(OT) Welsh independence march.

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Welsh Independence

For
15
27%
Against
41
73%
 
Total votes : 56

Re: (OT) Welsh independence march.

Postby Steve Zodiak » Sat May 18, 2019 2:37 pm

CCFCJosh75 wrote:
SirJimmySchoular wrote:No, you're absolutely right.
If you read my post addressing this I can assure you that the overwhelming majority of people fighting that war had absolutely no political motivation and by today's standards would be considered very racist and much further right than Nigel Farage.

This revamping of ww2 to suit the agenda of leftists and politically correct theorists is very dishonest and baseless .


People who actually lived during WW2 are actually one of the most pro EU 'groups' there is.
I think the brexiteers have used ww2 and 'blitz spirit' etc a lot more than leftist.
But, as people have said before, this thread is meant to be about Welsh independence so I'll speak no more on brexit.


My mother and both her living brothers were born in the late 20's/ early 30's, and I can tell you all three voted FOR Brexit.
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Re: (OT) Welsh independence march.

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Re: (OT) Welsh independence march.

Postby SirJimmySchoular » Sat May 18, 2019 3:35 pm

CCFCJosh75 wrote:
SirJimmySchoular wrote:No, you're absolutely right.
If you read my post addressing this I can assure you that the overwhelming majority of people fighting that war had absolutely no political motivation and by today's standards would be considered very racist and much further right than Nigel Farage.

This revamping of ww2 to suit the agenda of leftists and politically correct theorists is very dishonest and baseless .


People who actually lived during WW2 are actually one of the most pro EU 'groups' there is.
I think the brexiteers have used ww2 and 'blitz spirit' etc a lot more than leftist.
But, as people have said before, this thread is meant to be about Welsh independence so I'll speak no more on brexit.



But you want to move on upon a note of dishonesty ?
People who lived through ww2 are absolutely not going to approve of being dominated by Germany whatever the arguments might be. You have an entirely wrong impression about the attitudes of people at that time.
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Re: (OT) Welsh independence march.

Postby CCFCJosh75 » Sat May 18, 2019 4:17 pm

SirJimmySchoular wrote:
CCFCJosh75 wrote:
SirJimmySchoular wrote:No, you're absolutely right.
If you read my post addressing this I can assure you that the overwhelming majority of people fighting that war had absolutely no political motivation and by today's standards would be considered very racist and much further right than Nigel Farage.

This revamping of ww2 to suit the agenda of leftists and politically correct theorists is very dishonest and baseless .


People who actually lived during WW2 are actually one of the most pro EU 'groups' there is.
I think the brexiteers have used ww2 and 'blitz spirit' etc a lot more than leftist.
But, as people have said before, this thread is meant to be about Welsh independence so I'll speak no more on brexit.



But you want to move on upon a note of dishonesty ?
People who lived through ww2 are absolutely not going to approve of being dominated by Germany whatever the arguments might be. You have an entirely wrong impression about the attitudes of people at that time.


Well here's my evidence
https://blogs.lse.ac.uk/politicsandpoli ... 5s-brexit/
Now can you show me evidence of your statement please
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Re: (OT) Welsh independence march.

Postby pembroke allan » Sat May 18, 2019 5:06 pm

montyblue wrote:WEZ1927

i was' nt saying we could be using coal today it was about we never made as much money in the past with coal, as we could have if we held the purse strings and where independent before coal came about we as a country could have been very rich.

I was talking about the way westminster picks and chooses which region gets a share , and wales does'nt.



Never made much out coal as it was a nationalised industry so meant for whole uk same as oil? Even if we got the full amount of revenue what happens after it finished same with Scots and their oil revenue ? Great in theory but unless people are prepared to be taxed at 70% independence is unsustainable for us and Scots :thumbup:
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Re: (OT) Welsh independence march.

Postby Steve Zodiak » Sat May 18, 2019 5:18 pm

CCFCJosh75 wrote:
SirJimmySchoular wrote:
CCFCJosh75 wrote:
SirJimmySchoular wrote:No, you're absolutely right.
If you read my post addressing this I can assure you that the overwhelming majority of people fighting that war had absolutely no political motivation and by today's standards would be considered very racist and much further right than Nigel Farage.

This revamping of ww2 to suit the agenda of leftists and politically correct theorists is very dishonest and baseless .


People who actually lived during WW2 are actually one of the most pro EU 'groups' there is.
I think the brexiteers have used ww2 and 'blitz spirit' etc a lot more than leftist.
But, as people have said before, this thread is meant to be about Welsh independence so I'll speak no more on brexit.



But you want to move on upon a note of dishonesty ?
People who lived through ww2 are absolutely not going to approve of being dominated by Germany whatever the arguments might be. You have an entirely wrong impression about the attitudes of people at that time.


Well here's my evidence
https://blogs.lse.ac.uk/politicsandpoli ... 5s-brexit/
Now can you show me evidence of your statement please


I hope you realise that nobody actually knows the breakdown of how certain age groups voted in the referendum, as those stats are never released. Even the magicians at the LSE have not been given that information. There have been numerous papers released as to the hows and why's that got us into this position, and as is usual, spot surveys are carried out to try and build an accurate picture. Perhaps they are correct, but then again if these original surveys and polls had been accurate, this discussion would not be taking place as the remain campaign would have won the referendum. I am pretty certain my age was not entered on the ballot paper, and not only have I never been asked how I voted or would vote the next time, I have not heard of anyone else I know being contacted either.

You can find all kinds of different studies regarding the referendum, some are very detailed. One important fact that appears in many surveys is : Despite a number of varying estimates being released since the referendum, we will never have precise official figures turnout by age in the EU referendum as this data is not released. (Copied from one such report).
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Re: (OT) Welsh independence march.

Postby SirJimmySchoular » Sat May 18, 2019 5:38 pm

CCFCJosh75 wrote:
SirJimmySchoular wrote:
CCFCJosh75 wrote:
SirJimmySchoular wrote:No, you're absolutely right.
If you read my post addressing this I can assure you that the overwhelming majority of people fighting that war had absolutely no political motivation and by today's standards would be considered very racist and much further right than Nigel Farage.

This revamping of ww2 to suit the agenda of leftists and politically correct theorists is very dishonest and baseless .


People who actually lived during WW2 are actually one of the most pro EU 'groups' there is.
I think the brexiteers have used ww2 and 'blitz spirit' etc a lot more than leftist.
But, as people have said before, this thread is meant to be about Welsh independence so I'll speak no more on brexit.



But you want to move on upon a note of dishonesty ?
People who lived through ww2 are absolutely not going to approve of being dominated by Germany whatever the arguments might be. You have an entirely wrong impression about the attitudes of people at that time.


Well here's my evidence
https://blogs.lse.ac.uk/politicsandpoli ... 5s-brexit/
Now can you show me evidence of your statement please


Well my evidence is that of a direct source and the fact that everyone I knew and was brought up by and with was also a direct source.
You are countering that with a set of dubiously produced and doubtful figures which ,as Steve points out, are guesswork at best.
( I hope in 60 years time someone shows you a similar document claiming that most people in Cardiff today were Eskimos)
These dodgy figures are produced by a notoriously left wing institution and authored by a man who , despite apparently holding a doctorate , doesn't know the difference between " Pacific " and "specific ".
Not convinced I'm afraid.
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Re: (OT) Welsh independence march.

Postby dogfound » Sat May 18, 2019 5:41 pm

CCFCJosh75 wrote:
SirJimmySchoular wrote:
CCFCJosh75 wrote:
SirJimmySchoular wrote:No, you're absolutely right.
If you read my post addressing this I can assure you that the overwhelming majority of people fighting that war had absolutely no political motivation and by today's standards would be considered very racist and much further right than Nigel Farage.

This revamping of ww2 to suit the agenda of leftists and politically correct theorists is very dishonest and baseless .


People who actually lived during WW2 are actually one of the most pro EU 'groups' there is.
I think the brexiteers have used ww2 and 'blitz spirit' etc a lot more than leftist.
But, as people have said before, this thread is meant to be about Welsh independence so I'll speak no more on brexit.



But you want to move on upon a note of dishonesty ?
People who lived through ww2 are absolutely not going to approve of being dominated by Germany whatever the arguments might be. You have an entirely wrong impression about the attitudes of people at that time.


Well here's my evidence
https://blogs.lse.ac.uk/politicsandpoli ... 5s-brexit/
Now can you show me evidence of your statement please



well that's one blokes opinion NOT evidence.....Matt Kelly suggested taking a mop to clean up leaked piss if attending a farage rally and ive read hundreds of times about lowering the voting age all from remainers that was not evidence either but was based on polls { plural } not A poll.
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Re: (OT) Welsh independence march.

Postby Steve Zodiak » Sat May 18, 2019 6:09 pm

dogfound wrote:
CCFCJosh75 wrote:
SirJimmySchoular wrote:
CCFCJosh75 wrote:
SirJimmySchoular wrote:No, you're absolutely right.
If you read my post addressing this I can assure you that the overwhelming majority of people fighting that war had absolutely no political motivation and by today's standards would be considered very racist and much further right than Nigel Farage.

This revamping of ww2 to suit the agenda of leftists and politically correct theorists is very dishonest and baseless .


People who actually lived during WW2 are actually one of the most pro EU 'groups' there is.
I think the brexiteers have used ww2 and 'blitz spirit' etc a lot more than leftist.
But, as people have said before, this thread is meant to be about Welsh independence so I'll speak no more on brexit.



But you want to move on upon a note of dishonesty ?
People who lived through ww2 are absolutely not going to approve of being dominated by Germany whatever the arguments might be. You have an entirely wrong impression about the attitudes of people at that time.


Well here's my evidence
https://blogs.lse.ac.uk/politicsandpoli ... 5s-brexit/
Now can you show me evidence of your statement please



well that's one blokes opinion NOT evidence.....Matt Kelly suggested taking a mop to clean up leaked piss if attending a farage rally and ive read hundreds of times about lowering the voting age all from remainers that was not evidence either but was based on polls { plural } not A poll.


Agree, evidence to me is proof of factual information. There can be no evidence as far as how certain age groups voted, as that information is not available, even to this lad during his one year at the LSE. I can't say he is wrong in the same way nobody can say he is correct. I can only go by the three close relatives I have who lived through the war, and I know for a fact that they all voted to leave, and would do again if another referndum was held.
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Re: (OT) Welsh independence march.

Postby pembroke allan » Sat May 18, 2019 6:36 pm

Steve Zodiak wrote:
CCFCJosh75 wrote:
SirJimmySchoular wrote:
CCFCJosh75 wrote:
SirJimmySchoular wrote:No, you're absolutely right.
If you read my post addressing this I can assure you that the overwhelming majority of people fighting that war had absolutely no political motivation and by today's standards would be considered very racist and much further right than Nigel Farage.

This revamping of ww2 to suit the agenda of leftists and politically correct theorists is very dishonest and baseless .


People who actually lived during WW2 are actually one of the most pro EU 'groups' there is.
I think the brexiteers have used ww2 and 'blitz spirit' etc a lot more than leftist.
But, as people have said before, this thread is meant to be about Welsh independence so I'll speak no more on brexit.



But you want to move on upon a note of dishonesty ?
People who lived through ww2 are absolutely not going to approve of being dominated by Germany whatever the arguments might be. You have an entirely wrong impression about the attitudes of people at that time.


Well here's my evidence
https://blogs.lse.ac.uk/politicsandpoli ... 5s-brexit/
Now can you show me evidence of your statement please


I hope you realise that nobody actually knows the breakdown of how certain age groups voted in the referendum, as those stats are never released. Even the magicians at the LSE have not been given that information. There have been numerous papers released as to the hows and why's that got us into this position, and as is usual, spot surveys are carried out to try and build an accurate picture. Perhaps they are correct, but then again if these original surveys and polls had been accurate, this discussion would not be taking place as the remain campaign would have won the referendum. I am pretty certain my age was not entered on the ballot paper, and not only have I never been asked how I voted or would vote the next time, I have not heard of anyone else I know being contacted either.

You can find all kinds of different studies regarding the referendum, some are very detailed. One important fact that appears in many surveys is : Despite a number of varying estimates being released since the referendum, we will never have precise official figures turnout by age in the EU referendum as this data is not released. (Copied from one such report).




It matters not a not what age or standing of people voted what plain fact is 17m people of all ages sex religion ect ect voted leave that was a majority which is how we determine voting which our mps have forgotten
..
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Re: (OT) Welsh independence march.

Postby rumpo kid » Sat May 18, 2019 7:08 pm

Josh

That guy is an elitist cock. I don’t think I have ever read such a poorly presented piece of rubbish in my life. The LSE has long had a poor reputation in academia, and this is being upheld here.

I’d think twice about flying a flag for him, even tho he probably suits your monochromatic views most well.

It is a blog Josh, not a paper, and is opinion, not evidence. You need to grow up.
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Re: (OT) Welsh independence march.

Postby dogfound » Sun May 19, 2019 9:45 am

CCFCJosh75 wrote:
SirJimmySchoular wrote:
CCFCJosh75 wrote:
SirJimmySchoular wrote:No, you're absolutely right.
If you read my post addressing this I can assure you that the overwhelming majority of people fighting that war had absolutely no political motivation and by today's standards would be considered very racist and much further right than Nigel Farage.

This revamping of ww2 to suit the agenda of leftists and politically correct theorists is very dishonest and baseless .


People who actually lived during WW2 are actually one of the most pro EU 'groups' there is.
I think the brexiteers have used ww2 and 'blitz spirit' etc a lot more than leftist.
But, as people have said before, this thread is meant to be about Welsh independence so I'll speak no more on brexit.



But you want to move on upon a note of dishonesty ?
People who lived through ww2 are absolutely not going to approve of being dominated by Germany whatever the arguments might be. You have an entirely wrong impression about the attitudes of people at that time.


Well here's my evidence
https://blogs.lse.ac.uk/politicsandpoli ... 5s-brexit/
Now can you show me evidence of your statement please



does this count as evidence ?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rnx5_5ckn-0
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Re: (OT) Welsh independence march.

Postby WelshPatriot » Sun May 19, 2019 3:43 pm

CCFCJosh75 wrote:
SirJimmySchoular wrote:
CCFCJosh75 wrote:
SirJimmySchoular wrote:No, you're absolutely right.
If you read my post addressing this I can assure you that the overwhelming majority of people fighting that war had absolutely no political motivation and by today's standards would be considered very racist and much further right than Nigel Farage.

This revamping of ww2 to suit the agenda of leftists and politically correct theorists is very dishonest and baseless .


People who actually lived during WW2 are actually one of the most pro EU 'groups' there is.
I think the brexiteers have used ww2 and 'blitz spirit' etc a lot more than leftist.
But, as people have said before, this thread is meant to be about Welsh independence so I'll speak no more on brexit.



But you want to move on upon a note of dishonesty ?
People who lived through ww2 are absolutely not going to approve of being dominated by Germany whatever the arguments might be. You have an entirely wrong impression about the attitudes of people at that time.


Well here's my evidence
https://blogs.lse.ac.uk/politicsandpoli ... 5s-brexit/
Now can you show me evidence of your statement please


Jesus wept your evidence is a blog that claims the European Union (set up in 1993) was set up in response to the horrors and destruction of the Second World War.

Seriously is that your evidence???
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Re: (OT) Welsh independence march.

Postby BlueGog » Sun May 19, 2019 4:19 pm

pembroke allan wrote:
montyblue wrote:WEZ1927

i was' nt saying we could be using coal today it was about we never made as much money in the past with coal, as we could have if we held the purse strings and where independent before coal came about we as a country could have been very rich.

I was talking about the way westminster picks and chooses which region gets a share , and wales does'nt.



Never made much out coal as it was a nationalised industry so meant for whole uk same as oil? Even if we got the full amount of revenue what happens after it finished same with Scots and their oil revenue ? Great in theory but unless people are prepared to be taxed at 70% independence is unsustainable for us and Scots :thumbup:


They said that about Malta, Iceland, Ireland etc etc. They seem to be doing all right!
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Re: (OT) Welsh independence march.

Postby BlueGog » Sun May 19, 2019 4:21 pm

pembroke allan wrote:
montyblue wrote:WEZ1927

i was' nt saying we could be using coal today it was about we never made as much money in the past with coal, as we could have if we held the purse strings and where independent before coal came about we as a country could have been very rich.

I was talking about the way westminster picks and chooses which region gets a share , and wales does'nt.



Never made much out coal as it was a nationalised industry so meant for whole uk same as oil? Even if we got the full amount of revenue what happens after it finished same with Scots and their oil revenue ? Great in theory but unless people are prepared to be taxed at 70% independence is unsustainable for us and Scots :thumbup:


They said that about Malta, Iceland, Ireland etc etc. They seem to be doing all right!
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Re: (OT) Welsh independence march.

Postby Steve Zodiak » Sun May 19, 2019 4:58 pm

BlueGog wrote:
pembroke allan wrote:
montyblue wrote:WEZ1927

i was' nt saying we could be using coal today it was about we never made as much money in the past with coal, as we could have if we held the purse strings and where independent before coal came about we as a country could have been very rich.

I was talking about the way westminster picks and chooses which region gets a share , and wales does'nt.



Never made much out coal as it was a nationalised industry so meant for whole uk same as oil? Even if we got the full amount of revenue what happens after it finished same with Scots and their oil revenue ? Great in theory but unless people are prepared to be taxed at 70% independence is unsustainable for us and Scots :thumbup:


They said that about Malta, Iceland, Ireland etc etc. They seem to be doing all right!


I was under the impression that the Icelandic banking system collapsed not so long back, and that Ireland's economy was in such a mess it had to be bailed out by the EU, the IMF and loans from the UK.
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Re: (OT) Welsh independence march.

Postby BlueGog » Sun May 19, 2019 6:18 pm

pembroke allan wrote:
montyblue wrote:WEZ1927

i was' nt saying we could be using coal today it was about we never made as much money in the past with coal, as we could have if we held the purse strings and where independent before coal came about we as a country could have been very rich.

I was talking about the way westminster picks and chooses which region gets a share , and wales does'nt.



Never made much out coal as it was a nationalised industry so meant for whole uk same as oil? Even if we got the full amount of revenue what happens after it finished same with Scots and their oil revenue ? Great in theory but unless people are prepared to be taxed at 70% independence is unsustainable for us and Scots :thumbup:
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Re: (OT) Welsh independence march.

Postby dogfound » Sun May 19, 2019 8:42 pm

BlueGog wrote:
pembroke allan wrote:
montyblue wrote:WEZ1927

i was' nt saying we could be using coal today it was about we never made as much money in the past with coal, as we could have if we held the purse strings and where independent before coal came about we as a country could have been very rich.

I was talking about the way westminster picks and chooses which region gets a share , and wales does'nt.



Never made much out coal as it was a nationalised industry so meant for whole uk same as oil? Even if we got the full amount of revenue what happens after it finished same with Scots and their oil revenue ? Great in theory but unless people are prepared to be taxed at 70% independence is unsustainable for us and Scots :thumbup:


They said that about Malta, Iceland, Ireland etc etc. They seem to be doing all right!



we seem to be doing all right though..
and really not sure about that bunch if honest, think this might be more fake stuff that you have read like us being the worlds fifth biggest energy producer
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Re: (OT) Welsh independence march.

Postby pembroke allan » Sun May 19, 2019 9:09 pm

Steve Zodiak wrote:
BlueGog wrote:
pembroke allan wrote:
montyblue wrote:WEZ1927

i was' nt saying we could be using coal today it was about we never made as much money in the past with coal, as we could have if we held the purse strings and where independent before coal came about we as a country could have been very rich.

I was talking about the way westminster picks and chooses which region gets a share , and wales does'nt.



Never made much out coal as it was a nationalised industry so meant for whole uk same as oil? Even if we got the full amount of revenue what happens after it finished same with Scots and their oil revenue ? Great in theory but unless people are prepared to be taxed at 70% independence is unsustainable for us and Scots :thumbup:


They said that about Malta, Iceland, Ireland etc etc. They seem to be doing all right!


I was under the impression that the Icelandic banking system collapsed not so long back, and that Ireland's economy was in such a mess it had to be bailed out by the EU, the IMF and loans from the UK.




same thing is said every argument about independence these countries doing ok? on outside things looks ok but scratch serface and these countries are almost bankrupt and requires lot financial help from eu so do a lot of other countries! how scots and welsh people can think they can be independent from uk and be financially self sufficient beggers belief.... :o
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Re: (OT) Welsh independence march.

Postby Steve Zodiak » Sun May 19, 2019 9:23 pm

pembroke allan wrote:
Steve Zodiak wrote:
BlueGog wrote:
pembroke allan wrote:
montyblue wrote:WEZ1927

i was' nt saying we could be using coal today it was about we never made as much money in the past with coal, as we could have if we held the purse strings and where independent before coal came about we as a country could have been very rich.

I was talking about the way westminster picks and chooses which region gets a share , and wales does'nt.



Never made much out coal as it was a nationalised industry so meant for whole uk same as oil? Even if we got the full amount of revenue what happens after it finished same with Scots and their oil revenue ? Great in theory but unless people are prepared to be taxed at 70% independence is unsustainable for us and Scots :thumbup:


They said that about Malta, Iceland, Ireland etc etc. They seem to be doing all right!


I was under the impression that the Icelandic banking system collapsed not so long back, and that Ireland's economy was in such a mess it had to be bailed out by the EU, the IMF and loans from the UK.




same thing is said every argument about independence these countries doing ok? on outside things looks ok but scratch serface and these countries are almost bankrupt and requires lot financial help from eu so do a lot of other countries! how scots and welsh people can think they can be independent from uk and be financially self sufficient beggers belief.... :o


Won't be long before the EU will be bailing out the Italian economy and their banks again. And where will the money come from?
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Re: (OT) Welsh independence march.

Postby pembroke allan » Sun May 19, 2019 10:23 pm

Steve Zodiak wrote:
pembroke allan wrote:
Steve Zodiak wrote:
BlueGog wrote:
pembroke allan wrote:
montyblue wrote:WEZ1927

i was' nt saying we could be using coal today it was about we never made as much money in the past with coal, as we could have if we held the purse strings and where independent before coal came about we as a country could have been very rich.

I was talking about the way westminster picks and chooses which region gets a share , and wales does'nt.



Never made much out coal as it was a nationalised industry so meant for whole uk same as oil? Even if we got the full amount of revenue what happens after it finished same with Scots and their oil revenue ? Great in theory but unless people are prepared to be taxed at 70% independence is unsustainable for us and Scots :thumbup:


They said that about Malta, Iceland, Ireland etc etc. They seem to be doing all right!


I was under the impression that the Icelandic banking system collapsed not so long back, and that Ireland's economy was in such a mess it had to be bailed out by the EU, the IMF and loans from the UK.




same thing is said every argument about independence these countries doing ok? on outside things looks ok but scratch serface and these countries are almost bankrupt and requires lot financial help from eu so do a lot of other countries! how scots and welsh people can think they can be independent from uk and be financially self sufficient beggers belief.... :o


Won't be long before the EU will be bailing out the Italian economy and their banks again. And where will the money come from?



Their new govmnt want out as not fans of EU it's no coincidence that UK's big businessmen wants us to leave as EU red tape and regulation is styfling their businesses ...
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Re: (OT) Welsh independence march.

Postby BlueGog » Mon May 20, 2019 7:30 am

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Re: (OT) Welsh independence march.

Postby epping blue » Mon May 20, 2019 8:31 am





Well he's 10x better than Leanne but that wouldn't be hard. Thursday elections will give you the perfect yardstick by which to judge the potential support for independence. Main parties on their knees and in effect a free vote. He needs to be getting at least 25% of the vote and doing as well or even outdoing the Brexit party if his claims are credible. Don't see it myself.
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Re: (OT) Welsh independence march.

Postby BlueGog » Mon May 20, 2019 9:17 am

epping blue wrote:




Well he's 10x better than Leanne but that wouldn't be hard. Thursday elections will give you the perfect yardstick by which to judge the potential support for independence. Main parties on their knees and in effect a free vote. He needs to be getting at least 25% of the vote and doing as well or even outdoing the Brexit party if his claims are credible. Don't see it myself.


I don't really see Thursday as a yardstick. that's all about Brexit and you have Brexiteers and remainers who want independence. But as you say it will give an indication. Labour are third in the polls at the moment behind Brexit and Plaid and if that was the result on Thursday it would be a boost.

But this movement, YES Cymru is about so much more than party politics, you have people from all parties on board and all ethnic backgrounds and that is an absolute necessity for it to succeed. It's about wanting the best for your country and I believe WE can do a better job of running our country than another country with its capital over 100 miles away does. (They can't even run their own country at the moment!)
Independence is natural, it's seen all over the world, not one country that has chosen independence has changed its mind and gone back to being a colony. YES Cymru would like to see Wales join that family of nations.
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Re: (OT) Welsh independence march.

Postby paulh_85 » Mon May 20, 2019 9:46 am

BlueGog wrote:
epping blue wrote:




Well he's 10x better than Leanne but that wouldn't be hard. Thursday elections will give you the perfect yardstick by which to judge the potential support for independence. Main parties on their knees and in effect a free vote. He needs to be getting at least 25% of the vote and doing as well or even outdoing the Brexit party if his claims are credible. Don't see it myself.


I don't really see Thursday as a yardstick. that's all about Brexit and you have Brexiteers and remainers who want independence. But as you say it will give an indication. Labour are third in the polls at the moment behind Brexit and Plaid and if that was the result on Thursday it would be a boost.

But this movement, YES Cymru is about so much more than party politics, you have people from all parties on board and all ethnic backgrounds and that is an absolute necessity for it to succeed. It's about wanting the best for your country and I believe WE can do a better job of running our country than another country with its capital over 100 miles away does. (They can't even run their own country at the moment!)
Independence is natural, it's seen all over the world, not one country that has chosen independence has changed its mind and gone back to being a colony. YES Cymru would like to see Wales join that family of nations.




and then go cap in hand back to the EU :banghead:
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Re: (OT) Welsh independence march.

Postby Sven » Mon May 20, 2019 10:12 am

paulh_85 wrote:
BlueGog wrote:
epping blue wrote:




Well he's 10x better than Leanne but that wouldn't be hard. Thursday elections will give you the perfect yardstick by which to judge the potential support for independence. Main parties on their knees and in effect a free vote. He needs to be getting at least 25% of the vote and doing as well or even outdoing the Brexit party if his claims are credible. Don't see it myself.


I don't really see Thursday as a yardstick. that's all about Brexit and you have Brexiteers and remainers who want independence. But as you say it will give an indication. Labour are third in the polls at the moment behind Brexit and Plaid and if that was the result on Thursday it would be a boost.

But this movement, YES Cymru is about so much more than party politics, you have people from all parties on board and all ethnic backgrounds and that is an absolute necessity for it to succeed. It's about wanting the best for your country and I believe WE can do a better job of running our country than another country with its capital over 100 miles away does. (They can't even run their own country at the moment!)
Independence is natural, it's seen all over the world, not one country that has chosen independence has changed its mind and gone back to being a colony. YES Cymru would like to see Wales join that family of nations.




and then go cap in hand back to the EU :banghead:


With an even bigger 'Begging Bowl' than the Scots...! ;) :roll:
"If you think what I say is 'offensive' to you, you should hear what I keep to myself...!"
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Re: (OT) Welsh independence march.

Postby SirJimmySchoular » Mon May 20, 2019 10:20 am

Why do people assume that the EU would let Wales join ?
It wouldn't qualify or pass any of the economic tests.
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Re: (OT) Welsh independence march.

Postby Lengee » Mon May 20, 2019 2:42 pm

Bluegog
You make some good points. Your newspaper clips relating to Singapore and Malta help counter one of the main arguments against independance. Also the attachment you included does include a very good speech rallying from your new leader.He is far better than Leanne Woods!
I accept what you say that the UK is Englandcentric, and the govt in Westminster largely looks after the South East and middle England. The Welsh voice can be largely ignored. UK leaders believe t (partly because of he numbers of English living in Wales) that Welsh independence is"pie In the sky".
I am not a nationalist, but a proud Welshman generally happy enough for Wales to be be part of the UK.
in the short term, the Euro elections will see huge gains for the Brexit party. This may lead to Scotland leaving the UK. And many people like me will not wish to be part of an intolerant inward looking England led by Garage and his ilk,(with Wales tagged on). If that occurs 10000s (like me) may turn to Welsh nationalism.
:bluebird:
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Re: (OT) Welsh independence march.

Postby SirJimmySchoular » Mon May 20, 2019 4:07 pm

BlueGog wrote:
epping blue wrote:




Well he's 10x better than Leanne but that wouldn't be hard. Thursday elections will give you the perfect yardstick by which to judge the potential support for independence. Main parties on their knees and in effect a free vote. He needs to be getting at least 25% of the vote and doing as well or even outdoing the Brexit party if his claims are credible. Don't see it myself.


I don't really see Thursday as a yardstick. that's all about Brexit and you have Brexiteers and remainers who want independence. But as you say it will give an indication. Labour are third in the polls at the moment behind Brexit and Plaid and if that was the result on Thursday it would be a boost.

But this movement, YES Cymru is about so much more than party politics, you have people from all parties on board and all ethnic backgrounds and that is an absolute necessity for it to succeed. It's about wanting the best for your country and I believe WE can do a better job of running our country than another country with its capital over 100 miles away does. (They can't even run their own country at the moment!)
Independence is natural, it's seen all over the world, not one country that has chosen independence has changed its mind and gone back to being a colony. YES Cymru would like to see Wales join that family of nations.



Who's colony is Wales then ?
In the same way it's never been a country it's never been and isn't a colony.
It took part in colonising other countries along wth the rest of Britain so it's HAD colonies, but it's never been one.

Once again we come back to arguing with people who don't have any grip on reality or history and want to establish something out of their imagination as fact.

Let's drive all the flying monkeys out of Cardiff Castle whilst we're at it shall we ?
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Re: (OT) Welsh independence march.

Postby BlueGog » Mon May 20, 2019 5:19 pm

SirJimmySchoular wrote:
BlueGog wrote:
epping blue wrote:




Well he's 10x better than Leanne but that wouldn't be hard. Thursday elections will give you the perfect yardstick by which to judge the potential support for independence. Main parties on their knees and in effect a free vote. He needs to be getting at least 25% of the vote and doing as well or even outdoing the Brexit party if his claims are credible. Don't see it myself.


I don't really see Thursday as a yardstick. that's all about Brexit and you have Brexiteers and remainers who want independence. But as you say it will give an indication. Labour are third in the polls at the moment behind Brexit and Plaid and if that was the result on Thursday it would be a boost.

But this movement, YES Cymru is about so much more than party politics, you have people from all parties on board and all ethnic backgrounds and that is an absolute necessity for it to succeed. It's about wanting the best for your country and I believe WE can do a better job of running our country than another country with its capital over 100 miles away does. (They can't even run their own country at the moment!)
Independence is natural, it's seen all over the world, not one country that has chosen independence has changed its mind and gone back to being a colony. YES Cymru would like to see Wales join that family of nations.



Who's colony is Wales then ?
In the same way it's never been a country it's never been and isn't a colony.
It took part in colonising other countries along wth the rest of Britain so it's HAD colonies, but it's never been one.

Once again we come back to arguing with people who don't have any grip on reality or history and want to establish something out of their imagination as fact.

Let's drive all the flying monkeys out of Cardiff Castle whilst we're at it shall we ?


Your view on things isn't quite correct is it. Your assumption that Wales was never a country has some truth. But it's not that simple. The 'welsh' occupied most of Britain before that Anglo Saxon invasion and were pushed westward by the invaders until they occupied four main areas - the area of southern Scotland, Cumbria (clue in the name), Cornwall and what is now Wales. There are still plenty of clues out there - Dover - from the welsh dwfr (water) Lanark - from the Welsh llanerch and there's more than a few Avon about (afon - river).

Wales as we now know it was ruled as a 'country' by Gruffydd ap Llywelyn and Owain Gwynedd. When Wales was conquered in 1282 we became England's first colony. A long time ago, but still a fact. Just imagine how difficult it must have been to tame us! They had to build a ring of castles to keep us in our place!!
For a short while during the 1400s Glyndŵr ruled Wales as one country and planned to build universities etc. Wales 'as a country' was annexed to England in the Act of Union of 1536. This wasn't done with Welsh consent by the way.

You are correct when you say that some Welshmen played a large part in creating the 'British Empire' Unfortunately we have a lot of blood on our hands. We played our part in creating many colonies as you correctly say. But we are England's first and last colony.
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Re: (OT) Welsh independence march.

Postby rumpo kid » Mon May 20, 2019 5:50 pm

Adam Price is a failure in business.. in fact he has a long track record of outstanding underachievement.

I think the languages you refer, were called Gaelic.

But you knew that.
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