Thu Jun 20, 2019 10:46 am
dogfound wrote:its actually a compliment dating back to when the penalty for sheep stealing was death..
Welshmen caught in the act of stealing a sheep were smart enough to claim it was nothing of the sort and they just wanted a quick shag...hence { very smart } sheepshaggers..as opposed to very stupid dead Englishmen..
Thu Jun 20, 2019 11:52 am
SirJimmySchoular wrote:moonboots wrote:Jock wrote:moonboots wrote:Bluebird1990 wrote:Welsh isn't a race so no, its not racist
Of course we are a race.
Bollox.
Nice contribution.
It is bollocks though isn't it ? How the f**k can Welsh be a race ?
Shirley Bassey isn't the same race as Gareth Edwards but they're both Welsh.
And Welsh people aren't any more or less likely to be of a Celtic origin than English people.
Thu Jun 20, 2019 11:53 am
ealing_ayatollah wrote:dogfound wrote:its actually a compliment dating back to when the penalty for sheep stealing was death..
Welshmen caught in the act of stealing a sheep were smart enough to claim it was nothing of the sort and they just wanted a quick shag...hence { very smart } sheepshaggers..as opposed to very stupid dead Englishmen..
Never knew that - good bit of knowledge that mate cheers!
Thu Jun 20, 2019 12:27 pm
Jock wrote:ealing_ayatollah wrote:dogfound wrote:its actually a compliment dating back to when the penalty for sheep stealing was death..
Welshmen caught in the act of stealing a sheep were smart enough to claim it was nothing of the sort and they just wanted a quick shag...hence { very smart } sheepshaggers..as opposed to very stupid dead Englishmen..
Never knew that - good bit of knowledge that mate cheers!
Good bit of knowledge for what, if you get caught sheep rustling, just drop your keks and fire into the nearest sheep?
Thu Jun 20, 2019 1:46 pm
ealing_ayatollah wrote:Jock wrote:ealing_ayatollah wrote:dogfound wrote:its actually a compliment dating back to when the penalty for sheep stealing was death..
Welshmen caught in the act of stealing a sheep were smart enough to claim it was nothing of the sort and they just wanted a quick shag...hence { very smart } sheepshaggers..as opposed to very stupid dead Englishmen..
Never knew that - good bit of knowledge that mate cheers!
Good bit of knowledge for what, if you get caught sheep rustling, just drop your keks and fire into the nearest sheep?
Don't judge me too harshly Jock, London's an expensive town and I got mouths to feed. Mans gotta make a living somehow!
Thu Jun 20, 2019 1:53 pm
Bluebird1990 wrote:Black, Caucasian, Capoid, Mongoloid, Australoid are races.
Welsh/Celtic is not a race. Celts are a part of the caucasian race.
Thu Jun 20, 2019 2:37 pm
Thu Jun 20, 2019 2:52 pm
Bluebird1990 wrote:Bluebina wrote:Deep Blue FC wrote:Basically, in work, me and a colleague got in a random debate on wether Sheep shagger is racist if said to a Welsh person?
My current opinion is that it obviously is? But since the guy I'm speaking to seems CONVINCED that it isn't, I just want to grasp the general opinion.
Now, before you answer I am 100% not saying I'm offended by sheepshagger, I call others sheepshaggers too, even at Cardiff games we sing "sheepshagging bastards we know what we are" etc. I'm well aware it's all in good fun etc.
But if you weren't Welsh and you call a Welsh person a sheep shagger, surely it's racist? Just logically it is? that's my opinion anyway.
Obviously we take it well and joke about it, but I still think technically and everything else it's racist, surely?
That's all I'm asking. Is it racist, if it is - why, and if it isn't - why?
-I can come up with alot of reasons why it IS, but not really any reasons to explain why it isn't.
I would say yes, if you received an email from your English Boss, saying get this work done by five you sheepshagger............
you could take it to HR and complain and they would have to act if you said that was racist against you because you are Welsh?
They wouldn't say no that's fine because you're not a race?
Thats stupid as f**k of course they wouldnt say its ok, its still a form of bigotry but its not racist because welsh isnt a race
Thu Jun 20, 2019 2:55 pm
Bluebina wrote:Bluebird1990 wrote:Bluebina wrote:Deep Blue FC wrote:Basically, in work, me and a colleague got in a random debate on wether Sheep shagger is racist if said to a Welsh person?
My current opinion is that it obviously is? But since the guy I'm speaking to seems CONVINCED that it isn't, I just want to grasp the general opinion.
Now, before you answer I am 100% not saying I'm offended by sheepshagger, I call others sheepshaggers too, even at Cardiff games we sing "sheepshagging bastards we know what we are" etc. I'm well aware it's all in good fun etc.
But if you weren't Welsh and you call a Welsh person a sheep shagger, surely it's racist? Just logically it is? that's my opinion anyway.
Obviously we take it well and joke about it, but I still think technically and everything else it's racist, surely?
That's all I'm asking. Is it racist, if it is - why, and if it isn't - why?
-I can come up with alot of reasons why it IS, but not really any reasons to explain why it isn't.
I would say yes, if you received an email from your English Boss, saying get this work done by five you sheepshagger............
you could take it to HR and complain and they would have to act if you said that was racist against you because you are Welsh?
They wouldn't say no that's fine because you're not a race?
Thats stupid as f**k of course they wouldnt say its ok, its still a form of bigotry but its not racist because welsh isnt a race
Yes it is!
So are the Scottish and to call them Sweaties would be racist!
Thu Jun 20, 2019 2:57 pm
Tony Blue Williams wrote:Bluebird1990 wrote:Black, Caucasian, Capoid, Mongoloid, Australoid are races.
Welsh/Celtic is not a race. Celts are a part of the caucasian race.
That is a matter of opinion not fact
Thu Jun 20, 2019 3:18 pm
Bluebird1990 wrote:Tony Blue Williams wrote:Bluebird1990 wrote:Black, Caucasian, Capoid, Mongoloid, Australoid are races.
Welsh/Celtic is not a race. Celts are a part of the caucasian race.
That is a matter of opinion not fact
No its not, its 100% fact
Thu Jun 20, 2019 3:19 pm
Deep Blue FC wrote:Basically, in work, me and a colleague got in a random debate on wether Sheep shagger is racist if said to a Welsh person?
My current opinion is that it obviously is? But since the guy I'm speaking to seems CONVINCED that it isn't, I just want to grasp the general opinion.
Now, before you answer I am 100% not saying I'm offended by sheepshagger, I call others sheepshaggers too, even at Cardiff games we sing "sheepshagging bastards we know what we are" etc. I'm well aware it's all in good fun etc.
But if you weren't Welsh and you call a Welsh person a sheep shagger, surely it's racist? Just logically it is? that's my opinion anyway.
Obviously we take it well and joke about it, but I still think technically and everything else it's racist, surely?
That's all I'm asking. Is it racist, if it is - why, and if it isn't - why?
-I can come up with alot of reasons why it IS, but not really any reasons to explain why it isn't.
Thu Jun 20, 2019 4:13 pm
Bluebina wrote:Deep Blue FC wrote:Basically, in work, me and a colleague got in a random debate on wether Sheep shagger is racist if said to a Welsh person?
My current opinion is that it obviously is? But since the guy I'm speaking to seems CONVINCED that it isn't, I just want to grasp the general opinion.
Now, before you answer I am 100% not saying I'm offended by sheepshagger, I call others sheepshaggers too, even at Cardiff games we sing "sheepshagging bastards we know what we are" etc. I'm well aware it's all in good fun etc.
But if you weren't Welsh and you call a Welsh person a sheep shagger, surely it's racist? Just logically it is? that's my opinion anyway.
Obviously we take it well and joke about it, but I still think technically and everything else it's racist, surely?
That's all I'm asking. Is it racist, if it is - why, and if it isn't - why?
-I can come up with alot of reasons why it IS, but not really any reasons to explain why it isn't.
http://theconversation.com/why-racism-a ... cism-96303
YES
Thu Jun 20, 2019 4:29 pm
Bluebina wrote:Bluebird1990 wrote:Tony Blue Williams wrote:Bluebird1990 wrote:Black, Caucasian, Capoid, Mongoloid, Australoid are races.
Welsh/Celtic is not a race. Celts are a part of the caucasian race.
That is a matter of opinion not fact
No its not, its 100% fact
http://theconversation.com/why-racism-a ... cism-96303
Thu Jun 20, 2019 5:52 pm
Bluebina wrote:Bluebird1990 wrote:Bluebina wrote:Deep Blue FC wrote:Basically, in work, me and a colleague got in a random debate on wether Sheep shagger is racist if said to a Welsh person?
My current opinion is that it obviously is? But since the guy I'm speaking to seems CONVINCED that it isn't, I just want to grasp the general opinion.
Now, before you answer I am 100% not saying I'm offended by sheepshagger, I call others sheepshaggers too, even at Cardiff games we sing "sheepshagging bastards we know what we are" etc. I'm well aware it's all in good fun etc.
But if you weren't Welsh and you call a Welsh person a sheep shagger, surely it's racist? Just logically it is? that's my opinion anyway.
Obviously we take it well and joke about it, but I still think technically and everything else it's racist, surely?
That's all I'm asking. Is it racist, if it is - why, and if it isn't - why?
-I can come up with alot of reasons why it IS, but not really any reasons to explain why it isn't.
I would say yes, if you received an email from your English Boss, saying get this work done by five you sheepshagger............
you could take it to HR and complain and they would have to act if you said that was racist against you because you are Welsh?
They wouldn't say no that's fine because you're not a race?
Thats stupid as f**k of course they wouldnt say its ok, its still a form of bigotry but its not racist because welsh isnt a race
Yes it is!
So are the Scottish and to call them Sweaties would be racist!
Thu Jun 20, 2019 5:55 pm
Bluebird1990 wrote:Bluebina wrote:Bluebird1990 wrote:Tony Blue Williams wrote:Bluebird1990 wrote:Black, Caucasian, Capoid, Mongoloid, Australoid are races.
Welsh/Celtic is not a race. Celts are a part of the caucasian race.
That is a matter of opinion not fact
No its not, its 100% fact
http://theconversation.com/why-racism-a ... cism-96303
Well done for finding a random articles writen by a random journalist, that doesn't make it scientific fact. If you think welsh, french, english ect. are races then you're genuinely stupid.
Go learn the difference between race, nationality and ethnicity
Thu Jun 20, 2019 5:59 pm
Thu Jun 20, 2019 6:04 pm
Jock wrote:Bluebird1990 wrote:Bluebina wrote:Bluebird1990 wrote:Tony Blue Williams wrote:Bluebird1990 wrote:Black, Caucasian, Capoid, Mongoloid, Australoid are races.
Welsh/Celtic is not a race. Celts are a part of the caucasian race.
That is a matter of opinion not fact
No its not, its 100% fact
http://theconversation.com/why-racism-a ... cism-96303
Well done for finding a random articles writen by a random journalist, that doesn't make it scientific fact. If you think welsh, french, english ect. are races then you're genuinely stupid.
Go learn the difference between race, nationality and ethnicity
It’s like claiming every country in Africa or Latin America is a different race, beyond absurd.
Thu Jun 20, 2019 7:45 pm
Thu Jun 20, 2019 8:23 pm
Thu Jun 20, 2019 9:20 pm
Bluebird1990 wrote:Tony Blue Williams wrote:Bluebird1990 wrote:Black, Caucasian, Capoid, Mongoloid, Australoid are races.
Welsh/Celtic is not a race. Celts are a part of the caucasian race.
That is a matter of opinion not fact
No its not, its 100% fact
Thu Jun 20, 2019 9:26 pm
Steve Zodiak wrote:Loads of stuff on the internet about this eg. :-The traditional definition of race and ethnicity is related to biological and sociological factors respectively. Race refers to a person's physical characteristics, such as bone structure and skin, hair, or eye color. Ethnicity, however, refers to cultural factors, including nationality, regional culture, ancestry, and language.
An example of race is brown, white, or black skin (all from various parts of the world), while an example of ethnicity is German or Spanish ancestry (regardless of race) or Han Chinese. Your race is determined by how you look while your ethnicity is determined based on the social and cultural groups you belong to. You can have more than one ethnicities but you are said to have one race, even if it's "mixed race".
Thu Jun 20, 2019 10:20 pm
Fri Jun 21, 2019 4:06 am
Fri Jun 21, 2019 7:57 am
Bluebird1990 wrote:Bluebina wrote:Bluebird1990 wrote:Tony Blue Williams wrote:Bluebird1990 wrote:Black, Caucasian, Capoid, Mongoloid, Australoid are races.
Welsh/Celtic is not a race. Celts are a part of the caucasian race.
That is a matter of opinion not fact
No its not, its 100% fact
http://theconversation.com/why-racism-a ... cism-96303
Well done for finding a random articles writen by a random journalist, that doesn't make it scientific fact. If you think welsh, french, english ect. are races then you're genuinely stupid.
Go learn the difference between race, nationality and ethnicity
Fri Jun 21, 2019 8:51 am
Fri Jun 21, 2019 10:11 am
Bedwas Bluebird wrote:For clarity the Equality Act 2010 defines race as:
Race
(1)Race includes—
(a)colour;
(b)nationality;
(c)ethnic or national origins.
(2)In relation to the protected characteristic of race—
(a)a reference to a person who has a particular protected characteristic is a reference to a person of a particular racial group;
(b)a reference to persons who share a protected characteristic is a reference to persons of the same racial group.
(3)A racial group is a group of persons defined by reference to race; and a reference to a person's racial group is a reference to a racial group into which the person falls.
(4)The fact that a racial group comprises two or more distinct racial groups does not prevent it from constituting a particular racial group.
Anyone who is treated less favourably because of race can potentially claim race discrimination. I am not personally offended by the term but work in employment law so am aware of what to say or not say in the workplace to avoid any issues. Interestingly racial harassment (or harassment based on other protected characteristics such as gender, age, disability etc) is only a problem if unwanted as illustrated by a recent appeal case where someone was called a fat ginger pikey - https://www.dentons.com/en/insights/new ... harassment . To be harassment it has to be unwanted. Be warned however that someone else could be offended and complaints can be made because of race and not necessarily their own
Don't shoot the messenger. I don't create the law we just have to work with it!!
Fri Jun 21, 2019 1:06 pm
moonboots wrote:Bedwas Bluebird wrote:For clarity the Equality Act 2010 defines race as:
Race
(1)Race includes—
(a)colour;
(b)nationality;
(c)ethnic or national origins.
(2)In relation to the protected characteristic of race—
(a)a reference to a person who has a particular protected characteristic is a reference to a person of a particular racial group;
(b)a reference to persons who share a protected characteristic is a reference to persons of the same racial group.
(3)A racial group is a group of persons defined by reference to race; and a reference to a person's racial group is a reference to a racial group into which the person falls.
(4)The fact that a racial group comprises two or more distinct racial groups does not prevent it from constituting a particular racial group.
Anyone who is treated less favourably because of race can potentially claim race discrimination. I am not personally offended by the term but work in employment law so am aware of what to say or not say in the workplace to avoid any issues. Interestingly racial harassment (or harassment based on other protected characteristics such as gender, age, disability etc) is only a problem if unwanted as illustrated by a recent appeal case where someone was called a fat ginger pikey - https://www.dentons.com/en/insights/new ... harassment . To be harassment it has to be unwanted. Be warned however that someone else could be offended and complaints can be made because of race and not necessarily their own
Don't shoot the messenger. I don't create the law we just have to work with it!!
Also, the following is taken from the ACAS website:
Race
The Equality Act protects employees from discrimination, harassment and
victimisation because of the protected characteristic of Race, which may
include different elements that often merge:
race – an umbrella term for the other four aspects.
colour – like ‘race’ it tends to overlap, particularly with the concepts of
‘ethnic origin’ and ‘national origin’. Examples include black and white.
ethnic origin – may include racial, religious and cultural factors which
give a group of people a distinct social identity with a long and shared
history. Examples include Sikhs, Jews, Romany Gypsies and Irish
Travellers.
national origin –birthplace, the geographical area and its history can
be key factors. Examples include Welsh and English.
nationality – usually the recognised state of which the employee is a
citizen. In other words, what it says in their passport if they have one.
I think that pretty much proves it conclusively, that in the eyes of the law IT IS racism. So for those who say that the Welsh are not a race, the law seems to say that we are. Welsh and proud.
Fri Jun 21, 2019 2:20 pm
Jock wrote:moonboots wrote:Bedwas Bluebird wrote:For clarity the Equality Act 2010 defines race as:
Race
(1)Race includes—
(a)colour;
(b)nationality;
(c)ethnic or national origins.
(2)In relation to the protected characteristic of race—
(a)a reference to a person who has a particular protected characteristic is a reference to a person of a particular racial group;
(b)a reference to persons who share a protected characteristic is a reference to persons of the same racial group.
(3)A racial group is a group of persons defined by reference to race; and a reference to a person's racial group is a reference to a racial group into which the person falls.
(4)The fact that a racial group comprises two or more distinct racial groups does not prevent it from constituting a particular racial group.
Anyone who is treated less favourably because of race can potentially claim race discrimination. I am not personally offended by the term but work in employment law so am aware of what to say or not say in the workplace to avoid any issues. Interestingly racial harassment (or harassment based on other protected characteristics such as gender, age, disability etc) is only a problem if unwanted as illustrated by a recent appeal case where someone was called a fat ginger pikey - https://www.dentons.com/en/insights/new ... harassment . To be harassment it has to be unwanted. Be warned however that someone else could be offended and complaints can be made because of race and not necessarily their own
Don't shoot the messenger. I don't create the law we just have to work with it!!
Also, the following is taken from the ACAS website:
Race
The Equality Act protects employees from discrimination, harassment and
victimisation because of the protected characteristic of Race, which may
include different elements that often merge:
race – an umbrella term for the other four aspects.
colour – like ‘race’ it tends to overlap, particularly with the concepts of
‘ethnic origin’ and ‘national origin’. Examples include black and white.
ethnic origin – may include racial, religious and cultural factors which
give a group of people a distinct social identity with a long and shared
history. Examples include Sikhs, Jews, Romany Gypsies and Irish
Travellers.
national origin –birthplace, the geographical area and its history can
be key factors. Examples include Welsh and English.
nationality – usually the recognised state of which the employee is a
citizen. In other words, what it says in their passport if they have one.
I think that pretty much proves it conclusively, that in the eyes of the law IT IS racism. So for those who say that the Welsh are not a race, the law seems to say that we are. Welsh and proud.
So you have a Welsh Passport?
Fri Jun 21, 2019 6:11 pm