' POLL ' How would you vote on eu today?

How can you say the House of Lords is "great"? They are unelected!

The whole problem with the UK system is that it is "elitist".
Additionally the Media influence political sway, they are also unelected.
As for the House of Commons it is a Public School play ground.

The House of Commons should work on the premise of local communities suggesting local candidates to the parties. It doesn't work this way, the parties suggest candidates to the local communities. This is not "real" democracy.

"Real democracy" starts with the local communities - a bottom up approach, not a top down approach.

I'm all for more referendums - Swiss style democracy. This way the people get a say more often.

This referendum is good because it gets people thinking about politics. Although I am for "staying in the EU", I think that some good points for "exit" have been raised on this forum.

A Public School play ground I would love to see you debate that with Dennis Skinner.

I think there are about 1/3 of our MP's who attended Public Schools, mainly Conservatives, but to reach Parliament they do have to go through an election where the "Local Community" will decide if they are the right person to represent them and what % of them attended Public School.

That's democracy at work isn't it.

This validates my point. Read my message again.

- The ratio of politicians that are public school is a higher percentage of the population than are not. This is elitist.
- The local community can only vote on the chosen candidates. My point was they should be more involved in proposing them.

I am a believer in equal opportunity, not necessarily equal outcome. Quality free education should be a right for all, including up to University level.

Dennis Skinner would agree with me on this. He attended Ruskin College in Oxford whose very purpose was to provide education for those from backgrounds with limited resources.

This validates my point. Read my message again.

- The ratio of politicians that are public school is a higher percentage of the population than are not. This is elitist.
- The local community can only vote on the chosen candidates. My point was they should be more involved in proposing them.

I am a believer in equal opportunity, not necessarily equal outcome. Quality free education should be a right for all, including up to University level.

Dennis Skinner would agree with me on this. He attended Ruskin College in Oxford whose very purpose was to provide education for those from backgrounds with limited resources.

So as a believer in equal opportunity you would not support the all female candidate list required by the Labour party or the conservative A list both of which were trying to rid parliament of it's "Boys Club" reputation. Sometimes positive discrimination can be a good thing and has delivered greater diversity in the selection of candidates process even if as you say it appears controlled by the parties themselves.

However whoever is selected has to go through an election process and that's democracy.

I 100% agree with your point on quality free education for all, tuition fees are a national disgrace and should be abolished at the earliest opportunity. Maybe the money saved on leaving the EU could be better used making sure anyone who wants to attend university can do so with being saddled with huge debt.

I'm not suggesting "positive discrimination" or closing Public Schools.

I don't have an issue with Public Schools if education is free up to university level for all. I see education as basic right not a service to be paid for, but those who want to pay are free to do so.

I am completely in favour of staying in the EU, however that is not to say I don't think it needs overhauling in certain areas.

In terms of leaving I just don't think we understand the ramifications of it - there has been so little 'facts' based research on short, medium and long term ramifications. In the absence of this research people are very 'emotionally' motivated about leaving rather than making a considered decision.

Having a referendum at this stage is nonsense and there should have been much more consultation and research.

Now that is the problem Chief you can't overhaul something that isn't a democracy and is run like a communist style dictatorship. Cameron tried to overhaul it didn't he ? What happened there ? Yeah they took the piss out of him and he came away with jack shit and believe me he had leverage.
What I don't understand is that most don't realise it isn't democratic and you can't change or even attempt to change the EU laws.
In principle the EU is a good idea but it's ruined by by power hungry Marxist style dictators running the show.
In the world more country's ain't in the EU and do just fine.

I agree with most of that Nukes, Marxist dictators would probably be MORE democratic than this lot, and that for me is the biggest reason for voting leave, the ABSOLUTE undemocratic nature of the political system of the EU. I voted in the last referendum after the Harold Wilson government attempted to renegotiate the terms of membership. Since the Margaret Thatcher, Major, Blair, Brown and now Cameron have tried to either renegotiate or get agreement on the overhaul of the non democratic political system of the EU. Still our politicians say "Well it isn't perfect but we are better off inside trying to change the EU". BOLLOCKS it will NEVER change whilst the main "Council Of The EU" , the body that negotiates and implements EU Law is made up of non elected political appointments. In my opinion not since the "Doges of Venice" has there been such an undemocratic system of government but one after another our political leaders have shown a complete lack of desire to deal with this. It's UNBELIEVEABLE.

There are many examples of where the law created by this unelected "Council Of The EU" have had a negative effect on the UK and, in my opinion, the biggest relates to the "Free Movement Of Labour". This gives ABSOLUTE freedom for the migration of people across the EU and we now know that as a result the population of the UK has increased by over 2m in the last 5 years.

Unfortunately the LEAVE campaign continually talk about IMMIGRATION in relation to this issue, but immigration means the movement of people across International borders, a process where the UK still has complete control, whist migration means the movement of people within the borders of a single state, a process over which the UK has ABSOLUTELY NO CONTROL thanks to EU law so when people like Nigel Farage say we have lost of our borders he is only saying the truth. For that he is dubbed a racist. Unbelieveable.

Blair had the power to VETO this but he didn't and Cameron talks about us being outside the "Schengen" zone and claims as a result we still control our borders, A LIE, but still people are not waking up to the problems that are ahead of us if we do not get control of our borders back.

Almost ALL areas of our society are being put under pressure because of the level of uncontrolled migration into this country, housing, education, health, transport and employment are suffering and the only way to correct this is to get back control of our borders. To do this we need to exit the EU and as soon as possible.

I am not a racist and I honestly believe that controlled immigration has in the past, is today and will be in the future a massive positive for the UK and absolutely must continue. What has to STOP is the uncontrolled mass migration of people across the EU.

Vote leave and lets get back to the great democratic political system we enjoyed prior to joining this nutcase undemocratic EU we were mad enough to join over 40 years ago.

I wonder if either you or nuclear blue could actually tell us how the EU works without having to rescherch it first.Last time I looked we had our own unelected body which has been responsible for many changes to government proposed law and when all things are considered haven't done a bad job.

Having the House of Lords review legislation is one of the things that makes our political system great although I accept your point that nowadays there are so many political appoints that it can look like an institution created by vested interest.But the main LAW making body of this country remains the House of Commons and that is a directly elected democratic body.

Can you seriously claim that the Council of the EU is the same as the House Of Lords.

If your point is an un-elected body able to effect the making of laws then yes.My other main point you seemed to have dodged,that is,do you know the way the EU works and could you explain it in detail or are you dependent on that great closet bigot of our time,Boris Johnstone and his cronies.

From a Welsh perspective we have to vote to remain in the EU.

If we leave then an Eton dominated parliament at Westminster will crush any notion of Welsh identity, economic needs, and ambition.

Don't go along with Sun reading English bigots - stand up for Wales!

From a Welsh perspective we have to vote to remain in the EU.

If we leave then an Eton dominated parliament at Westminster will crush any notion of Welsh identity, economic needs, and ambition.

Don't go along with Sun reading English bigots - stand up for Wales!

f**k me,well said mate.At last someone who has actually looked beyond the brexit bullshit and see these Tories for what they are.But alas,your in a jungle of ignorance here.Tabloid press are regarded as the word of god by most on here.

From a Welsh perspective we have to vote to remain in the EU.

If we leave then an Eton dominated parliament at Westminster will crush any notion of Welsh identity, economic needs, and ambition.

Don't go along with Sun reading English bigots - stand up for Wales!

Why has Wales got to stay in the EU ? Ohh they give us money to build roads and swimming pools, but then again it's the United Kingdoms money anyway. It's like me giving you a hundred quid and then me being grateful that you give me £2.50 back.

For every £1 a Welsh tax payer pays into the Government that then pays the "£50million a day bill" to the eu, Wales receives £7 back! Do the math. Do you really think we as a nation (Wales) will thrive outside the EU. Torys are rubbing their hands together as they win both Wales.

Our uk border will move (which is currently in France), which will force immigration to rise apeven further. Bloody hell, let's all read the sun but then slag it off

Remain!!!!

From a Welsh perspective we have to vote to remain in the EU.

If we leave then an Eton dominated parliament at Westminster will crush any notion of Welsh identity, economic needs, and ambition.

Don't go along with Sun reading English bigots - stand up for Wales!

Why has Wales got to stay in the EU ? Ohh they give us money to build roads and swimming pools, but then again it's the United Kingdoms money anyway. It's like me giving you a hundred quid and then me being grateful that you give me £2.50 back.

Up here its cycle paths to nowhere and road that hardly gets used are being proudly advertisd as euro money!

People forget that if we vote out of the eu. Then we voting to let all those immigrants from the jungle come over and set up camp in the uk. Because if we out of the eu one of our eu partners are currently keeping the problem In They country. Plus more when they realise Europe will let them all pass through with next to no reinsurance and maybe some help to board the ferries in calis. Believe me people who's prime motive is voting out because of migrants, think again because you probably going to increase it.

Most countries now in the eu are also having enough of immigration and In years things will change and eu will have it under control. They will we won't. By then we be so broke with all the loss of jobs over run by immigrants we have no jobs for a recession, Scotland wanting out of this mess. England wanting wales of they uncontrollable wage bill. And begging them for help, and they laugh at us with our current we better than you attitude, and wave another boat of migrants off. While on our side loads of us will by paying smugglers to get in to Europe and they jobs. But it fail because they have stringent immigrations laws on people fro. Outside the eu.

Or on the other hand it may work to be the thing that's happened to the country and we grow and grow that we have more jobs than we know what to do with. And the. The people you see on these benifits programmes that never worked in they life get the jobs they clearly don't want, as they can't say the immigrants have stolen my job.



Disclaimer for all the sensitive people out there this is a massive tongue in cheek post with none side fe to back it up at all.

Lol.

The valleys does well out of the eu. People not educated enough on the subject to vote! !!!!!!!

I am completely in favour of staying in the EU, however that is not to say I don't think it needs overhauling in certain areas.

In terms of leaving I just don't think we understand the ramifications of it - there has been so little 'facts' based research on short, medium and long term ramifications. In the absence of this research people are very 'emotionally' motivated about leaving rather than making a considered decision.

Having a referendum at this stage is nonsense and there should have been much more consultation and research.

Now that is the problem Chief you can't overhaul something that isn't a democracy and is run like a communist style dictatorship. Cameron tried to overhaul it didn't he ? What happened there ? Yeah they took the piss out of him and he came away with jack shit and believe me he had leverage.
What I don't understand is that most don't realise it isn't democratic and you can't change or even attempt to change the EU laws.
In principle the EU is a good idea but it's ruined by by power hungry Marxist style dictators running the show.
In the world more country's ain't in the EU and do just fine.

I agree with most of that Nukes, Marxist dictators would probably be MORE democratic than this lot, and that for me is the biggest reason for voting leave, the ABSOLUTE undemocratic nature of the political system of the EU. I voted in the last referendum after the Harold Wilson government attempted to renegotiate the terms of membership. Since the Margaret Thatcher, Major, Blair, Brown and now Cameron have tried to either renegotiate or get agreement on the overhaul of the non democratic political system of the EU. Still our politicians say "Well it isn't perfect but we are better off inside trying to change the EU". BOLLOCKS it will NEVER change whilst the main "Council Of The EU" , the body that negotiates and implements EU Law is made up of non elected political appointments. In my opinion not since the "Doges of Venice" has there been such an undemocratic system of government but one after another our political leaders have shown a complete lack of desire to deal with this. It's UNBELIEVEABLE.

There are many examples of where the law created by this unelected "Council Of The EU" have had a negative effect on the UK and, in my opinion, the biggest relates to the "Free Movement Of Labour". This gives ABSOLUTE freedom for the migration of people across the EU and we now know that as a result the population of the UK has increased by over 2m in the last 5 years.

Unfortunately the LEAVE campaign continually talk about IMMIGRATION in relation to this issue, but immigration means the movement of people across International borders, a process where the UK still has complete control, whist migration means the movement of people within the borders of a single state, a process over which the UK has ABSOLUTELY NO CONTROL thanks to EU law so when people like Nigel Farage say we have lost of our borders he is only saying the truth. For that he is dubbed a racist. Unbelieveable.

Blair had the power to VETO this but he didn't and Cameron talks about us being outside the "Schengen" zone and claims as a result we still control our borders, A LIE, but still people are not waking up to the problems that are ahead of us if we do not get control of our borders back.

Almost ALL areas of our society are being put under pressure because of the level of uncontrolled migration into this country, housing, education, health, transport and employment are suffering and the only way to correct this is to get back control of our borders. To do this we need to exit the EU and as soon as possible.

I am not a racist and I honestly believe that controlled immigration has in the past, is today and will be in the future a massive positive for the UK and absolutely must continue. What has to STOP is the uncontrolled mass migration of people across the EU.

Vote leave and lets get back to the great democratic political system we enjoyed prior to joining this nutcase undemocratic EU we were mad enough to join over 40 years ago.

I wonder if either you or nuclear blue could actually tell us how the EU works without having to rescherch it first.Last time I looked we had our own unelected body which has been responsible for many changes to government proposed law and when all things are considered haven't done a bad job.

Having the House of Lords review legislation is one of the things that makes our political system great although I accept your point that nowadays there are so many political appoints that it can look like an institution created by vested interest.But the main LAW making body of this country remains the House of Commons and that is a directly elected democratic body.

Can you seriously claim that the Council of the EU is the same as the House Of Lords.

If your point is an un-elected body able to effect the making of laws then yes.My other main point you seemed to have dodged,that is,do you know the way the EU works and could you explain it in detail or are you dependent on that great closet bigot of our time,Boris Johnstone and his cronies.

Do I have a complete understanding of how the EU works, NO, but I believe I have a decent understanding of how it operates and I absolutely believe it to be an undemocratic organisation accountable only to themselves.

As for Boris Johnson for me he has borderline entertainment value only and I find it difficult to understand what he is saying half the time. Comparing Adolf Hitler to the EU was a disgrace as was Cameron suggesting that leaving may result with war in Europe, but sadly that is level of this whole debate.

Not everything the EU has done is bad, in fact many things are very positive for ALL member states, but the lack of accountability within the organisation is quite simply staggering. The free movement of Labour that Blair signed up to is a massive problem, even worse he allowed the decision to change from every member state agreeing to this qualified majority bollocks.

I am no bigot, closet or otherwise, and I really believe that controlled immigration from wherever in the world remains a very positive thing for our country and must continue. However the uncontrolled mass migration of people is bad and must stop.

How many people must our country allow to live here before we see the collapse of things like housing, health, education, transport, labour or whatever., just because some undemocratic body imposes a bad law on us.

Reports say that the younger generation tend to be more in favour of remaining in the EU, while the older generation favour an exit. Is that because the older generation can remember when we were'nt run by Brussels, while the younger generation have never known anything different.

Reports say that the younger generation tend to be more in favour of remaining in the EU, while the older generation favour an exit. Is that because the older generation can remember when we were'nt run by Brussels, while the younger generation have never known anything different.

yes definitely how can younger people have view of something they have no experience of? only thing that may sway them is emigration !

I have seen no fact based information that supports leaving, so if you have some I would be glad to see it Sven.

The EU is 100% un democratic and is a dictatorship at Brussels who wasn't elected or can't be sacked. Tell me that is not true Chief.

Its not true. The EU is far more democratic than the UK, yes it still has flaws within its democracy but nothing compared to our 'democracy'. The MEPs are elected by proportional representation so that every vote counts not like First Past The Post where millions of votes are not counted for example UKIP getting 3.5 million votes in 2015 and only getting 1 seat or when the Liberal Democrats increased their vote share in 2010 but ended up losing seats, is this what we call Democratic because its anything but. With regards to the Unelected 'Bureaucrats' otherwise known as the EU commissioners are not elected by us no and its up to you whether you believe that's right or wrong. But they are elected by the government that we Elect in Westminster, so if you have a problem with our European Commissioner then think about how the government that we elected appointed that European commissioner. If this is a referendum about democracy then its the wrong referendum. http://infacts.org/the-eu-has-its-flaws ... g-reality/

When I first voted on this subject, it was sold to us based on removing red tape and barriers which were restricting trade between businesses in what was then known as the Common Market. I don't recall anyone telling us that they would have major influences on our laws, and that we would be told who we could and could not deport from this country. They certainly never mentioned anything about us having to accept criminals from other member countries into the UK. If I had known then what I know now, I would never have voted in favour of us joining.

No-on has really been able to tell me why Cameron has offered us the chance to get out if it's the disaster he is making it out to be. If everything is going to be as bad as he is making out, why on earth did he agree to the referendum in the first place.

If you study the ins and the outs of the Conservative party then you would begin to understand why. First of all Cameron is gambler in fact he was once described as someone who was not drove by traditional conservative ideology but drove by winning elections, and he drove the Conservative party to the brink when he made his coalition offer to the Liberal Democrats live on TV which angered many of his conservative peers as the Liberal Democrats were 'Pro-European' compared to the old Eurosceptic of the conservative party. Further more, he risked the entire future of the Conservative party when they had the voting reform referendum of 2011 where if he lost that referendum that he backed a number of conservatives would of lost their seats and the likelihood of them ever gaining power again was pretty minute but he had won and the conservatives went on to get a majority in 2015 (his gamble paid off). The reason why he has agreed to have this referendum is to avoid a backbench revolt in the Conservative party but make no mistake he is Pro-EU

Wales independence and stay in,Europe!!

No thanks we are poor because of the eu

No-on has really been able to tell me why Cameron has offered us the chance to get out if it's the disaster he is making it out to be. If everything is going to be as bad as he is making out, why on earth did he agree to the referendum in the first place.

If you study the ins and the outs of the Conservative party then you would begin to understand why. First of all Cameron is gambler in fact he was once described as someone who was not drove by traditional conservative ideology but drove by winning elections, and he drove the Conservative party to the brink when he made his coalition offer to the Liberal Democrats live on TV which angered many of his conservative peers as the Liberal Democrats were 'Pro-European' compared to the old Eurosceptic of the conservative party. Further more, he risked the entire future of the Conservative party when they had the voting reform referendum of 2011 where if he lost that referendum that he backed a number of conservatives would of lost their seats and the likelihood of them ever gaining power again was pretty minute but he had won and the conservatives went on to get a majority in 2015 (his gamble paid off). The reason why he has agreed to have this referendum is to avoid a backbench revolt in the Conservative party but make no mistake he is Pro-EU

Exactly, so he has put his own needs before that of the country. How can a man like that be trusted, or anything he says be believed.

Blue Gog in spreading lies and half truths shocker.

Notice in that little map he shared it says until 2020? Well guess what happens in 2019. The EU are negotiating the next round of funding and sadly for Wales we are likely to be not receive that amount again. We were lucky too last time, with every poorer regions joining the Union we are going to get bumped up.

I understand why people want to remain for the funding aspect and agree that Westminster are unlikely to invest that much into South Wales. However this funding is going to stop in a few years and we will be saddled with all the negatives of the EU without much of the positives for that I am voting to LEAVE.

Talking of spreading lies and half truths...

It will stop, they are reviewing it in 2019 and we were very close to losing top funding status back when it was last reviewed. At the moment we are getting a lot of money, that point I will concede. However this money will dry up and with all the shit holes joining the EU we will be budged up a bit.

Too much talk about immigration in this thread and others regarding the EU. If you are genuinely out, stop talking about immigration because it's turning many potential out voters off. There's plenty of arguments to leave the EU.

What Utter nonsense it is to suggest that talking about immigration it turning people off voting for Brexit,I would suggest the opposite is true,people who want less immigration will definetly vote leave

How would we control immigration if we end up leaving the EU? Republic of Ireland is a EU country and has a open boarder with Northern Ireland which would be a non EU country. The Only way to control immigration and to tie up all loop holes would be to close the boarder between Northern and Republic of Ireland which would take years and years of negotiations which a new peace deal would have to be negotiated. and second introduce visa's which would make travel expensive. But I would always make the case that immigration is good for the UK

It makes me laugh when I hear Brexiteers talk about the economic reasons for leaving the EU. They do realise that the money we give to the EU works out at 27p per person in the UK. Are Brexiteers so desperate to get their 27p back?

It makes me laugh when I hear Brexiteers talk about the economic reasons for leaving the EU. They do realise that the money we give to the EU works out at 27p per person in the UK. Are Brexiteers so desperate to get their 27p back?

It's not 27p it's 288 pounds per head per year

Blue Gog in spreading lies and half truths shocker.

Notice in that little map he shared it says until 2020? Well guess what happens in 2019. The EU are negotiating the next round of funding and sadly for Wales we are likely to be not receive that amount again. We were lucky too last time, with every poorer regions joining the Union we are going to get bumped up.

I understand why people want to remain for the funding aspect and agree that Westminster are unlikely to invest that much into South Wales. However this funding is going to stop in a few years and we will be saddled with all the negatives of the EU without much of the positives for that I am voting to LEAVE.

Talking of spreading lies and half truths...

It will stop, they are reviewing it in 2019 and we were very close to losing top funding status back when it was last reviewed. At the moment we are getting a lot of money, that point I will concede. However this money will dry up and with all the shit holes joining the EU we will be budged up a bit.

Too much talk about immigration in this thread and others regarding the EU. If you are genuinely out, stop talking about immigration because it's turning many potential out voters off. There's plenty of arguments to leave the EU.

What Utter nonsense it is to suggest that talking about immigration it turning people off voting for Brexit,I would suggest the opposite is true,people who want less immigration will definetly vote leave

How would we control immigration if we end up leaving the EU? Republic of Ireland is a EU country and has a open boarder with Northern Ireland which would be a non EU country. The Only way to control immigration and to tie up all loop holes would be to close the boarder between Northern and Republic of Ireland which would take years and years of negotiations which a new peace deal would have to be negotiated. and second introduce visa's which would make travel expensive. But I would always make the case that immigration is good for the UK

You saw the report on the news then, so must be true?

I'll be glad when I don't have to listen to Cameron telling me that if we leave the EU it will be the end of the world as we know it, and what it will be like if we are no longer in the EU. Unlike Cameron (who was about 7 when we joined), I know roughly what it will be like. I went through my childhood and and into work knowing what living outside the Eu was like. Things may have changed, but back then countries did'nt trade with countries, businesses traded with businesses. I doubt if that has changed much, businesses traded with each other then and will continue to do so whatever the outcome of the referendum. My last comments on this subject, we all have different views and I respect both sides of the argument irrespective of my personal opinion on this.

It makes me laugh when I hear Brexiteers talk about the economic reasons for leaving the EU. They do realise that the money we give to the EU works out at 27p per person in the UK. Are Brexiteers so desperate to get their 27p back?

It's not 27p it's 288 pounds per head per year

27p per day

experts in economy mostly think an exit makes no sense. and these are people who have nothing to gain or lose. immigration v economy then.

to many financial experts thinking its bad to leave surely even the most hardened leave supporters have to give pause for thought to the damage they could cause.

Blue Gog in spreading lies and half truths shocker.

Notice in that little map he shared it says until 2020? Well guess what happens in 2019. The EU are negotiating the next round of funding and sadly for Wales we are likely to be not receive that amount again. We were lucky too last time, with every poorer regions joining the Union we are going to get bumped up.

I understand why people want to remain for the funding aspect and agree that Westminster are unlikely to invest that much into South Wales. However this funding is going to stop in a few years and we will be saddled with all the negatives of the EU without much of the positives for that I am voting to LEAVE.

Talking of spreading lies and half truths...

It will stop, they are reviewing it in 2019 and we were very close to losing top funding status back when it was last reviewed. At the moment we are getting a lot of money, that point I will concede. However this money will dry up and with all the shit holes joining the EU we will be budged up a bit.

Too much talk about immigration in this thread and others regarding the EU. If you are genuinely out, stop talking about immigration because it's turning many potential out voters off. There's plenty of arguments to leave the EU.

What Utter nonsense it is to suggest that talking about immigration it turning people off voting for Brexit,I would suggest the opposite is true,people who want less immigration will definetly vote leave

How would we control immigration if we end up leaving the EU? Republic of Ireland is a EU country and has a open boarder with Northern Ireland which would be a non EU country. The Only way to control immigration and to tie up all loop holes would be to close the boarder between Northern and Republic of Ireland which would take years and years of negotiations which a new peace deal would have to be negotiated. and second introduce visa's which would make travel expensive. But I would always make the case that immigration is good for the UK

You saw the report on the news then, so must be true?

No I didn't see the news report was it on BBC, Sky News or ITV? its just plain logistics for those who are aware of Northern Ireland and Republic of Ireland relations and the importance of the 'open' boarder that was negotiated as part of a peace deal.

Blue Gog in spreading lies and half truths shocker.

Notice in that little map he shared it says until 2020? Well guess what happens in 2019. The EU are negotiating the next round of funding and sadly for Wales we are likely to be not receive that amount again. We were lucky too last time, with every poorer regions joining the Union we are going to get bumped up.

I understand why people want to remain for the funding aspect and agree that Westminster are unlikely to invest that much into South Wales. However this funding is going to stop in a few years and we will be saddled with all the negatives of the EU without much of the positives for that I am voting to LEAVE.

Talking of spreading lies and half truths...

It will stop, they are reviewing it in 2019 and we were very close to losing top funding status back when it was last reviewed. At the moment we are getting a lot of money, that point I will concede. However this money will dry up and with all the shit holes joining the EU we will be budged up a bit.

Too much talk about immigration in this thread and others regarding the EU. If you are genuinely out, stop talking about immigration because it's turning many potential out voters off. There's plenty of arguments to leave the EU.

What Utter nonsense it is to suggest that talking about immigration it turning people off voting for Brexit,I would suggest the opposite is true,people who want less immigration will definetly vote leave

How would we control immigration if we end up leaving the EU? Republic of Ireland is a EU country and has a open boarder with Northern Ireland which would be a non EU country. The Only way to control immigration and to tie up all loop holes would be to close the boarder between Northern and Republic of Ireland which would take years and years of negotiations which a new peace deal would have to be negotiated. and second introduce visa's which would make travel expensive. But I would always make the case that immigration is good for the UK

You saw the report on the news then, so must be true?

No I didn't see the news report was it on BBC, Sky News or ITV? its just plain logistics for those who are aware of Northern Ireland and Republic of Ireland relations and the importance of the 'open' boarder that was negotiated as part of a peace deal.

Just coincidence that what you said happened to be on news other day ! Why would you be interested in that subject when no mention of it anywhere in this thread or on board?

Can I ask, I've watched the news etc it's all nonsense lies back and forth. Arguing the same things back and forth.

I've made my decision but if Cameron is in charge does it actually change anything? Surely he can still make the same decisions?
Im naive to the real politics.

I would say pro people (whatever side) ruin it for themselves, my Facebook is full of lies they share. Shame it cant be a real debate.