THE PLOT THICKENS????

If the reports from up here in the papers are true(we will wait and see) celtic and ledley/agent are waiting until after the final whistle of tonights world cup final to put pen to paper, technically last season is then over and they will sign him next/this season, he has then not signed for another club in the same season as he was 23 (fifa ruling) meaning that cardiff city can,t even claim training compensation for him. I wounder how the pro ledley fans think of that one!!!!

If the reports from up here in the papers are true(we will wait and see) celtic and ledley/agent are waiting until after the final whistle of tonights world cup final to put pen to paper, technically last season is then over and they will sign him next/this season, he has then not signed for another club in the same season as he was 23 (fifa ruling) meaning that cardiff city can,t even claim training compensation for him. I wounder how the pro ledley fans think of that one!!!!

I have to admit, This has been a story hard to keep up with and has got everyone in a spin about whats really happening.

This situation has just got worse and worse.

The sooner he signs for whoever the better, the one thing that is clear is that he won't be a city player next season.

I can't wait for the embargo to be lifted so we can start talking about who's going to be joining us or how we are going to do next season.

You,re right annis, although lots of people are still wrighting/poting about ledley(myself included) it will be nice to see an end to this saga. By the way, thanks for your e-mail regarding my new book, i,ll relpy to you through the week!!!!

This situation has just got worse and worse.

The sooner he signs for whoever the better, the one thing that is clear is that he won't be a city player next season.

I can't wait for the embargo to be lifted so we can start talking about who's going to be joining us or how we are going to do next season.

Yes I agree Stavross, the sooner The Ledley situation is sorted the better for us,as I am totally Fed up of it now. WE NEED THAT EMBARGO LIFTING NOW.

You,re right annis, although lots of people are still wrighting/poting about ledley(myself included) it will be nice to see an end to this saga. By the way, thanks for your e-mail regarding my new book, i,ll relpy to you through the week!!!!

Cheers
I agree, I just want it done and dusted for everyones sake.

If the reports from up here in the papers are true(we will wait and see) celtic and ledley/agent are waiting until after the final whistle of tonights world cup final to put pen to paper, technically last season is then over and they will sign him next/this season, he has then not signed for another club in the same season as he was 23 (fifa ruling) meaning that cardiff city can,t even claim training compensation for him. I wounder how the pro ledley fans think of that one!!!!

is this the act of a greedy agent or a cardiff born cardiff breed bluebirds loving youngster ?

either way it makes sence why people are starting to hate him,
"not signed for another club in the same season as he was 23"
that is a low trick.

Can someone PLEASE explain to me what exactly Joe Ledley owes Cardiff City FC?
Joe Ledley would have been a Premiership footballer last season but the club shat on him

And can you include a reason why he shouldnt take up an offer of employment worth
nearly 1.5m a year?? in a career that could end tomorrow through injury!

If Celtic choose to wait an extra day to cut out any compensation claims from Cardiff City
then who can blame them? its business... we did the same kind of thing when we signed
Kevin McNaughton!!

and does anyone really expect Joe to walk out of Celtic because of it??

If the reports from up here in the papers are true(we will wait and see) celtic and ledley/agent are waiting until after the final whistle of tonights world cup final to put pen to paper, technically last season is then over and they will sign him next/this season, he has then not signed for another club in the same season as he was 23 (fifa ruling) meaning that cardiff city can,t even claim training compensation for him. I wounder how the pro ledley fans think of that one!!!!

To fully understand this process you must refer to FIFA regulation on Player Status and Transfer. You can get a copy off the FA website;

http://www.thefa.com/TheFA/RulesandRegu ... n_1843.pdf

The justifcation for training compensation can be found in Article 20 on page 61, this is further expanded for players in the EU who move from one national association to another which can be found in Annex 4 Article 6 on page 122.

If you read this it should leave you with no doubt that training compensation is payable when a player moves between different national associations within the EU.

However certain criteria must still apply for a training club to receive training compensation, including the player receiving an offer of a new contract of employment within 60 days of the termination of his current contract. The offer must also be sent by recorded delivery.

Although Joe celebrated his 23rd birthday during this season the right of Cardiff to claim Training Compensation remains until the end of the season and in this case the end of his contract. Under the rules Cardiff have upto 18 months to make a claim.

In terms of how much Cardiff can claim there are clear maximum payments stipulated in Annex 4. For instance Cardiff can Claim a maximum of 10,000 euros for each season between Joe's 12th and 15th Birthday. 40,000 euros maximum.
Both Cardiff & Celtic care category 2 clubs within the EUFA Confederation and the maximum training fee is stated on page 119 subsection 156 - 60,000 euros for each year from Joe's 15th birthday to a maximum of his 21st birthday i.e 6 x 60,000 - 360,000 euros.

So as an absolute maximum Cardiff can claim 400,000 euros or approx £345,000 at todays exchange rate.

Joe has pretty much been a regular in the Cardiff team since his 18th Birthday and it could therefore be argued his training ended on his 18th birthday in which case Cardiff would lose out on 180,000 euros.

I really get frustrated when I read some of the things written about this situation but the truth is out there in the public domain and if when you read it you get some real perspective into this debate.

Journalists like Mark Bloom will go on about Liam Miller and Kevin McNaughton being free transfers, this is a fact but as neither player was offered a new contract in line with the requirement of Annex 4 Article 6 subsection 3, the result was no training compensation was payable.

What we should be asking is why are Celtic stalling over paying Cardiff a maximum of £345,000 for a player of Joe Ledley quality, by anyones criteria they are most certainly getting the best out of the deal.

Everyone including Joe needs this resolved and under FIFA rules it is Celtic responsibility to reach agreement with Cardiff so write the cheque and lets move on.

Can someone PLEASE explain to me what exactly Joe Ledley owes Cardiff City FC?
Joe Ledley would have been a Premiership footballer last season but the club shat on him

And can you include a reason why he shouldnt take up an offer of employment worth
nearly 1.5m a year?? in a career that could end tomorrow through injury!

If Celtic choose to wait an extra day to cut out any compensation claims from Cardiff City
then who can blame them? its business... we did the same kind of thing when we signed
Kevin McNaughton!!

and does anyone really expect Joe to walk out of Celtic because of it??

he doesnt owe cardiff anything.
i just dont like him and never have
dave jones, and joe ledleys songs are not songs youl ever hear me sing

Hi Paul hows things ? its wayne we met in spain in june. How things change so quick at ccfc i was so positive with the coming season never thought we were heading for another transfer embargo,lets hope the malaysians have everything under control

Can someone PLEASE explain to me what exactly Joe Ledley owes Cardiff City FC?
Joe Ledley would have been a Premiership footballer last season but the club shat on him

And can you include a reason why he shouldnt take up an offer of employment worth
nearly 1.5m a year?? in a career that could end tomorrow through injury!

If Celtic choose to wait an extra day to cut out any compensation claims from Cardiff City
then who can blame them? its business... we did the same kind of thing when we signed
Kevin McNaughton!!

and does anyone really expect Joe to walk out of Celtic because of it??

its not about what he owes us, personally i'm just pissed off as he left for a better standard of football and now will be playing every week against the likes of inverness in a mickey mouse league. obviously he's going there for the money and not for footballing reasons and in the process he hasnt given a second thought to what state he's left the club he supposedly loves in

Hi Paul hows things ? its wayne we met in spain in june. How things change so quick at ccfc i was so positive with the coming season never thought we were heading for another transfer embargo,lets hope the malaysians have everything under control

Hello wayne i,m fine, hope you and the wife are ok?? yes it,s a bit of a mess at the city at the moment (whats new eh!!) lets just hope there is good news on the horizon!!!

Castleblue, what an excellent post and thanks for the finner detail!!!

Castle, Joe hasn't signed.

Hence the point is, we're not entitled to any money - all Celtic have to do is wait to get the paperwork drawn up after the season has ended. Which then means we're entitled to nothing, as your post acknowledges.

Sorry to say it, but your post raises false hopes. We're entitled to nothing, and will get nothing.

Castle, Joe hasn't signed.

Hence the point is, we're not entitled to any money - all Celtic have to do is wait to get the paperwork drawn up after the season has ended. Which then means we're entitled to nothing, as your post acknowledges.

Sorry to say it, but your post raises false hopes. We're entitled to nothing, and will get nothing.

If I was a betting man I would bet that you are correct Nerd.

However, one of the regulation states that 'Training Compensation' is due once the player has finished his 'training period' which I assume is when the player signs his first professional contract. (The other regulation is that the player must move between associations before the end of the season in when his 23rd birthday occurs.)

Not sure when Ledley signed his first contract (probably when he was around 18) so could it be possible that training compo is due to City for the ages between 12 and 18 and the fact he is out of contract has no affect?

I'm not stating this as fact just trying to get my head around all the info.

If the reports from up here in the papers are true(we will wait and see) celtic and ledley/agent are waiting until after the final whistle of tonights world cup final to put pen to paper, technically last season is then over and they will sign him next/this season, he has then not signed for another club in the same season as he was 23 (fifa ruling) meaning that cardiff city can,t even claim training compensation for him. I wounder how the pro ledley fans think of that one!!!!

Unloyal c**t can f**k off to HELL. He knows he could have done his bread and butter club a favour.

Castle, Joe hasn't signed.

Hence the point is, we're not entitled to any money - all Celtic have to do is wait to get the paperwork drawn up after the season has ended. Which then means we're entitled to nothing, as your post acknowledges.

Sorry to say it, but your post raises false hopes. We're entitled to nothing, and will get nothing.

If I was a betting man I would bet that you are correct Nerd.

However, one of the regulation states that 'Training Compensation' is due once the player has finished his 'training period' which I assume is when the player signs his first professional contract. (The other regulation is that the player must move between associations before the end of the season in when his 23rd birthday occurs.)

Not sure when Ledley signed his first contract (probably when he was around 18) so could it be possible that training compo is due to City for the ages between 12 and 18 and the fact he is out of contract has no affect?

I'm not stating this as fact just trying to get my head around all the info.

The first point re the amount of training compensation is correct - teams "buying" that player when out of contract have to pay compensation once the training period is deemed over - ie is now eligible for compensation to be paid.

The second point gives a cutoff point after which compensation is now longer due. Joe was 23 in January (from memory) hence the end of last season was the cutoff point.

It thus depends on what is considered the end of last season, and the date Joe signs for someone.

If I was a betting man I would bet that you are correct Nerd.

However, one of the regulation states that 'Training Compensation' is due once the player has finished his 'training period' which I assume is when the player signs his first professional contract. (The other regulation is that the player must move between associations before the end of the season in when his 23rd birthday occurs.)

Not sure when Ledley signed his first contract (probably when he was around 18) so could it be possible that training compo is due to City for the ages between 12 and 18 and the fact he is out of contract has no affect?

I'm not stating this as fact just trying to get my head around all the info.[/quote]

The first point re the amount of training compensation is correct - teams "buying" that player when out of contract have to pay compensation once the training period is deemed over - ie is now eligible for compensation to be paid.

The second point gives a cutoff point after which compensation is now longer due. Joe was 23 in January (from memory) hence the end of last season was the cutoff point.

It thus depends on what is considered the end of last season, and the date Joe signs for someone.[/quote]


It looks cut and dried, BUT couldn't City argue that the contract was agreed 'in principle' before being actually signed. Its been pretty much public knowledge.
The laws/rules are there to protect 'principal' and therefore there may still be a form of arguement for City to follow here, if player, agent and purchasing club have colluded to deny the club its rightful payment. Its unchartered waters.

It's been public knowledge Joe and agent visited.

Given Joe commented "who knows if I'll be back", if we tried to claim the deal was finalised before the cutoff date - which it almost certainly was - we'd have to prove it, something nigh on impossible.

It's been public knowledge Joe and agent visited.

Given Joe commented "who knows if I'll be back", if we tried to claim the deal was finalised before the cutoff date - which it almost certainly was - we'd have to prove it, something nigh on impossible.

So if the deal was done tomorrow, given that there are plenty of people in football circles saying that ledley has committed to sign (including Dave Jones, Stoke Chairman and Celtic chairman) we wouldn't have a case ? There seems to be plenty of evidence that the deal is done and the delay is only so that Celtic can screw us .

Wouldn't want you as my solicitor.

Likelyhood is that our club wouldn't go down this route anyway, just pointing out that it could be a possiblity.