The Accounts Have Been Filed With Companies House

Yesterday the club filed it's accounts with Companies House which have been overdue since February and thank fully this will fulfill another requirement to remove the transfer embargo, only Charlton to sort out now.

How do you know Castleblue ?- happier days if true - now let's pay the taxman and Charlton ?

How do you know Castleblue ?- happier days if true - now let's pay the taxman and Charlton ?

I have been checking everyday on the Companies House Website and it has changed today to say they have been filed, however it will take a day or two before I can get hold of a copy.

Then we will know the full extent of the mess we are in, well up until May 2009 anyway.

the accounts have been filed, CH have two days to approve them before they are placed into the public domain.

Stat Accounts Filed

good news then !

good news then !

we've not seen them yet


despite the fact they are now more than twelve months out of date and therefore not entirely relevant the usual people will be crawling all over them giving their two penneth.

good news then !

we've not seen them yet


despite the fact they are now more than twelve months out of date and therefore not entirely relevant the usual people will be crawling all over them giving their two penneth.

Im sure that CCFC's accountant has removed the incriminating evidence to show that Riddler took all the money above board

How do you know Castleblue ?- happier days if true - now let's pay the taxman and Charlton ?

I have been checking everyday on the Companies House Website and it has changed today to say they have been filed, however it will take a day or two before I can get hold of a copy.

Then we will know the full extent of the mess we are in, well up until May 2009 anyway.

The accounts should show a big net profit , as they will contain an exceptional profit from revaluing the new stadium.

The figure to focus on will be the operating loss one , which is the loss the group made before interest and profits on player sales - it will show the level of underlying trading losses for the year. That should still be a big loss as May 2009 was the last season in Ninian Park so without the increased crowds in the new stadium but still carrying all the wage costs.

Keith

Are the stadium AND the football club 2 seperate companies ??

Are the stadium AND the football club 2 seperate companies ??

Yes , so the accounts to look at are those for Cardiff City Football Club (Holdings) Limited which owns both of those companies and will show the overall results for the group.

When the 2008 accounts were published (again late) the former Chairman used the media to refer to a small loss for the year in the football club , "conveniently" forgetting the big losses which were shown through the holding company`s accounts.

Keith

Keith Im confused.com mate , can you explain exactly in lay mans terms what this means and what company is what ?

Keith Im confused.com mate , can you explain exactly in lay mans terms what this means and what company is what ?

I'm no bean counter Martyn1963 but at least this removes one of the reasons behind the Football League transfer embargo. only Charlton to deal with now.

Perhaps we should return Hudson marked Unfit For Purpose

Keith Im confused.com mate , can you explain exactly in lay mans terms what this means and what company is what ?

I'm no bean counter Martyn1963 but at least this removes one of the reasons behind the Football League transfer embargo. only Charlton to deal with now.

Perhaps we should return Hudson marked Unfit For Purpose

yeah sale or return , good job it wasnt a case of buy 1 get 1 free ??

Keith Im confused.com mate , can you explain exactly in lay mans terms what this means and what company is what ?

there is a trading company, call it CCFC Team Ltd, that deals in the day to day running of the football team, buying and selling platyers, pages their wages and so forth

there is a stadium company, call it CCFC stadco Ltd which operates the stadium, the catering (I know its run by third party) and so on.

There is a company , lets call it CCFC (Holdings) who own both CCFC Team and CCFC Stadco. CCFC (Holdings) in itself does not trade. Terefore, to get the results of CCFC (Holdings), that is, the club as a whole, you have to consolidate the results of both CCFC Team and CCFC Stadco. Furthermore, you only consider transactions with third partires and not transactions between CCFC Stadco and CCFC Team

the names have been changed to protect the not so innocent.

who owns the retail park then ?

Keith Im confused.com mate , can you explain exactly in lay mans terms what this means and what company is what ?

Sorry mate , will try to.

There are 3 companies involved in the group.

Cardiff City Football Club Ltd - operates the football side of things

Cardiff City Stadium Ltd. - set up to build the new stadium and operate it

Cardiff City Football Club (Holdings) Ltd - owns both of the above companies and is the company in which the new investors , and all other shareholders , hold their shares.So it keeps ownership seperate from trading.

To see the whole financial picture , you have to look at Holdings accounts , which shows the figures for all 3 companies. Otherwise , you could show profits in the football club books and hide the losses in one of the other two companies.

In the accounts there are two main profit (or in our case usually loss) figures shown.

Operating profit - the profit from "normal" trading.i.e. matchday , League , sponsorship and other income less "normal" costs such as wages , repairs and maintenance , business rates , lighting and heating etc.

In CCFC`s books any profit or loss from selling players is then shown as a seperate line. Then , after also showing interest payable on our debts as a further seperate line , this gives the bottom line figure of net profit or loss.

Every single year for as long as I can remember the club has made a big loss at the operating loss level. And every year it has had to try and balance the books by selling off players at a profit. In most years , even this hasn`t been enough ,which is why the debts have gone up each and every year (with 1 exception I think) - through both SH and PR`s time in charge.

For the 2010 figures , which of course we won`t see for a long time , I expect to see the level of operating losses come down quite a lot as they will include the increased income from higher crowds (at higher average prices) in the new stadium , plus the first year of League money going up from £1.2m to £3m a season. There will also be the benefit of an extra share from the parachute payments from relegated clubs going back up.

Keith

who owns the retail park then ?

PMG - nothing to do with any of the football club companies

Thanks Keith for that , so does the FC and the CCS have thier own board as it were ??

who owns the retail park then ?

PMG - nothing to do with any of the football club companies

I see so all parties then on the park pay rent to PMG who just happen to be shareholders and directors of CCFC Holdings aswell , so Im guessing that CCS also pay rent or whatever to PMG or isnt the CCS part of the park ? Convenient way to balance and fiddle the books this .............. so which company then paid into WH Sports or whoever for Riddlers consultancy fees ? Which company gave Riddler his bonuses and which company was paying Riddler ??

Thanks Keith for that , so does the FC and the CCS have thier own board as it were ??

Yes they do , and they probably have long and childish arguments between them like this one and Mike Morris` one

Actually , the directors of the FC and CCS board are controlled by the Holdings one (I think all of them are on the Holdings board anyway - but don`t have the paperwork with me to check).

Keith

This is good stuff !! So from the beginning then when Sam was doing all the planing permission etc who actually owned the land at the time and how come PMG do now ??

who owns the retail park then ?

PMG - nothing to do with any of the football club companies

I see so all parties then on the park pay rent to PMG who just happen to be shareholders and directors of CCFC Holdings aswell , so Im guessing that CCS also pay rent or whatever to PMG or isnt the CCS part of the park ? Convenient way to balance and fiddle the books this .............. so which company then paid into WH Sports or whoever for Riddlers consultancy fees ? Which company gave Riddler his bonuses and which company was paying Riddler ??

All the tenants on the retail park pay PMG (other than Costco because PMG sold that part of the park onto someone else last year for about £20m).

To get planning permission to build the retail park PMG had to pay about £38m into funds held by the Council which they then used to pay towards the stadium build costs.

The CCS is not part of the retail park. It is owned by CCS on a very long lease with Cardiff County Council owning the freehold.

Ridsdale was paid by the FC company as his services (and those of WH Sports) were deemed to be of benefit to that football trading company

Thanks Keith and no more questions I promise very interesting stuff there , lets hope TG can sort this lot out then ?

Charlto want their money

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/footba ... rlton.html