Why we need to leave the EU

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Why we need to leave the EU

Postby popeye21 » Fri Sep 06, 2019 7:40 pm

IMHO Italy will crash out of the Euro and bring down the EU like a pack of cards due to the following :-
1) More than 2 Trillion Euros and 132% of GDP.
2) Over 300 Billion Euros of bad debt (Banca dei Monte dei Pacha de Siena, the oldest bank in the world has dropped from around 90 billion Euros in value to around a billion).
3) Target2 debt of around 436 Billion Euros (a loan without interest and no obligation to pay).
4) Italian banks are dumping government bonds, with 40 Billion Euros of Italian sovereign bonds dumped in the last three months of 2017.
5) The ECB is buying Italian government faster than is allowed under it's capital key rules.
6) In March 2018 Italy could borrow money for less than the US government, despite being a higher risk, due to the ECB, yet the US Federal Reserve had already stopped its purchase of American bonds.
7) Italy spends 10% of revenue on interest (4% of GDP), double the OECD average and the highest in Europe in the last 6 years.
8) There's been a triple-dip recession since 2008, with unemployment over 10% and youth unemployment over 30%.
9) The future's gloomy as well, with the IMF estimating that it will take another decade for the economy to recover to pre-2008 levels.
10) Italian debt and the cost of debt are growing faster than the economy.

Nickolai Hubble (2019) How The Euro Dies

The price of gold is rising and some 10 year and 30 year bonds have negative interest, because the rich know that a crash is coming. The US trade war with China may reduce trade and world growth, but IMHO the crash will trigger with Italy bailing out of the Euro. Yet the politicians want to keep us in the EU, where we will suffer more when this happens. Even Alan Greenspan said in 2016 that at some point somebody's going to say, "I don't want to accept Euros."
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Why we need to leave the EU

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Re: Why we need to leave the EU

Postby welshrarebit » Fri Sep 06, 2019 7:45 pm

Ultimately it doesn't matter if the political class think we were wrong to vote to leave. We were asked a question. We answered it. It doesn't matter it was advisory. The advice was leave. Rather than f**k about for 3 years trying to block it they should have been working to firstly mitigate any impact of a WTO exit and building bridges and cooperation with the EU. That's what have created so many hysterical extremes. They refuse to do it and have even worked to undermine the country in favour of the EU. People that voted leave feel angry because we haven't left and those voting to remain have been weaponised by those with their own agenda. Politics stinks IMHO.
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Re: Why we need to leave the EU

Postby popeye21 » Fri Sep 06, 2019 7:46 pm

A lot of the problems are due to Target2, a stupid system that most have never heard about. It's a compulsory loan with no interest an no obligation to pay.


https://www.quora.com/Which-countries-w ... y-leave-it

The Quora link gives a simple explanation of the stupidity of Target2 IMHO :-

The easiest way to understand Target2 balances is to discover how they come about. You’ll realise just how odd the whole thing is.

There are two ways. The first is to do with trade.

When a Greek buys a German car, he sends money to Germany and gets a car in return.

The eurozone monetary system now has a problem. The amount of euros in Greece has fallen and the amount of euros in Germany has risen. This couldn’t happen if each country had its own currency, as that currency would only be valid in their home country.

If Greece continues with a trade deficit over time, it’ll eventually run out of euros. Which is a terrifying prospect for economists. So they send the money from Germany back to Greece via the Target2 system.

To record the transaction of euros flowing back south, Germany gets a Target2 asset and Greece a Target2 liability. In a way, Greece gives Germany a very abstract “IOU” for the money sent to Greece.

Over time, as the trade deficit continues, Germany’s Target2 assets build up and Greece’s Target2 liability builds up.

In theory, the trade balance is supposed to reverse… eventually. Olive oil exports sold to Germany become bigger than German car exports sold to Greece. The Target2 balance trends back towards 0. No problems arise.

The trouble is, the Target2 system has abolished all the natural forces which make trade rebalance over time. The exchange rate between Germany and Greece cannot adjust to encourage Greek exports and make German cars more expensive in Greece. They’re both on the euro.

Because Target2 is nothing but an accounting entry, it effectively costs Greece as a country nothing to buy German cars. The money they paid Germans flows straight back into Greece via Target2. So the Greeks can go on buying more German cars.

The Germans are being robbed, and they’re financing Greece’s trade deficit at the same time. Without any hope of that trade deficit reversing. Which means the Greek economy is kept in the doldrums, unable to rebalance and return to economic growth.
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Re: Why we need to leave the EU

Postby popeye21 » Fri Sep 06, 2019 8:01 pm

welshrarebit wrote:Ultimately it doesn't matter if the political class think we were wrong to vote to leave. We were asked a question. We answered it. It doesn't matter it was advisory. The advice was leave. Rather than f**k about for 3 years trying to block it they should have been working to firstly mitigate any impact of a WTO exit and building bridges and cooperation with the EU. That's what have created so many hysterical extremes. They refuse to do it and have even worked to undermine the country in favour of the EU. People that voted leave feel angry because we haven't left and those voting to remain have been weaponised by those with their own agenda. Politics stinks IMHO.


They've never had it so good. The only paid job for them was in Westminster before we joined the Common Market, as LA councillor's only got expenses back then. Now there are arguably six layers of government here, LA's, Westminster, WA, EU and so many quangos that they equate to another two layers of government. This is why despite paying more, we get less. Roads with pot holes, inadequate refuse collection,lack of school places, waiting lists in hospitals, difficulty getting Doctors appointments and no NHS dentists in some areas. The EU is a gravy train for politicians, with vast expenses, no need for receipts and massive pensions. If they lose their job in Westminster they go straight into a job in the EU.
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Re: Why we need to leave the EU

Postby popeye21 » Fri Sep 06, 2019 8:26 pm

All Boris has to do is to ask the EU for an extension and then immediately veto it, as ALL MEMBER STATES GET TO VOTE. Corbyn and Swinson will then have to take up the offer of an election, where they will lose due to the Boris Farage pact. Rich remainers will be scared of letting in Corbyn and will vote Tory or Lib Dem, while the working class brexiteers who would normally vote Labour will vote for the Brexit Party. Even Labour front benchers don't understand Labour's Brexit stance, so what chance have they got in convincing the electorate.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CSa2wvJ ... e=youtu.be
Why even Emily Thornberry doesn't understand Labour's Brexit stance
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Re: Why we need to leave the EU

Postby JulesK » Sat Sep 07, 2019 8:58 am

Excellent OP but a slight flaw in that is now the EU have once again worked their crooked system to get the anti EU party out and push their lap dogs back in. We all know the EU keeps everyone voting until the dice fall their way!!
Keeping the Faith since '74.
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Re: Why we need to leave the EU

Postby pembroke allan » Sat Sep 07, 2019 10:03 am

JulesK wrote:Excellent OP but a slight flaw in that is now the EU have once again worked their crooked system to get the anti EU party out and push their lap dogs back in. We all know the EU keeps everyone voting until the dice fall their way!!




Well the traitors have played nicely into their hands they've said happy to delay Brexit until January even before things are sorted! But people are starting to see tbe remain MPs for what they are and come election how many will be booted out? Wouldn't be surprised if boris resigns to stick 2 fingers up at them so triggering an election.....
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Re: Why we need to leave the EU

Postby Jock » Sat Sep 07, 2019 11:40 am

Only Germany and the Netherlands have benefited from the Euro, every other country who joined are worse off.
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Re: Why we need to leave the EU

Postby epping blue » Sat Sep 07, 2019 12:08 pm

Jock wrote:Only Germany and the Netherlands have benefited from the Euro, every other country who joined are worse off.



It's supported by pro European Ideology. If we end up staying we'll be in within 5 years, that's if hasn't collapsed in the meantime. John Major did his best to take us in and fabricated dire financial predictions should we stray from the path of joining. Thank f**k for Black Wednesday and crashing out.
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Re: Why we need to leave the EU

Postby JulesK » Sat Sep 07, 2019 12:10 pm

French farmers need to go on that list Jock :thumbup:

Allen I'm with you on this but as we all know in Wales you can stick a red Rosette on anything and they'll vote for it !! Hopefully times are changing.

C'mon Boris let the traitors think they have won then veto it yourself as an EU member !!! Oh it will be hilarious watching the coup leaders like Saville and Comrade Corbyn gnashing their teeth at that :x :x :x :x :x :x
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Re: Why we need to leave the EU

Postby pembroke allan » Sat Sep 07, 2019 12:25 pm

JulesK wrote:French farmers need to go on that list Jock :thumbup:

Allen I'm with you on this but as we all know in Wales you can stick a red Rosette on anything and they'll vote for it !! Hopefully times are changing.

C'mon Boris let the traitors think they have won then veto it yourself as an EU member !!! Oh it will be hilarious watching the coup leaders like Saville and Comrade Corbyn gnashing their teeth at that :x :x :x :x :x :x


We have 2 days to accept a date if EU gives us a date thats a very tight deadline wonder if boris can delay this I think people are underestimating boris and what he can do to make sure leave oct 31st
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Re: Why we need to leave the EU

Postby TopCat CCFC » Sat Sep 07, 2019 9:40 pm

Dominic Cummings .....Clueless Clown ;)

This Country :roll:
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