Sun Feb 02, 2020 7:56 pm
Sun Feb 02, 2020 8:03 pm
Sun Feb 02, 2020 8:12 pm
wez1927 wrote:McKay organised the illegal flight, he was nantes selling agent, why should we lose 15 million for other peoples negligence?
Sun Feb 02, 2020 8:14 pm
Sun Feb 02, 2020 8:15 pm
Sun Feb 02, 2020 8:17 pm
Sun Feb 02, 2020 8:18 pm
worcester_ccfc wrote:He's answered the question in his first six words.
That's the only reason we haven't paid and we're to bend the law to get away with it.
The club know full well the correct thing to do was to pay the money.
Yet they are still doing all they can to get out of it. Shameful.
By the way I don't believe a word Dalman says. I've met him several times and he lies like other breathe.
He would have made a good politician.
Sun Feb 02, 2020 8:26 pm
OrlandoBloo wrote:worcester_ccfc wrote:He's answered the question in his first six words.
That's the only reason we haven't paid and we're to bend the law to get away with it.
The club know full well the correct thing to do was to pay the money.
Yet they are still doing all they can to get out of it. Shameful.
By the way I don't believe a word Dalman says. I've met him several times and he lies like other breathe.
He would have made a good politician.
Well that answers my question Ned.
He contradicts himself not only in what he says but his confused legal action. To the French he was theirs (and have some kind of warped view that they have control over player transportation) and to CAS he isn’t theirs.
Then he says he would pay if they are told they have to... then says they don’t have it.
Sun Feb 02, 2020 8:27 pm
Sun Feb 02, 2020 8:27 pm
paulh_85 wrote:Moving aside the point of weather we should or shouldn't pay for a moment.... How the hell do we not have the money? If this never happened we would have paid the money... So what's the difference
Sun Feb 02, 2020 8:32 pm
Sun Feb 02, 2020 8:34 pm
bluebirdoct1962 wrote:wez1927 wrote:Forever Blue wrote:Mehmet Dalman:
About paying Nantes FC for Emiliano Sala
“Firstly we don't have the money. And secondly, if we don't have to pay, why should we? There is a lot more to this than perhaps people sometimes realise, things that still need to come out.”
"As chairman, I'm the guardian of this football club and I have to do what's right for us.
"Do you know, even if we had £15m to spare, were willing to throw money away, my decision would not be any different. There are certain principles we have to act upon.
"I saw one article in one of the papers saying Cardiff City don't want to pay Nantes anything. Rubbish. I flew to Nantes, told them 'let's split this down the middle, each give an amount to a Sala trust fund.' They basically told me to get on my bike and go back to the matter to the Court of Arbitration for Sport.
They were submitting documents for their case this weekend and expect a summer hearing, although that could get delayed further if French prosecutors get involved.
There are four issues that are likely to prove key as far as Cardiff are concerned.
An interim report from the Air Accidents Investigation Branch has already determined that neither the aircraft or the pilot, David Ibbotson, were licensed to operate commercial journeys.
Football agent Willie McKay has publicly stated he arranged the flight through an experienced pilot and "aviation facilitator" called David Henderson, who he intended to pay, and Cardiff want to know more about this and the legality of the flight.
The third element are reports Mr Ibbotson was not allowed to fly at night in any capacity because he was colour blind. The AAIB's final report is due to be published by the end of March.
And fourthly , football-wise, Cardiff argue Sala had not signed the correct registration documents that would have officially secured him as a Bluebirds player able to play in the Premier League.
Dalman said at the Q&A: "I think we have a very strong legal case. What's best for the club is to fight for our rights.
"Firstly, don't just look at this through the findings of FIFA, which are a very narrow interpretation of football law. There is a much bigger picture to it than that.
"Secondly, there are so many things that we're not happy about and these are still under investigation. Look at the circumstances of the accident, what happened. We did not put Emiliano on the plane. We did not choose a pilot who was colour blind and not fit to fly at night.
"I'm not paying the £15m in those circumstances. There are so many things that still need to be explored, so many answers we need.
"FIFA have missed a trick here. What they should have done was got Cardiff City and Nantes into a room, locked the doors and told us we weren't leaving until we had worked it out between ourselves.
"Instead, they treated it like a hot potato. They don't want to know.
"That is why we are putting our case to the Court of Arbitration of Sport. We can't and won't just accept FIFA's decision.
"We are submitting our documents this weekend, then CAS will give us a date for the hearing, probably in the summer. But if the French authorities decide upon charges, that will obviously get suspended.
"We've informed the prosecuting office in France that there are a number of investigative issues they need to look at. It's up to the French prosecutor to decide whether to prosecute or not. It's not Cardiff City's decision, we've simply made them aware of certain things."
Cardiff also remain unhappy with the role of agent McKay in the whole affair, with Dalman claiming at the fans' Q&A forum any tie-up with Nantes needs to be investigated further.
"It's not just Nantes, there are other factors at play here. He arranged the plane," claimed Dalman at the meeting.
"They could have asked us about travel. We offered Emiliano a normal British Airways Club Class flight to the UK, as we do with every one of our players.
"They declined that and did what they did. Cardiff City did not organise the flight."
Explaining why he was speaking out at this stage, Dalman said: "We need to get our message across.
"We have not previously come out and said what we really think. I want to tell our story more openly than we have done in the past.
"There are lots of negative things people are saying about Cardiff City that we need to address. We've kept our counsel up to this point, but I just feel this is the time for us to explain our stance."
McKay organised the illegal flight, he was nantes selling agent, why should we lose 15 million for other peoples negligence?
Agree Wez.
People are saying things like ‘do the right thing’ and ‘our club is an embarrassment’ - let’s wait to see the outcome first.
Sun Feb 02, 2020 8:37 pm
paulh_85 wrote:Moving aside the point of weather we should or shouldn't pay for a moment.... How the hell do we not have the money? If this never happened we would have paid the money... So what's the difference
Sun Feb 02, 2020 8:38 pm
snoopystorm wrote:So the question now is.....
Where the hell has the £100mill parachute payment and tv income gone?? There is absolutely no way our clubs wage bill is that high
Sun Feb 02, 2020 8:41 pm
wez1927 wrote:Go away roathy ,nantes employed mckay this was a fact ,they also employed him this month too
Sun Feb 02, 2020 8:43 pm
wez1927 wrote:snoopystorm wrote:So the question now is.....
Where the hell has the £100mill parachute payment and tv income gone?? There is absolutely no way our clubs wage bill is that high
The season we went up we lost 38 million ,last season our wage bill was 60million
Sun Feb 02, 2020 8:44 pm
Ontheball Paul wrote:bluebirdoct1962 wrote:wez1927 wrote:Forever Blue wrote:Mehmet Dalman:
About paying Nantes FC for Emiliano Sala
“Firstly we don't have the money. And secondly, if we don't have to pay, why should we? There is a lot more to this than perhaps people sometimes realise, things that still need to come out.”
"As chairman, I'm the guardian of this football club and I have to do what's right for us.
"Do you know, even if we had £15m to spare, were willing to throw money away, my decision would not be any different. There are certain principles we have to act upon.
"I saw one article in one of the papers saying Cardiff City don't want to pay Nantes anything. Rubbish. I flew to Nantes, told them 'let's split this down the middle, each give an amount to a Sala trust fund.' They basically told me to get on my bike and go back to the matter to the Court of Arbitration for Sport.
They were submitting documents for their case this weekend and expect a summer hearing, although that could get delayed further if French prosecutors get involved.
There are four issues that are likely to prove key as far as Cardiff are concerned.
An interim report from the Air Accidents Investigation Branch has already determined that neither the aircraft or the pilot, David Ibbotson, were licensed to operate commercial journeys.
Football agent Willie McKay has publicly stated he arranged the flight through an experienced pilot and "aviation facilitator" called David Henderson, who he intended to pay, and Cardiff want to know more about this and the legality of the flight.
The third element are reports Mr Ibbotson was not allowed to fly at night in any capacity because he was colour blind. The AAIB's final report is due to be published by the end of March.
And fourthly , football-wise, Cardiff argue Sala had not signed the correct registration documents that would have officially secured him as a Bluebirds player able to play in the Premier League.
Dalman said at the Q&A: "I think we have a very strong legal case. What's best for the club is to fight for our rights.
"Firstly, don't just look at this through the findings of FIFA, which are a very narrow interpretation of football law. There is a much bigger picture to it than that.
"Secondly, there are so many things that we're not happy about and these are still under investigation. Look at the circumstances of the accident, what happened. We did not put Emiliano on the plane. We did not choose a pilot who was colour blind and not fit to fly at night.
"I'm not paying the £15m in those circumstances. There are so many things that still need to be explored, so many answers we need.
"FIFA have missed a trick here. What they should have done was got Cardiff City and Nantes into a room, locked the doors and told us we weren't leaving until we had worked it out between ourselves.
"Instead, they treated it like a hot potato. They don't want to know.
"That is why we are putting our case to the Court of Arbitration of Sport. We can't and won't just accept FIFA's decision.
"We are submitting our documents this weekend, then CAS will give us a date for the hearing, probably in the summer. But if the French authorities decide upon charges, that will obviously get suspended.
"We've informed the prosecuting office in France that there are a number of investigative issues they need to look at. It's up to the French prosecutor to decide whether to prosecute or not. It's not Cardiff City's decision, we've simply made them aware of certain things."
Cardiff also remain unhappy with the role of agent McKay in the whole affair, with Dalman claiming at the fans' Q&A forum any tie-up with Nantes needs to be investigated further.
"It's not just Nantes, there are other factors at play here. He arranged the plane," claimed Dalman at the meeting.
"They could have asked us about travel. We offered Emiliano a normal British Airways Club Class flight to the UK, as we do with every one of our players.
"They declined that and did what they did. Cardiff City did not organise the flight."
Explaining why he was speaking out at this stage, Dalman said: "We need to get our message across.
"We have not previously come out and said what we really think. I want to tell our story more openly than we have done in the past.
"There are lots of negative things people are saying about Cardiff City that we need to address. We've kept our counsel up to this point, but I just feel this is the time for us to explain our stance."
McKay organised the illegal flight, he was nantes selling agent, why should we lose 15 million for other peoples negligence?
Agree Wez.
People are saying things like ‘do the right thing’ and ‘our club is an embarrassment’ - let’s wait to see the outcome first.
I was one who said we should just pay up but, I don't mind admitting I was wrong.
The club are definitely doing the right thing it seems.
Sun Feb 02, 2020 8:53 pm
wez1927 wrote:OrlandoBloo wrote:wez1927 wrote:Forever Blue wrote:Mehmet Dalman:
About paying Nantes FC for Emiliano Sala
“Firstly we don't have the money. And secondly, if we don't have to pay, why should we? There is a lot more to this than perhaps people sometimes realise, things that still need to come out.”
"As chairman, I'm the guardian of this football club and I have to do what's right for us.
"Do you know, even if we had £15m to spare, were willing to throw money away, my decision would not be any different. There are certain principles we have to act upon.
"I saw one article in one of the papers saying Cardiff City don't want to pay Nantes anything. Rubbish. I flew to Nantes, told them 'let's split this down the middle, each give an amount to a Sala trust fund.' They basically told me to get on my bike and go back to the matter to the Court of Arbitration for Sport.
They were submitting documents for their case this weekend and expect a summer hearing, although that could get delayed further if French prosecutors get involved.
There are four issues that are likely to prove key as far as Cardiff are concerned.
An interim report from the Air Accidents Investigation Branch has already determined that neither the aircraft or the pilot, David Ibbotson, were licensed to operate commercial journeys.
Football agent Willie McKay has publicly stated he arranged the flight through an experienced pilot and "aviation facilitator" called David Henderson, who he intended to pay, and Cardiff want to know more about this and the legality of the flight.
The third element are reports Mr Ibbotson was not allowed to fly at night in any capacity because he was colour blind. The AAIB's final report is due to be published by the end of March.
And fourthly , football-wise, Cardiff argue Sala had not signed the correct registration documents that would have officially secured him as a Bluebirds player able to play in the Premier League.
Dalman said at the Q&A: "I think we have a very strong legal case. What's best for the club is to fight for our rights.
"Firstly, don't just look at this through the findings of FIFA, which are a very narrow interpretation of football law. There is a much bigger picture to it than that.
"Secondly, there are so many things that we're not happy about and these are still under investigation. Look at the circumstances of the accident, what happened. We did not put Emiliano on the plane. We did not choose a pilot who was colour blind and not fit to fly at night.
"I'm not paying the £15m in those circumstances. There are so many things that still need to be explored, so many answers we need.
"FIFA have missed a trick here. What they should have done was got Cardiff City and Nantes into a room, locked the doors and told us we weren't leaving until we had worked it out between ourselves.
"Instead, they treated it like a hot potato. They don't want to know.
"That is why we are putting our case to the Court of Arbitration of Sport. We can't and won't just accept FIFA's decision.
"We are submitting our documents this weekend, then CAS will give us a date for the hearing, probably in the summer. But if the French authorities decide upon charges, that will obviously get suspended.
"We've informed the prosecuting office in France that there are a number of investigative issues they need to look at. It's up to the French prosecutor to decide whether to prosecute or not. It's not Cardiff City's decision, we've simply made them aware of certain things."
Cardiff also remain unhappy with the role of agent McKay in the whole affair, with Dalman claiming at the fans' Q&A forum any tie-up with Nantes needs to be investigated further.
"It's not just Nantes, there are other factors at play here. He arranged the plane," claimed Dalman at the meeting.
"They could have asked us about travel. We offered Emiliano a normal British Airways Club Class flight to the UK, as we do with every one of our players.
"They declined that and did what they did. Cardiff City did not organise the flight."
Explaining why he was speaking out at this stage, Dalman said: "We need to get our message across.
"We have not previously come out and said what we really think. I want to tell our story more openly than we have done in the past.
"There are lots of negative things people are saying about Cardiff City that we need to address. We've kept our counsel up to this point, but I just feel this is the time for us to explain our stance."
McKay organised the illegal flight, he was nantes selling agent, why should we lose 15 million for other peoples negligence?
Because that’s life, things happen.
Sala had completed the move meaning McKay was not an employee of Nantes, he was contracted to complete the deal. The deal was complete by the time the flight was arranged.
Dalman’s comments are embarrassing. He keeps on about Premier League registration, someone needs to tell him it’s irrelevant. Has he run a football club before Cardiff out of interest?
His knowledge of the game seems to be very weak indeed, the problem is it’s costing the club a lot of money as he’s learning these things on the job.
I’m also amazed he is taking pride at the fact he asked Nantes to split the bill for the player HE bought
No wonder they told him to take a hike.
Go away roathy ,nantes employed mckay this was a fact ,they also employed him this month too
Sun Feb 02, 2020 8:54 pm
ealing_ayatollah wrote:paulh_85 wrote:Moving aside the point of weather we should or shouldn't pay for a moment.... How the hell do we not have the money? If this never happened we would have paid the money... So what's the difference
I think the thing is here Paul that if it hadn't been for the tragedy, we would have paid 15 million, but then Emiliano would essentially have become an asset belonging to the club.
If had thrived in English football he could then have been sold on for an even greater value.
If he had flopped he would still have held a decent valuation pro ably about 7 or 8m which would still be listed on the clubs accounts as an asset.
So we could afford the investment in Emiliano but cant afford to just give away 15 million without any return.
It could have been said more clearly/tactfully by Memhet though.
Sun Feb 02, 2020 9:03 pm
ealing_ayatollah wrote:paulh_85 wrote:Moving aside the point of weather we should or shouldn't pay for a moment.... How the hell do we not have the money? If this never happened we would have paid the money... So what's the difference
I think the thing is here Paul that if it hadn't been for the tragedy, we would have paid 15 million, but then Emiliano would essentially have become an asset belonging to the club.
If had thrived in English football he could then have been sold on for an even greater value.
If he had flopped he would still have held a decent valuation pro ably about 7 or 8m which would still be listed on the clubs accounts as an asset.
So we could afford the investment in Emiliano but cant afford to just give away 15 million without any return.
It could have been said more clearly/tactfully by Memhet though.
Sun Feb 02, 2020 9:06 pm
Sun Feb 02, 2020 9:06 pm
bluebirdoct1962 wrote:Good on you mate.
To be honest, I have no legal expertise whatsoever so have decided to wait and let them sorr it out.
Sun Feb 02, 2020 9:11 pm
worcester_ccfc wrote:OrlandoBloo wrote:worcester_ccfc wrote:He's answered the question in his first six words.
That's the only reason we haven't paid and we're to bend the law to get away with it.
The club know full well the correct thing to do was to pay the money.
Yet they are still doing all they can to get out of it. Shameful.
By the way I don't believe a word Dalman says. I've met him several times and he lies like other breathe.
He would have made a good politician.
Well that answers my question Ned.
He contradicts himself not only in what he says but his confused legal action. To the French he was theirs (and have some kind of warped view that they have control over player transportation) and to CAS he isn’t theirs.
Then he says he would pay if they are told they have to... then says they don’t have it.
Sadly you're spot on.
Sun Feb 02, 2020 9:42 pm
pembroke allan wrote:wez1927 wrote:snoopystorm wrote:So the question now is.....
Where the hell has the £100mill parachute payment and tv income gone?? There is absolutely no way our clubs wage bill is that high
The season we went up we lost 38 million ,last season our wage bill was 60million
Just saw article and it's a very odd statement to make unless it's out of context and something was said before "we dont have the money " not sure how true that is but strange in any case considering he was suppose to be putting across clubs side of the story to counter bad publicity by press? Hes only added to that equation odd very odd n:roll:
Sun Feb 02, 2020 9:46 pm
wez1927 wrote:paulh_85 wrote:Moving aside the point of weather we should or shouldn't pay for a moment.... How the hell do we not have the money? If this never happened we would have paid the money... So what's the difference
We would of had an asset ,the player to sell on ,this excuse the word is dead money now ,no asset just paying out
Sun Feb 02, 2020 9:50 pm
dogfound wrote:pembroke allan wrote:wez1927 wrote:snoopystorm wrote:So the question now is.....
Where the hell has the £100mill parachute payment and tv income gone?? There is absolutely no way our clubs wage bill is that high
The season we went up we lost 38 million ,last season our wage bill was 60million
Just saw article and it's a very odd statement to make unless it's out of context and something was said before "we dont have the money " not sure how true that is but strange in any case considering he was suppose to be putting across clubs side of the story to counter bad publicity by press? Hes only added to that equation odd very odd n:roll:
I read a similar article a couple of weeks back where Dalman said it could bankrupt the club..
Sun Feb 02, 2020 9:59 pm
pembroke allan wrote:dogfound wrote:pembroke allan wrote:wez1927 wrote:snoopystorm wrote:So the question now is.....
Where the hell has the £100mill parachute payment and tv income gone?? There is absolutely no way our clubs wage bill is that high
The season we went up we lost 38 million ,last season our wage bill was 60million
Just saw article and it's a very odd statement to make unless it's out of context and something was said before "we dont have the money " not sure how true that is but strange in any case considering he was suppose to be putting across clubs side of the story to counter bad publicity by press? Hes only added to that equation odd very odd n:roll:
I read a similar article a couple of weeks back where Dalman said it could bankrupt the club..
What is apparent is people at club need to have media lessons like footballers do so that they dont say things that are misconstrued... both the statements lack clarity and can be misinterpreted if people so desire! Dont believe for one minute we dont have the money
Or we'll go bankrupt but thats how both statements sounded like very poor indeed.
Sun Feb 02, 2020 10:02 pm
Sun Feb 02, 2020 10:05 pm
2blue2handle wrote:Apparently Wales on line have got this totally wrong and misquoted Dalman. According to two people on FB who were at the meeting he said they have the money for Sala however they dont believe we should be paying it.
Sun Feb 02, 2020 10:08 pm
dogfound wrote:wez1927 wrote:paulh_85 wrote:Moving aside the point of weather we should or shouldn't pay for a moment.... How the hell do we not have the money? If this never happened we would have paid the money... So what's the difference
We would of had an asset ,the player to sell on ,this excuse the word is dead money now ,no asset just paying out
would you buy something expensive for your business on credit knowing the only way your getting the money to make repayments was to sell it ?