as the picture has worsened to the point of what's been stated in both reports and also Tan not addressing it by a statement, which causes doubt.

The liability is mostly to the owner annis which you keep ignoring, its in every accounts for years I would ask keith to comment but you hounded him off here .the accounts have been out for ages and only today you've got someone else to post this topic . Is this going to be the theme all summer on this board ? .

The Owner Wez is now borrowing all the time and charging us interest.

Plus these until we are properly run and know our true future YES it will be.

dalmans loan was in 2018 , the 19 million recently was off Tans Malaysian company you bang in about 9% thats peanuts for high risk unsecured borrowing , but Tan continues each sesson to write off 10s of millions or convert it to equity, annis you can spin it as much as you like it costs us nothing in reality as it's all written off . The Court cases havnt cost us a penny as a club but 100% it's costs Tan, the accounts don't lie look at the write offs and the debt to equity. You can fool the uneducated with the spin but anyone with half a business brain will know that Tan takes the hit each season .

Breaking news ,Tan is propping us up.... He has been for ten years.

Everyone is wanting him gone and I'm with you... For the right owner. Whomever takes us over will need to support us like Tan has or invest massively to get us to the PL. Think about it, Leeds brought three players off the bench to play the last five minutes against us with a value of around 30m... They're in the playoffs.

If Tan goes and we get some.sort of "constormtium" of "football people" with limit funds the only way is down... Or worse!!!!

Wez, you take some pelters on here, but not many respond when you (constantly I may add), quote the finances through annual reports. That is one of the few "sources of actual truth" that anyone can go and read; they wont because its a boring read... but there in black and white.

Alot of valid opinion gets pinged back, but very rarely at your references to the report!



We're skint - its the elephant in the room for years.

Wez, you take some pelters on here, but not many respond when you (constantly I may add), quote the finances through annual reports. That is one of the few "sources of actual truth" that anyone can go and read; they wont because its a boring read... but there in black and white.

Alot of valid opinion gets pinged back, but very rarely at your references to the report!



We're skint - its the elephant in the room for years.

Exactly, it's not that I'm a " tan lover" as he's a bit of a weirdo but I can see through the bullshit posted on here, in reality he's propping us up , and I'm would be thankfull to any owner whoever it's is for doing that .

Breaking news ,Tan is propping us up.... He has been for ten years.

Everyone is wanting him gone and I'm with you... For the right owner. Whomever takes us over will need to support us like Tan has or invest massively to get us to the PL. Think about it, Leeds brought three players off the bench to play the last five minutes against us with a value of around 30m... They're in the playoffs.

If Tan goes and we get some.sort of "constormtium" of "football people" with limit funds the only way is down... Or worse!!!!

Exactly be carefully what you wish for we Nedd someone to lose at least 10 million a season. I can't see many being willing to do that .

Why the worry from normal folk 6000 miles away? A very rich man has made a poor investment.

Let's imagine Tan has pumped in all the money for those monstrous flats being built in the Brains brewery ground and the property markets crash and lose half their value, do the tenants start panicking? No and they have more to worry about.

The poor bloke is trapped, I don't care, investments go up and they go down, it must be a bit of a bind being down to your last $500 mill.....The quicker the Sala case is sorted the better

1) He sells at a loss and simmers
2) His kids inherit and they sell very quickly
3) He gambles more and tries to make us more appealing
4) He hopes for another Warnock-type miracle, so keeps ticking along

bleeding us dry doesn't help imrpve the asset.

I think he is option 4 land.

I still come in peace, there are some shoppers on here, your a divided club just like us, as an outsider your owner needs to move on and you lot need to give him a push.
We have dreadful owners

Why the worry from normal folk 6000 miles away? A very rich man has made a poor investment.

Let's imagine Tan has pumped in all the money for those monstrous flats being built in the Brains brewery ground and the property markets crash and lose half their value, do the tenants start panicking? No and they have more to worry about.

The poor bloke is trapped, I don't care, investments go up and they go down, it must be a bit of a bind being down to your last $500 mill.....The quicker the Sala case is sorted the better

1) He sells at a loss and simmers
2) His kids inherit and they sell very quickly
3) He gambles more and tries to make us more appealing
4) He hopes for another Warnock-type miracle, so keeps ticking along

bleeding us dry doesn't help imrpve the asset.

I think he is option 4 land.

Agree, we are only ever one manager away from promotion as I keep telling annis .

Certain people are missing the whole point by a country mile, as has Wez, little knowledge is a dangerous thing.


We know most clubs like a lot of businesses are run on debt that has to be serviced.

What they are somehow missing is the level of growing liability compared to Tans wealth and the omission of his being guarantor etc as this goes up.

His comment about the last 15 years is clueless as the picture has worsened to the point of what's been stated in both reports and also Tan not addressing it by a statement, which causes doubt.

The liability is mostly to the owner annis which you keep ignoring, its in every accounts for years I would ask keith to comment but you hounded him off here .the accounts have been out for ages and only today you've got someone else to post this topic . Is this going to be the theme all summer on this board ? .

You are wrong if you think I posted this as I was asked to by Annis or indeed anybody else. Like you, I'm my own man and make my own mind up in all things. And as said, I'm am not anti Tan, I am pro Cardiff City and I am also realistic and pragmatic.

Our situation is a cause for concern. So much so that both the directors and auditors say so. Our ability to operate as a going concern is precarious given that fact and the "exam questions" are what you should be concerned about.

And again, the fact that VT has for some reason chosen not to state in the report that he is able or willing to continually to fund us, thus allying the concern, surely must cast some doubt in even the most realistically optimistic of us?

If you are personally not, it's your opinion which I duly respect, as I do for a few others, who for some reason don't see this ongoing situation as a red flag.

Why the worry from normal folk 6000 miles away? A very rich man has made a poor investment.

Let's imagine Tan has pumped in all the money for those monstrous flats being built in the Brains brewery ground and the property markets crash and lose half their value, do the tenants start panicking? No and they have more to worry about.

The poor bloke is trapped, I don't care, investments go up and they go down, it must be a bit of a bind being down to your last $500 mill.....The quicker the Sala case is sorted the better

1) He sells at a loss and simmers
2) His kids inherit and they sell very quickly
3) He gambles more and tries to make us more appealing
4) He hopes for another Warnock-type miracle, so keeps ticking along

bleeding us dry doesn't help imrpve the asset.

I think he is option 4 land.

Agree, we are only ever one manager away from promotion as I keep telling annis .

Really lol

We could not even make the play offs due to lack of investment.

Plus 15 years later are we Debt Free as promised???

Certain people are missing the whole point by a country mile, as has Wez, little knowledge is a dangerous thing.


We know most clubs like a lot of businesses are run on debt that has to be serviced.

What they are somehow missing is the level of growing liability compared to Tans wealth and the omission of his being guarantor etc as this goes up.

His comment about the last 15 years is clueless as the picture has worsened to the point of what's been stated in both reports and also Tan not addressing it by a statement, which causes doubt.

The liability is mostly to the owner annis which you keep ignoring, its in every accounts for years I would ask keith to comment but you hounded him off here .the accounts have been out for ages and only today you've got someone else to post this topic . Is this going to be the theme all summer on this board ? .

You are wrong if you think I posted this as I was asked to by Annis or indeed anybody else. Like you, I'm my own man and make my own mind up in all things. And as said, I'm am not anti Tan, I am pro Cardiff City and I am also realistic and pragmatic.

Our situation is a cause for concern. So much so that both the directors and auditors say so. Our ability to operate as a going concern is precarious given that fact and the "exam questions" are what you should be concerned about.

And again, the fact that VT has for some reason chosen not to state in the report that he is able or willing to continually to fund us, thus allying the concern, surely must cast some doubt in even the most realistically optimistic of us?

If you are personally not, it's your opinion which I duly respect, as I do for a few others, who for some reason don't see this ongoing situation as a red flag.

Curiosity if tan wont let club go into administration
What does that mean for club? He Stays on at club until he dies and family sell for best offer or the hit for tan becomes to much for him? Red flags precarious position suggests we could go under but if Tan won’t let's us go into administration how will we go under? Don't understand how can we do both ....

Certain people are missing the whole point by a country mile, as has Wez, little knowledge is a dangerous thing.


We know most clubs like a lot of businesses are run on debt that has to be serviced.

What they are somehow missing is the level of growing liability compared to Tans wealth and the omission of his being guarantor etc as this goes up.

His comment about the last 15 years is clueless as the picture has worsened to the point of what's been stated in both reports and also Tan not addressing it by a statement, which causes doubt.

The liability is mostly to the owner annis which you keep ignoring, its in every accounts for years I would ask keith to comment but you hounded him off here .the accounts have been out for ages and only today you've got someone else to post this topic . Is this going to be the theme all summer on this board ? .

You are wrong if you think I posted this as I was asked to by Annis or indeed anybody else. Like you, I'm my own man and make my own mind up in all things. And as said, I'm am not anti Tan, I am pro Cardiff City and I am also realistic and pragmatic.

Our situation is a cause for concern. So much so that both the directors and auditors say so. Our ability to operate as a going concern is precarious given that fact and the "exam questions" are what you should be concerned about.

And again, the fact that VT has for some reason chosen not to state in the report that he is able or willing to continually to fund us, thus allying the concern, surely must cast some doubt in even the most realistically optimistic of us?

If you are personally not, it's your opinion which I duly respect, as I do for a few others, who for some reason don't see this ongoing situation as a red flag.

Curiosity if tan wont let club go into administration
What does that mean for club? He Stays on at club until he dies and family sell for best offer or the hit for tan becomes to much for him? Red flags precarious position suggests we could go under but if Tan won’t let's us go into administration how will we go under? Don't understand how can we do both ....

These are the things that puzzle me too Al.

Certain people are missing the whole point by a country mile, as has Wez, little knowledge is a dangerous thing.


We know most clubs like a lot of businesses are run on debt that has to be serviced.

What they are somehow missing is the level of growing liability compared to Tans wealth and the omission of his being guarantor etc as this goes up.

His comment about the last 15 years is clueless as the picture has worsened to the point of what's been stated in both reports and also Tan not addressing it by a statement, which causes doubt.

The liability is mostly to the owner annis which you keep ignoring, its in every accounts for years I would ask keith to comment but you hounded him off here .the accounts have been out for ages and only today you've got someone else to post this topic . Is this going to be the theme all summer on this board ? .

You are wrong if you think I posted this as I was asked to by Annis or indeed anybody else. Like you, I'm my own man and make my own mind up in all things. And as said, I'm am not anti Tan, I am pro Cardiff City and I am also realistic and pragmatic.

Our situation is a cause for concern. So much so that both the directors and auditors say so. Our ability to operate as a going concern is precarious given that fact and the "exam questions" are what you should be concerned about.

And again, the fact that VT has for some reason chosen not to state in the report that he is able or willing to continually to fund us, thus allying the concern, surely must cast some doubt in even the most realistically optimistic of us?

If you are personally not, it's your opinion which I duly respect, as I do for a few others, who for some reason don't see this ongoing situation as a red flag.

Curiosity if tan wont let club go into administration
What does that mean for club? He Stays on at club until he dies and family sell for best offer or the hit for tan becomes to much for him? Red flags precarious position suggests we could go under but if Tan won’t let's us go into administration how will we go under? Don't understand how can we do both ....

These are the things that puzzle me too Al.

I've no doubt we are insolvent income wise but does tan need to get on a soap box and say he won't stop funding club to aley fears? To my mind if won't go into administration it means he will fund club until he cannot do so or doesnt want to but that means he will sell .... unless of course he only wants 10p in pound from administration.

Reply:

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I haven't read the entire thread, I don't want to and I don't have time to.

One thing though which I read, I have to ask a question of.

Annis, you will have seen that I am vocal about getting Tan out, but you mentioned that Tan is borrowing money etc, so my question is this:

Why is Tan borrowing money any different to Sam borrowing money? We all know that Sam borrowed money and it ran out.

Why is it different that Tan is?

Certain people are missing the whole point by a country mile, as has Wez, little knowledge is a dangerous thing.


We know most clubs like a lot of businesses are run on debt that has to be serviced.

What they are somehow missing is the level of growing liability compared to Tans wealth and the omission of his being guarantor etc as this goes up.

His comment about the last 15 years is clueless as the picture has worsened to the point of what's been stated in both reports and also Tan not addressing it by a statement, which causes doubt.

The liability is mostly to the owner annis which you keep ignoring, its in every accounts for years I would ask keith to comment but you hounded him off here .the accounts have been out for ages and only today you've got someone else to post this topic . Is this going to be the theme all summer on this board ? .

You are wrong if you think I posted this as I was asked to by Annis or indeed anybody else. Like you, I'm my own man and make my own mind up in all things. And as said, I'm am not anti Tan, I am pro Cardiff City and I am also realistic and pragmatic.

Our situation is a cause for concern. So much so that both the directors and auditors say so. Our ability to operate as a going concern is precarious given that fact and the "exam questions" are what you should be concerned about.

And again, the fact that VT has for some reason chosen not to state in the report that he is able or willing to continually to fund us, thus allying the concern, surely must cast some doubt in even the most realistically optimistic of us?

If you are personally not, it's your opinion which I duly respect, as I do for a few others, who for some reason don't see this ongoing situation as a red flag.

Curiosity if tan wont let club go into administration
What does that mean for club? He Stays on at club until he dies and family sell for best offer or the hit for tan becomes to much for him? Red flags precarious position suggests we could go under but if Tan won’t let's us go into administration how will we go under? Don't understand how can we do both ....

I'm not convinced that VT knows what to do Al. We know he wants out and a large part of his money back but what's the realistic plan of doing it?

He could coast along and continue firefighting, which I think he will as it's his default mode. And hope for a shot at the playoffs, "with a bit of luck" and with a restricted budget. Who knows?

But as I said, the questions given the clear issue, and it couldn't be any clearer and confirmed by publicly available facts remain.


1: How long will Tan continue to fund us?

2: How long can Tan continue to fund us?

3: What is Tans Plan?

And let's assume that funding is not an issue for a moment. Even with that, VT will behave exactly the same and get exactly the same results.

Even Blakey said that the structure of the club has to change. It couldn't be anymore obvious. And until VT sells or makes those changes, the status quo remains.

So given that and the official statements of concerns plus VTs family business finances, as they want their money back ASAP and out, something has to give.

I haven't read the entire thread, I don't want to and I don't have time to.

One thing though which I read, I have to ask a question of.

Annis, you will have seen that I am vocal about getting Tan out, but you mentioned that Tan is borrowing money etc, so my question is this:

Why is Tan borrowing money any different to Sam borrowing money? We all know that Sam borrowed money and it ran out.

Why is it different that Tan is?

Because Tan said this could not happen or any interest incurred, etc etc

And initially said we would be debt-free with in 5 yrs

It’s 15 yrs now.

Plus I chatted to Tan for nearly 4hrs and he lied beyond.

Certain people are missing the whole point by a country mile, as has Wez, little knowledge is a dangerous thing.


We know most clubs like a lot of businesses are run on debt that has to be serviced.

What they are somehow missing is the level of growing liability compared to Tans wealth and the omission of his being guarantor etc as this goes up.

His comment about the last 15 years is clueless as the picture has worsened to the point of what's been stated in both reports and also Tan not addressing it by a statement, which causes doubt.

The liability is mostly to the owner annis which you keep ignoring, its in every accounts for years I would ask keith to comment but you hounded him off here .the accounts have been out for ages and only today you've got someone else to post this topic . Is this going to be the theme all summer on this board ? .

You are wrong if you think I posted this as I was asked to by Annis or indeed anybody else. Like you, I'm my own man and make my own mind up in all things. And as said, I'm am not anti Tan, I am pro Cardiff City and I am also realistic and pragmatic.

Our situation is a cause for concern. So much so that both the directors and auditors say so. Our ability to operate as a going concern is precarious given that fact and the "exam questions" are what you should be concerned about.

And again, the fact that VT has for some reason chosen not to state in the report that he is able or willing to continually to fund us, thus allying the concern, surely must cast some doubt in even the most realistically optimistic of us?

If you are personally not, it's your opinion which I duly respect, as I do for a few others, who for some reason don't see this ongoing situation as a red flag.

Curiosity if tan wont let club go into administration
What does that mean for club? He Stays on at club until he dies and family sell for best offer or the hit for tan becomes to much for him? Red flags precarious position suggests we could go under but if Tan won’t let's us go into administration how will we go under? Don't understand how can we do both ....

I'm not convinced that VT knows what to do Al. We know he wants out and a large part of his money back but what's the realistic plan of doing it?

He could coast along and continue firefighting, which I think he will as it's his default mode. And hope for a shot at the playoffs, "with a bit of luck" and with a restricted budget. Who knows?

But as I said, the questions given the clear issue, and it couldn't be any clearer and confirmed by publicly available facts remain.


1: How long will Tan continue to fund us?

2: How long can Tan continue to fund us?

3: What is Tans Plan?

And let's assume that funding is not an issue for a moment. Even with that, VT will behave exactly the same and get exactly the same results.

Even Blakey said that the structure of the club has to change. It couldn't be anymore obvious. And until VT sells or makes those changes, the status quo remains.

So given that and the official statements of concerns plus VTs family business finances, as they want their money back ASAP and out, something has to give.

Is this statement just a smokescreen to mean won't be spending anything in window other than what is nessasary ? I just find it odd to leave more questions than answers like the 3 questions you've just put... not sure he needs to say if going to fund club simply because not many on here would believe him plus been doing it for years ... personally I'm a pragmatist and worry/rejoice about things if and when know they're happening.

I haven't read the entire thread, I don't want to and I don't have time to.

One thing though which I read, I have to ask a question of.

Annis, you will have seen that I am vocal about getting Tan out, but you mentioned that Tan is borrowing money etc, so my question is this:

Why is Tan borrowing money any different to Sam borrowing money? We all know that Sam borrowed money and it ran out.

Why is it different that Tan is?

Because Tan said this could not happen or any interest incurred, etc etc

And initially said we would be debt-free with in 5 yrs

It’s 15 yrs now.

Plus I chatted to Tan for nearly 4hrs and he lied beyond.

And what did he say when he left "there will be a Red revolution".

Besides not understanding the culture of a football club but that day he showed how deluded he was.

Certain people are missing the whole point by a country mile, as has Wez, little knowledge is a dangerous thing.


We know most clubs like a lot of businesses are run on debt that has to be serviced.

What they are somehow missing is the level of growing liability compared to Tans wealth and the omission of his being guarantor etc as this goes up.

His comment about the last 15 years is clueless as the picture has worsened to the point of what's been stated in both reports and also Tan not addressing it by a statement, which causes doubt.

The liability is mostly to the owner annis which you keep ignoring, its in every accounts for years I would ask keith to comment but you hounded him off here .the accounts have been out for ages and only today you've got someone else to post this topic . Is this going to be the theme all summer on this board ? .

You are wrong if you think I posted this as I was asked to by Annis or indeed anybody else. Like you, I'm my own man and make my own mind up in all things. And as said, I'm am not anti Tan, I am pro Cardiff City and I am also realistic and pragmatic.

Our situation is a cause for concern. So much so that both the directors and auditors say so. Our ability to operate as a going concern is precarious given that fact and the "exam questions" are what you should be concerned about.

And again, the fact that VT has for some reason chosen not to state in the report that he is able or willing to continually to fund us, thus allying the concern, surely must cast some doubt in even the most realistically optimistic of us?

If you are personally not, it's your opinion which I duly respect, as I do for a few others, who for some reason don't see this ongoing situation as a red flag.

Curiosity if tan wont let club go into administration
What does that mean for club? He Stays on at club until he dies and family sell for best offer or the hit for tan becomes to much for him? Red flags precarious position suggests we could go under but if Tan won’t let's us go into administration how will we go under? Don't understand how can we do both ....

I'm not convinced that VT knows what to do Al. We know he wants out and a large part of his money back but what's the realistic plan of doing it?

He could coast along and continue firefighting, which I think he will as it's his default mode. And hope for a shot at the playoffs, "with a bit of luck" and with a restricted budget. Who knows?

But as I said, the questions given the clear issue, and it couldn't be any clearer and confirmed by publicly available facts remain.


1: How long will Tan continue to fund us?

2: How long can Tan continue to fund us?

3: What is Tans Plan?

And let's assume that funding is not an issue for a moment. Even with that, VT will behave exactly the same and get exactly the same results.

Even Blakey said that the structure of the club has to change. It couldn't be anymore obvious. And until VT sells or makes those changes, the status quo remains.

So given that and the official statements of concerns plus VTs family business finances, as they want their money back ASAP and out, something has to give.

Is this statement just a smokescreen to mean won't be spending anything in window other than what is nessasary ? I just find it odd to leave more questions than answers like the 3 questions you've just put... not sure he needs to say if going to fund club simply because not many on here would believe him plus been doing it for years ... personally I'm a pragmatist and worry/rejoice about things if and when know they're happening.

It's not a smokescreen Al but I know what you mean, as people even mentioned FFP last Jan as being used for the same purpose.

It's an official statement of identified concern as to us being a going concern. If you were reading it and it was about another club and they were in the same position, it would be an immediate red flag. If you were a potential investor, it would or may put you off due to the risk.

I can't really add much more other than what I've detailed. Actually, I can.

1: The ES case is prominent in the exec summary. This must factor into VTs thinking about future finance I would have thought, as it sticks out.

2: Our energy costs are a big burden, as they are to all businesses.

I might email the club and suggest they switch suppliers and get a smart meter.

Most would like him to leave but as I've said before and will keep repeating, he won't be going anywhere until the whole sorry Sala saga is done & dusted as I think this is where he thinks he is losing face, once that's all done I think he will be off.

Certain people are missing the whole point by a country mile, as has Wez, little knowledge is a dangerous thing.


We know most clubs like a lot of businesses are run on debt that has to be serviced.

What they are somehow missing is the level of growing liability compared to Tans wealth and the omission of his being guarantor etc as this goes up.

His comment about the last 15 years is clueless as the picture has worsened to the point of what's been stated in both reports and also Tan not addressing it by a statement, which causes doubt.

The liability is mostly to the owner annis which you keep ignoring, its in every accounts for years I would ask keith to comment but you hounded him off here .the accounts have been out for ages and only today you've got someone else to post this topic . Is this going to be the theme all summer on this board ? .

The Owner Wez is now borrowing all the time and charging us interest.

Plus these until we are properly run and know our true future YES it will be.

dalmans loan was in 2018 , the 19 million recently was off Tans Malaysian company you bang in about 9% thats peanuts for high risk unsecured borrowing , but Tan continues each sesson to write off 10s of millions or convert it to equity, annis you can spin it as much as you like it costs us nothing in reality as it's all written off . The Court cases havnt cost us a penny as a club but 100% it's costs Tan, the accounts don't lie look at the write offs and the debt to equity. You can fool the uneducated with the spin but anyone with half a business brain will know that Tan takes the hit each season .

If what you say is correct on the Tan taking the hit on court costs why on earth would any supporter in their right mind be against him taking these court cases ?

I’m glad you’ve pointed that out because I don’t think any of the prime anti-Tan posters have ever acknowledged that !! It’s all about how much Tan is costing us in court costs.

There’s a few people on here need to have a think about that issue alone and reassess their position if they have a brain cell or even care about this club.

I would love to see a change in ownership but I ain’t going to lie about the current regime to back up the argument.