A different perspective Covid19

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Re: A different perspective Covid19

Postby Isawgarystevensscoreagoal » Sat May 16, 2020 8:36 am

Bluebina wrote:
Ninianman wrote:Let me say that I absolutely believe everything that is said here.
I have been saying this for a long time,the figures are false,no one dies of anything anymore except covid,there was a pic of someone saying “did these patients die with or because of covid”
Then there was the one saying “skydiver forgets parachute and dies of covid “
I’m reliably informed that all the hospitality rooms and the bars at the Mill Stad were ripped out and converted at a cost of £22 million for a total of 13 patients who could have gone to the Heath.
The Country is turning in a nation of bedwetters who’ve no clue what to do next,we’ve got the Druid in charge down the bay who waits for Jimmy Krankie to do something and then replicate it.
In years to come it will all come out,the cover ups etc,cooking the books,there will be hell to play



Based on the figures shown for death with covid 19 before yesterdays figures:

66.65 Million with 32,000 deaths so far account for 0.0004% of the population 80% of those over 75 with serious health conditions.

So in a 30,000 Cardiff City home crowd, 12 would have died and 10 of them would have been over 75 and had serious health conditions.

Why doesn't the BBC never show the figures in this way?

It's clear we need to protect the elderly!


I agree. The comparison with CCFC attendance is exactly what I used to talk this through with my son. Also worth adding that your figures are an accumulation of now eleven weeks since ccfc last played at home. Any death is a tragedy and should not be downplayed but that's one death a week from a 30,000 city crowd assuming those with existing medical conditions attend. On average two people die every week in road traffic accidents just in Wales.
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Re: A different perspective Covid19

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Re: A different perspective Covid19

Postby Nuclearblue » Sat May 16, 2020 10:46 am

Information from NHS Wales. 66 COVID patients in ICU in Welsh hospitals. Does that justify a continuing lockdown ?
Deaths in the care homes are now coming out. And they are expected to care for seriously ill older people and they are not supposed to be sent to hospital if they become ill. No wonder the deaths are so high. I did mention murder in my original post but what do you call what’s been happening in our care homes ? The question I ask was these deaths in the care homes preventable ?
And there has to be no proof of Covid19 for that to be put on a death certificate.
86D7F5D0-4FB6-40B2-B4A9-A79EF58EDDD1.png
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Re: A different perspective Covid19

Postby skidemin » Sat May 16, 2020 2:43 pm

Nuclearblue wrote:Information from NHS Wales. 66 COVID patients in ICU in Welsh hospitals. Does that justify a continuing lockdown ?
Deaths in the care homes are now coming out. And they are expected to care for seriously ill older people and they are not supposed to be sent to hospital if they become ill. No wonder the deaths are so high. I did mention murder in my original post but what do you call what’s been happening in our care homes ? The question I ask was these deaths in the care homes preventable ?
And there has to be no proof of Covid19 for that to be put on a death certificate.
86D7F5D0-4FB6-40B2-B4A9-A79EF58EDDD1.png



I don't get the whole care home thing myself mate..
1 } roughly 120k people a year die in care homes ordinarily.
2 } to free up beds for the tsunami they move every old ill { bed blocker } they could into care homes
3 } hospitals are reluctant to accept care home patients who become ill..

result ? .. its not obvious because the leader of the opposition cant figure it out. :?
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Re: A different perspective Covid19

Postby Bigmarkw » Sat May 16, 2020 5:24 pm

What I don’t get with some of you is what is end game target for the government or media that you all getting hysterical about. Please share what is the conspiracy. ?
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Re: A different perspective Covid19

Postby Panzermouse » Sun May 17, 2020 3:17 pm

Nuclearblue wrote:Information from NHS Wales. 66 COVID patients in ICU in Welsh hospitals. Does that justify a continuing lockdown ?
Deaths in the care homes are now coming out. And they are expected to care for seriously ill older people and they are not supposed to be sent to hospital if they become ill. No wonder the deaths are so high. I did mention murder in my original post but what do you call what’s been happening in our care homes ? The question I ask was these deaths in the care homes preventable ?
And there has to be no proof of Covid19 for that to be put on a death certificate.
86D7F5D0-4FB6-40B2-B4A9-A79EF58EDDD1.png


The number in ICU beds is only part of the overall picture and I can't find the figure of 66 that you've stated but I'm happy for you to point the way. There were 12,194 cumulative cases in Wales as of 13.00 hours yesterday. Those figures are available at Public Health Wales. Without lockdown it would be substantially higher with a higher mortality rate too.
Seriously ill care home patients ARE being admitted to hospitals and they aren't being murdered either no matter what anyone calls it. Anyone who thinks people are being murdered should look up the definition of murder.
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Re: A different perspective Covid19

Postby Bigmarkw » Sun May 17, 2020 3:23 pm

Panzermouse wrote:
Nuclearblue wrote:Information from NHS Wales. 66 COVID patients in ICU in Welsh hospitals. Does that justify a continuing lockdown ?
Deaths in the care homes are now coming out. And they are expected to care for seriously ill older people and they are not supposed to be sent to hospital if they become ill. No wonder the deaths are so high. I did mention murder in my original post but what do you call what’s been happening in our care homes ? The question I ask was these deaths in the care homes preventable ?
And there has to be no proof of Covid19 for that to be put on a death certificate.
86D7F5D0-4FB6-40B2-B4A9-A79EF58EDDD1.png


The number in ICU beds is only part of the overall picture and I can't find the figure of 66 that you've stated but I'm happy for you to point the way. There were 12,194 cumulative cases in Wales as of 13.00 hours yesterday. Those figures are available at Public Health Wales. Without lockdown it would be substantially higher with a higher mortality rate too.
Seriously ill care home patients ARE being admitted to hospitals and they aren't being murdered either no matter what anyone calls it. Anyone who thinks people are being murdered should look up the definition of murder.


Great post.
I just don’t get what point they trying to make and don’t even know if they do just trying to stir up hysteria.
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Re: A different perspective Covid19

Postby Panzermouse » Sun May 17, 2020 4:41 pm

Bigmarkw wrote:
Panzermouse wrote:
Nuclearblue wrote:Information from NHS Wales. 66 COVID patients in ICU in Welsh hospitals. Does that justify a continuing lockdown ?
Deaths in the care homes are now coming out. And they are expected to care for seriously ill older people and they are not supposed to be sent to hospital if they become ill. No wonder the deaths are so high. I did mention murder in my original post but what do you call what’s been happening in our care homes ? The question I ask was these deaths in the care homes preventable ?
And there has to be no proof of Covid19 for that to be put on a death certificate.
86D7F5D0-4FB6-40B2-B4A9-A79EF58EDDD1.png


The number in ICU beds is only part of the overall picture and I can't find the figure of 66 that you've stated but I'm happy for you to point the way. There were 12,194 cumulative cases in Wales as of 13.00 hours yesterday. Those figures are available at Public Health Wales. Without lockdown it would be substantially higher with a higher mortality rate too.
Seriously ill care home patients ARE being admitted to hospitals and they aren't being murdered either no matter what anyone calls it. Anyone who thinks people are being murdered should look up the definition of murder.


Great post.
I just don’t get what point they trying to make and don’t even know if they do just trying to stir up hysteria.


There are more than a couple on here that are prone to spouting half truths, gossip and outright nonsense.
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Re: A different perspective Covid19

Postby Bigmarkw » Sun May 17, 2020 5:28 pm

You ask them the reason behind they think and they nowhere to be seen.
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Re: A different perspective Covid19

Postby bluesince62 » Mon May 18, 2020 12:50 am

Bigmarkw wrote:You ask them the reason behind they think and they nowhere to be seen.



Well I gave you my reasons,wether you agree with them is another matter surely? Not one person,yourself included,has been given any clue as to how many people have recovered, the figures are twisted,as how can they be correct, when there are some being recorded without any test taking place?and considering the list of symtoms continues to grow,how can they be listed as covid deaths,as it may have been any other condition that was cause of death? Plus there is a huge difference in dying of something,and dying with something !! My dad (rip) died of dementia,but also had two other underlying serious issues,any one of them could have eventually killed him,but only dementia was given as cause of death, with a triple A,and cancer being listed as "with" on death certificate! As neither of them were determined as the cause of death, even though they at some stage would have ended his life,my concern around the figures are for these very reasons.the deaths in Italy where covid 19 was listed as cause of death,was very low indeed,around 12/15 % of death certificates stated covid as direct cause of death,the rest died "with covid 19,but not of it" most deaths were of another cause,but with covid.I have said it once and I will continue to say it,just because people think and view things differently, do not deserve to be name called ,it's all about opinions isn't it? Or is It easier for you to write off people's differing opinions,and ridicule them as nuts,idiots etc (the list is huge!) I also said boris was a dick,bungling his way to the top, leaving the most vulnerable in care homes to suffer so badly is not something I will find easy to forgive, I mean ffs,we are past the peak, so let's roll out testing now :roll: 8 weeks too f@cking late imho.and I stand by my opinion, that the mainstream media have been complicit in trying to scare the shit out of the nation,and to a degree has succeeded,even on here some are saying continue lockdown /restricons until a vaccine is found,well that could be a couple of years away, and by then,if restrictions are still in place,we will lose thousands of businesses and millions of jobs,and our grandkids will still be paying for it, :old: :bluebird:
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Re: A different perspective Covid19

Postby Bigmarkw » Mon May 18, 2020 2:00 am

bluesince62 wrote:
Bigmarkw wrote:You ask them the reason behind they think and they nowhere to be seen.



Well I gave you my reasons,wether you agree with them is another matter surely? Not one person,yourself included,has been given any clue as to how many people have recovered, the figures are twisted,as how can they be correct, when there are some being recorded without any test taking place?and considering the list of symtoms continues to grow,how can they be listed as covid deaths,as it may have been any other condition that was cause of death? Plus there is a huge difference in dying of something,and dying with something !! My dad (rip) died of dementia,but also had two other underlying serious issues,any one of them could have eventually killed him,but only dementia was given as cause of death, with a triple A,and cancer being listed as "with" on death certificate! As neither of them were determined as the cause of death, even though they at some stage would have ended his life,my concern around the figures are for these very reasons.the deaths in Italy where covid 19 was listed as cause of death,was very low indeed,around 12/15 % of death certificates stated covid as direct cause of death,the rest died "with covid 19,but not of it" most deaths were of another cause,but with covid.I have said it once and I will continue to say it,just because people think and view things differently, do not deserve to be name called ,it's all about opinions isn't it? Or is It easier for you to write off people's differing opinions,and ridicule them as nuts,idiots etc (the list is huge!) I also said boris was a dick,bungling his way to the top, leaving the most vulnerable in care homes to suffer so badly is not something I will find easy to forgive, I mean ffs,we are past the peak, so let's roll out testing now :roll: 8 weeks too f@cking late imho.and I stand by my opinion, that the mainstream media have been complicit in trying to scare the shit out of the nation,and to a degree has succeeded,even on here some are saying continue lockdown /restricons until a vaccine is found,well that could be a couple of years away, and by then,if restrictions are still in place,we will lose thousands of businesses and millions of jobs,and our grandkids will still be paying for it, :old: :bluebird:


And still no answer.
what is they agenda then for all this scaremongering. You say they doing this and that but why is all I want to know. Simple answer to a simple question.

My personal belief is they not telling us everything about this disease. But what they are doing is trying to save as many lives as possible. The only reason there so much negative reporting is because that’s all people read. Look at this forum alone. It’s what is in demand. There’s no conspiracy theory here. Just people trying to what’s for the best and sometimes they get it wrong. But what is happening here is happening all over the world.

It a new virus no one truly knows the right answer.

Now over to you. please no waffle about numbers what do you think is happening.
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Re: A different perspective Covid19

Postby Bigmarkw » Mon May 18, 2020 2:12 am

bluesince62 wrote:
Bigmarkw wrote:You ask them the reason behind they think and they nowhere to be seen.



Well I gave you my reasons,wether you agree with them is another matter surely? Not one person,yourself included,has been given any clue as to how many people have recovered, the figures are twisted,as how can they be correct, when there are some being recorded without any test taking place?and considering the list of symtoms continues to grow,how can they be listed as covid deaths,as it may have been any other condition that was cause of death? Plus there is a huge difference in dying of something,and dying with something !! My dad (rip) died of dementia,but also had two other underlying serious issues,any one of them could have eventually killed him,but only dementia was given as cause of death, with a triple A,and cancer being listed as "with" on death certificate! As neither of them were determined as the cause of death, even though they at some stage would have ended his life,my concern around the figures are for these very reasons.the deaths in Italy where covid 19 was listed as cause of death,was very low indeed,around 12/15 % of death certificates stated covid as direct cause of death,the rest died "with covid 19,but not of it" most deaths were of another cause,but with covid.I have said it once and I will continue to say it,just because people think and view things differently, do not deserve to be name called ,it's all about opinions isn't it? Or is It easier for you to write off people's differing opinions,and ridicule them as nuts,idiots etc (the list is huge!) I also said boris was a dick,bungling his way to the top, leaving the most vulnerable in care homes to suffer so badly is not something I will find easy to forgive, I mean ffs,we are past the peak, so let's roll out testing now :roll: 8 weeks too f@cking late imho.and I stand by my opinion, that the mainstream media have been complicit in trying to scare the shit out of the nation,and to a degree has succeeded,even on here some are saying continue lockdown /restricons until a vaccine is found,well that could be a couple of years away, and by then,if restrictions are still in place,we will lose thousands of businesses and millions of jobs,and our grandkids will still be paying for it, :old: :bluebird:



In terms of numbers I agree with you that they are accurate. But through some evil plan but just because it’s impossible for them to be accurate. Most people don’t get tested and don’t get to Illand survive. But they not in the numbers that’s just life.

I’ve think Covid is very survival by the vast majority except old and vulnerable which they can do survive. I urged people to watch the bbc show hospital showing how many so called vulnerable people have survived Covid. It’s just not that dangerous to the whole population. But it is to some and a lot are getting it at the same time which is why we doing what we are to give them the best chance by keeping beds open for them. Just like we would if flu was a new disease.
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Re: A different perspective Covid19

Postby Bigmarkw » Mon May 18, 2020 2:16 am

Bigmarkw wrote:
Nuclearblue wrote:
Bluesince72 wrote:Have just finished watching critical on the bbc, i hope nobody else has the f*cking audacity to criticise NHS staff for filming themselves having the nerve to laugh, smile and yes even dance to try to cope with what they are going through. Any of you who have agreed with this poster and his attack on these people, facing what they are facing on a day to day basis hang your heads in shame.

The BBC ? Right ok the number one fake news channel. I give you Panorama of which has been proved to lie again and again and again. The BBC news channel which has bought fear to the nation. If you believe anything on that channel hold your head in shame


Anyone watched hospital on the bbc. Focused mainly on people who survived Covid.

This episode will piss on a lot of people’s fireworks.



As mentioned above
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Re: A different perspective Covid19

Postby bluesince62 » Tue May 19, 2020 1:19 am

Bigmarkw wrote:
bluesince62 wrote:
Bigmarkw wrote:You ask them the reason behind they think and they nowhere to be seen.



Well I gave you my reasons,wether you agree with them is another matter surely? Not one person,yourself included,has been given any clue as to how many people have recovered, the figures are twisted,as how can they be correct, when there are some being recorded without any test taking place?and considering the list of symtoms continues to grow,how can they be listed as covid deaths,as it may have been any other condition that was cause of death? Plus there is a huge difference in dying of something,and dying with something !! My dad (rip) died of dementia,but also had two other underlying serious issues,any one of them could have eventually killed him,but only dementia was given as cause of death, with a triple A,and cancer being listed as "with" on death certificate! As neither of them were determined as the cause of death, even though they at some stage would have ended his life,my concern around the figures are for these very reasons.the deaths in Italy where covid 19 was listed as cause of death,was very low indeed,around 12/15 % of death certificates stated covid as direct cause of death,the rest died "with covid 19,but not of it" most deaths were of another cause,but with covid.I have said it once and I will continue to say it,just because people think and view things differently, do not deserve to be name called ,it's all about opinions isn't it? Or is It easier for you to write off people's differing opinions,and ridicule them as nuts,idiots etc (the list is huge!) I also said boris was a dick,bungling his way to the top, leaving the most vulnerable in care homes to suffer so badly is not something I will find easy to forgive, I mean ffs,we are past the peak, so let's roll out testing now :roll: 8 weeks too f@cking late imho.and I stand by my opinion, that the mainstream media have been complicit in trying to scare the shit out of the nation,and to a degree has succeeded,even on here some are saying continue lockdown /restricons until a vaccine is found,well that could be a couple of years away, and by then,if restrictions are still in place,we will lose thousands of businesses and millions of jobs,and our grandkids will still be paying for it, :old: :bluebird:



In terms of numbers I agree with you that they are accurate. But through some evil plan but just because it’s impossible for them to be accurate. Most people don’t get tested and don’t get to Illand survive. But they not in the numbers that’s just life.

I’ve think Covid is very survival by the vast majority except old and vulnerable which they can do survive. I urged people to watch the bbc show hospital showing how many so called vulnerable people have survived Covid. It’s just not that dangerous to the whole population. But it is to some and a lot are getting it at the same time which is why we doing what we are to give them the best chance by keeping beds open for them. Just like we would if flu was a new disease.


Well we seem to agree on a couple of points, :thumbup: if you have read any of my previous posts on various threads, I usually add ? As to what ends that this isn't al, it's cracked up to be,the figures imho are being inflated,why else are deaths with no test, being recorded as covid, why are there no survival figures? How come so few death certificates in Italy list covid as actual cause of death?are they wrong?how come every so often,usually on mainstream news,they keep showing a picture from an intensive care unit,that's not even here,it's in bergamo hospital in spain,it's even been on here a few times too?? I haven't used the word "flu" in reference to covid,as that would be demeaning it,but I will say one thing flu related,and that is anywhere between 350,000 to 750,000 people die annually around the globe of it, we are on around 320,000 deaths related (not of covid) to this virus to date,yet the world hasn't ground to a halt for this annual loss of life to flu every year? To me it seems a little bit suspicious, and I'm no conspiracy theorist either,I just read and watch people's take on this, and who have a wider knowledge than myself,even the guardians headline today is along the lines of"how can the country trust this floundering? Lot to protect us with covid 19" accompanied by a photo of boris and his minions sat at the table,so I guess I'm not alone is not trusting the government. On the point of the elderly bearing the brunt,this is also what I have been saying,and cursing the government over the huge delay in getting testing done in care homes,in my eyes that is unforgivable,considering the percentage of deaths in them.I did watch that programme as you advised,but my argument on that,would be,that is ONE programme that showed positivity, the rest have been doom and bloody gloom to say the very least.my 80 year old mother had serious flu in February, we as a family feared the worst,as she has poor lung function due to contracted tb as a young girl.so believe me when I day, we have ALL been doing as asked of us by the top brass,but in my case it's because of her fragility and age ,more than for myself,I shop for her once a week,and drop it off with a quick chat through the french doors,and off I go,she has been at home for ten weeks already, but is not stupid enough to put herself in danger (she is a very independent lady,who does her own shop, goes to keep fit twice weekly,and loves social occasions where she can"dress up" I volunteered a week into lockdown to deliver meds to the people who were/are in isolation,mainly elderly and infirm patients,so I do take it as a serious virus,but won't be forced to panic,at the behest of mainstream media's sake,maybe if/when the total death toll for the virus reaches the highest flu death rate annually, then maybe I will,but not really,as a million deaths annually of any other cause worldwide is not headline news. :old: :bluebird:
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Re: A different perspective Covid19

Postby Bigmarkw » Tue May 19, 2020 2:47 am

bluesince62 wrote:
Bigmarkw wrote:
bluesince62 wrote:
Bigmarkw wrote:You ask them the reason behind they think and they nowhere to be seen.



Well I gave you my reasons,wether you agree with them is another matter surely? Not one person,yourself included,has been given any clue as to how many people have recovered, the figures are twisted,as how can they be correct, when there are some being recorded without any test taking place?and considering the list of symtoms continues to grow,how can they be listed as covid deaths,as it may have been any other condition that was cause of death? Plus there is a huge difference in dying of something,and dying with something !! My dad (rip) died of dementia,but also had two other underlying serious issues,any one of them could have eventually killed him,but only dementia was given as cause of death, with a triple A,and cancer being listed as "with" on death certificate! As neither of them were determined as the cause of death, even though they at some stage would have ended his life,my concern around the figures are for these very reasons.the deaths in Italy where covid 19 was listed as cause of death,was very low indeed,around 12/15 % of death certificates stated covid as direct cause of death,the rest died "with covid 19,but not of it" most deaths were of another cause,but with covid.I have said it once and I will continue to say it,just because people think and view things differently, do not deserve to be name called ,it's all about opinions isn't it? Or is It easier for you to write off people's differing opinions,and ridicule them as nuts,idiots etc (the list is huge!) I also said boris was a dick,bungling his way to the top, leaving the most vulnerable in care homes to suffer so badly is not something I will find easy to forgive, I mean ffs,we are past the peak, so let's roll out testing now :roll: 8 weeks too f@cking late imho.and I stand by my opinion, that the mainstream media have been complicit in trying to scare the shit out of the nation,and to a degree has succeeded,even on here some are saying continue lockdown /restricons until a vaccine is found,well that could be a couple of years away, and by then,if restrictions are still in place,we will lose thousands of businesses and millions of jobs,and our grandkids will still be paying for it, :old: :bluebird:



In terms of numbers I agree with you that they are accurate. But through some evil plan but just because it’s impossible for them to be accurate. Most people don’t get tested and don’t get to Illand survive. But they not in the numbers that’s just life.

I’ve think Covid is very survival by the vast majority except old and vulnerable which they can do survive. I urged people to watch the bbc show hospital showing how many so called vulnerable people have survived Covid. It’s just not that dangerous to the whole population. But it is to some and a lot are getting it at the same time which is why we doing what we are to give them the best chance by keeping beds open for them. Just like we would if flu was a new disease.


Well we seem to agree on a couple of points, :thumbup: if you have read any of my previous posts on various threads, I usually add ? As to what ends that this isn't al, it's cracked up to be,the figures imho are being inflated,why else are deaths with no test, being recorded as covid, why are there no survival figures? How come so few death certificates in Italy list covid as actual cause of death?are they wrong?how come every so often,usually on mainstream news,they keep showing a picture from an intensive care unit,that's not even here,it's in bergamo hospital in spain,it's even been on here a few times too?? I haven't used the word "flu" in reference to covid,as that would be demeaning it,but I will say one thing flu related,and that is anywhere between 350,000 to 750,000 people die annually around the globe of it, we are on around 320,000 deaths related (not of covid) to this virus to date,yet the world hasn't ground to a halt for this annual loss of life to flu every year? To me it seems a little bit suspicious, and I'm no conspiracy theorist either,I just read and watch people's take on this, and who have a wider knowledge than myself,even the guardians headline today is along the lines of"how can the country trust this floundering? Lot to protect us with covid 19" accompanied by a photo of boris and his minions sat at the table,so I guess I'm not alone is not trusting the government. On the point of the elderly bearing the brunt,this is also what I have been saying,and cursing the government over the huge delay in getting testing done in care homes,in my eyes that is unforgivable,considering the percentage of deaths in them.I did watch that programme as you advised,but my argument on that,would be,that is ONE programme that showed positivity, the rest have been doom and bloody gloom to say the very least.my 80 year old mother had serious flu in February, we as a family feared the worst,as she has poor lung function due to contracted tb as a young girl.so believe me when I day, we have ALL been doing as asked of us by the top brass,but in my case it's because of her fragility and age ,more than for myself,I shop for her once a week,and drop it off with a quick chat through the french doors,and off I go,she has been at home for ten weeks already, but is not stupid enough to put herself in danger (she is a very independent lady,who does her own shop, goes to keep fit twice weekly,and loves social occasions where she can"dress up" I volunteered a week into lockdown to deliver meds to the people who were/are in isolation,mainly elderly and infirm patients,so I do take it as a serious virus,but won't be forced to panic,at the behest of mainstream media's sake,maybe if/when the total death toll for the virus reaches the highest flu death rate annually, then maybe I will,but not really,as a million deaths annually of any other cause worldwide is not headline news. :old: :bluebird:


I get all that and understand. But what you fail to answer what do you think they up to that’s got you so wound up? Why did they choose Covid and not a bigger killer like flu? Every thing gets reported mate from a negative point of view. X people die a year of heart disease they never say how many survive and you not bothered by this. Same goes for cancer x die a year but don’t say how many people survived. Drug abuse, alcohol abuse, car accidents, jogging etc etc. The fact is they always report the negative because they more measurable god knows how many people take drugs a year and survive. We don’t know the amount of people that have survived Covid so it be just as inaccurate as you claim the death rate to be.

Please I ask one last time what do think they plan is for why they doing what you say they doing.
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Re: A different perspective Covid19

Postby bluesince62 » Wed May 20, 2020 12:29 am

Bigmarkw wrote:
bluesince62 wrote:
Bigmarkw wrote:
bluesince62 wrote:
Bigmarkw wrote:You ask them the reason behind they think and they nowhere to be seen.



Well I gave you my reasons,wether you agree with them is another matter surely? Not one person,yourself included,has been given any clue as to how many people have recovered, the figures are twisted,as how can they be correct, when there are some being recorded without any test taking place?and considering the list of symtoms continues to grow,how can they be listed as covid deaths,as it may have been any other condition that was cause of death? Plus there is a huge difference in dying of something,and dying with something !! My dad (rip) died of dementia,but also had two other underlying serious issues,any one of them could have eventually killed him,but only dementia was given as cause of death, with a triple A,and cancer being listed as "with" on death certificate! As neither of them were determined as the cause of death, even though they at some stage would have ended his life,my concern around the figures are for these very reasons.the deaths in Italy where covid 19 was listed as cause of death,was very low indeed,around 12/15 % of death certificates stated covid as direct cause of death,the rest died "with covid 19,but not of it" most deaths were of another cause,but with covid.I have said it once and I will continue to say it,just because people think and view things differently, do not deserve to be name called ,it's all about opinions isn't it? Or is It easier for you to write off people's differing opinions,and ridicule them as nuts,idiots etc (the list is huge!) I also said boris was a dick,bungling his way to the top, leaving the most vulnerable in care homes to suffer so badly is not something I will find easy to forgive, I mean ffs,we are past the peak, so let's roll out testing now :roll: 8 weeks too f@cking late imho.and I stand by my opinion, that the mainstream media have been complicit in trying to scare the shit out of the nation,and to a degree has succeeded,even on here some are saying continue lockdown /restricons until a vaccine is found,well that could be a couple of years away, and by then,if restrictions are still in place,we will lose thousands of businesses and millions of jobs,and our grandkids will still be paying for it, :old: :bluebird:



In terms of numbers I agree with you that they are accurate. But through some evil plan but just because it’s impossible for them to be accurate. Most people don’t get tested and don’t get to Illand survive. But they not in the numbers that’s just life.

I’ve think Covid is very survival by the vast majority except old and vulnerable which they can do survive. I urged people to watch the bbc show hospital showing how many so called vulnerable people have survived Covid. It’s just not that dangerous to the whole population. But it is to some and a lot are getting it at the same time which is why we doing what we are to give them the best chance by keeping beds open for them. Just like we would if flu was a new disease.


Well we seem to agree on a couple of points, :thumbup: if you have read any of my previous posts on various threads, I usually add ? As to what ends that this isn't al, it's cracked up to be,the figures imho are being inflated,why else are deaths with no test, being recorded as covid, why are there no survival figures? How come so few death certificates in Italy list covid as actual cause of death?are they wrong?how come every so often,usually on mainstream news,they keep showing a picture from an intensive care unit,that's not even here,it's in bergamo hospital in spain,it's even been on here a few times too?? I haven't used the word "flu" in reference to covid,as that would be demeaning it,but I will say one thing flu related,and that is anywhere between 350,000 to 750,000 people die annually around the globe of it, we are on around 320,000 deaths related (not of covid) to this virus to date,yet the world hasn't ground to a halt for this annual loss of life to flu every year? To me it seems a little bit suspicious, and I'm no conspiracy theorist either,I just read and watch people's take on this, and who have a wider knowledge than myself,even the guardians headline today is along the lines of"how can the country trust this floundering? Lot to protect us with covid 19" accompanied by a photo of boris and his minions sat at the table,so I guess I'm not alone is not trusting the government. On the point of the elderly bearing the brunt,this is also what I have been saying,and cursing the government over the huge delay in getting testing done in care homes,in my eyes that is unforgivable,considering the percentage of deaths in them.I did watch that programme as you advised,but my argument on that,would be,that is ONE programme that showed positivity, the rest have been doom and bloody gloom to say the very least.my 80 year old mother had serious flu in February, we as a family feared the worst,as she has poor lung function due to contracted tb as a young girl.so believe me when I day, we have ALL been doing as asked of us by the top brass,but in my case it's because of her fragility and age ,more than for myself,I shop for her once a week,and drop it off with a quick chat through the french doors,and off I go,she has been at home for ten weeks already, but is not stupid enough to put herself in danger (she is a very independent lady,who does her own shop, goes to keep fit twice weekly,and loves social occasions where she can"dress up" I volunteered a week into lockdown to deliver meds to the people who were/are in isolation,mainly elderly and infirm patients,so I do take it as a serious virus,but won't be forced to panic,at the behest of mainstream media's sake,maybe if/when the total death toll for the virus reaches the highest flu death rate annually, then maybe I will,but not really,as a million deaths annually of any other cause worldwide is not headline news. :old: :bluebird:


I get all that and understand. But what you fail to answer what do you think they up to that’s got you so wound up? Why did they choose Covid and not a bigger killer like flu? Every thing gets reported mate from a negative point of view. X people die a year of heart disease they never say how many survive and you not bothered by this. Same goes for cancer x die a year but don’t say how many people survived. Drug abuse, alcohol abuse, car accidents, jogging etc etc. The fact is they always report the negative because they more measurable god knows how many people take drugs a year and survive. We don’t know the amount of people that have survived Covid so it be just as inaccurate as you claim the death rate to be.

Please I ask one last time what do think they plan is for why they doing what you say they doing.



And again,I will point to the ? After my statement, in other words,I'm not 100%sure,but not everything sits well with me,I will not be drawn into giving an answer as to what the end game might be,as I have noticed that anyone who chooses to perhaps see things differently to others,is called a crackpot conspiracy theorist etc.how come turkey,a country of 84 million has a relatively low death rate,around 4,200 at present, compared to countries with considerably smaller populations? And I guess if they used flu instead of covid as you put it,it imo wouldn't have created the fear and hysteria currently being shown by the majority of the population.so in answer to your last sentence, I'm not sure at present,perhaps in time,and with a little research,I will come back to you with a more complete answer,and then you wil get your wish.lastly,cancer survival rates are available to view online,they do get reported, but as it's not a "new" killer it's never really noticed.why do you believe I am "wound up"? I'm very calm thank you,nor in the least wound up,just voicing my views on a forum,I would of thought the figures for survival,would only be reliable,if a person had tested positive? We are doing a lot more testing,so surely the numbers could be worked out on that basis for survival,as they know the number of infected people, if they kept tabs on wether that person had lived or had died,we could get an idea of number of survivers? :old: :bluebird:
bluesince62
 
Posts: 2931
Joined: Sat Jun 29, 2013 12:02 pm

Re: A different perspective Covid19

Postby skidemin » Wed May 20, 2020 1:30 am

Bigmarkw wrote:
Nuclearblue wrote:
Bluesince72 wrote:Have just finished watching critical on the bbc, i hope nobody else has the f*cking audacity to criticise NHS staff for filming themselves having the nerve to laugh, smile and yes even dance to try to cope with what they are going through. Any of you who have agreed with this poster and his attack on these people, facing what they are facing on a day to day basis hang your heads in shame.

The BBC ? Right ok the number one fake news channel. I give you Panorama of which has been proved to lie again and again and again. The BBC news channel which has bought fear to the nation. If you believe anything on that channel hold your head in shame


Anyone watched hospital on the bbc. Focused mainly on people who survived Covid.

This episode will piss on a lot of people’s fireworks.



you do realise you could make a programme about people who have survived any number of serious illnesses and come up with a similar show ?
skidemin
 
Posts: 345
Joined: Sat Jan 04, 2020 8:45 pm

Re: A different perspective Covid19

Postby skidemin » Wed May 20, 2020 2:10 am

Bigmarkw wrote:
bluesince62 wrote:
Bigmarkw wrote:
bluesince62 wrote:
Bigmarkw wrote:You ask them the reason behind they think and they nowhere to be seen.



Well I gave you my reasons,wether you agree with them is another matter surely? Not one person,yourself included,has been given any clue as to how many people have recovered, the figures are twisted,as how can they be correct, when there are some being recorded without any test taking place?and considering the list of symtoms continues to grow,how can they be listed as covid deaths,as it may have been any other condition that was cause of death? Plus there is a huge difference in dying of something,and dying with something !! My dad (rip) died of dementia,but also had two other underlying serious issues,any one of them could have eventually killed him,but only dementia was given as cause of death, with a triple A,and cancer being listed as "with" on death certificate! As neither of them were determined as the cause of death, even though they at some stage would have ended his life,my concern around the figures are for these very reasons.the deaths in Italy where covid 19 was listed as cause of death,was very low indeed,around 12/15 % of death certificates stated covid as direct cause of death,the rest died "with covid 19,but not of it" most deaths were of another cause,but with covid.I have said it once and I will continue to say it,just because people think and view things differently, do not deserve to be name called ,it's all about opinions isn't it? Or is It easier for you to write off people's differing opinions,and ridicule them as nuts,idiots etc (the list is huge!) I also said boris was a dick,bungling his way to the top, leaving the most vulnerable in care homes to suffer so badly is not something I will find easy to forgive, I mean ffs,we are past the peak, so let's roll out testing now :roll: 8 weeks too f@cking late imho.and I stand by my opinion, that the mainstream media have been complicit in trying to scare the shit out of the nation,and to a degree has succeeded,even on here some are saying continue lockdown /restricons until a vaccine is found,well that could be a couple of years away, and by then,if restrictions are still in place,we will lose thousands of businesses and millions of jobs,and our grandkids will still be paying for it, :old: :bluebird:



In terms of numbers I agree with you that they are accurate. But through some evil plan but just because it’s impossible for them to be accurate. Most people don’t get tested and don’t get to Illand survive. But they not in the numbers that’s just life.

I’ve think Covid is very survival by the vast majority except old and vulnerable which they can do survive. I urged people to watch the bbc show hospital showing how many so called vulnerable people have survived Covid. It’s just not that dangerous to the whole population. But it is to some and a lot are getting it at the same time which is why we doing what we are to give them the best chance by keeping beds open for them. Just like we would if flu was a new disease.


Well we seem to agree on a couple of points, :thumbup: if you have read any of my previous posts on various threads, I usually add ? As to what ends that this isn't al, it's cracked up to be,the figures imho are being inflated,why else are deaths with no test, being recorded as covid, why are there no survival figures? How come so few death certificates in Italy list covid as actual cause of death?are they wrong?how come every so often,usually on mainstream news,they keep showing a picture from an intensive care unit,that's not even here,it's in bergamo hospital in spain,it's even been on here a few times too?? I haven't used the word "flu" in reference to covid,as that would be demeaning it,but I will say one thing flu related,and that is anywhere between 350,000 to 750,000 people die annually around the globe of it, we are on around 320,000 deaths related (not of covid) to this virus to date,yet the world hasn't ground to a halt for this annual loss of life to flu every year? To me it seems a little bit suspicious, and I'm no conspiracy theorist either,I just read and watch people's take on this, and who have a wider knowledge than myself,even the guardians headline today is along the lines of"how can the country trust this floundering? Lot to protect us with covid 19" accompanied by a photo of boris and his minions sat at the table,so I guess I'm not alone is not trusting the government. On the point of the elderly bearing the brunt,this is also what I have been saying,and cursing the government over the huge delay in getting testing done in care homes,in my eyes that is unforgivable,considering the percentage of deaths in them.I did watch that programme as you advised,but my argument on that,would be,that is ONE programme that showed positivity, the rest have been doom and bloody gloom to say the very least.my 80 year old mother had serious flu in February, we as a family feared the worst,as she has poor lung function due to contracted tb as a young girl.so believe me when I day, we have ALL been doing as asked of us by the top brass,but in my case it's because of her fragility and age ,more than for myself,I shop for her once a week,and drop it off with a quick chat through the french doors,and off I go,she has been at home for ten weeks already, but is not stupid enough to put herself in danger (she is a very independent lady,who does her own shop, goes to keep fit twice weekly,and loves social occasions where she can"dress up" I volunteered a week into lockdown to deliver meds to the people who were/are in isolation,mainly elderly and infirm patients,so I do take it as a serious virus,but won't be forced to panic,at the behest of mainstream media's sake,maybe if/when the total death toll for the virus reaches the highest flu death rate annually, then maybe I will,but not really,as a million deaths annually of any other cause worldwide is not headline news. :old: :bluebird:


I get all that and understand. But what you fail to answer what do you think they up to that’s got you so wound up? Why did they choose Covid and not a bigger killer like flu? Every thing gets reported mate from a negative point of view. X people die a year of heart disease they never say how many survive and you not bothered by this. Same goes for cancer x die a year but don’t say how many people survived. Drug abuse, alcohol abuse, car accidents, jogging etc etc. The fact is they always report the negative because they more measurable god knows how many people take drugs a year and survive. We don’t know the amount of people that have survived Covid so it be just as inaccurate as you claim the death rate to be.

Please I ask one last time what do think they plan is for why they doing what you say they doing.



ive got no conspiracy theory as such... but does this make sense to you...because it doesn't for me. your correct about the negatives but you know what is different..., the news will say x amount { its about a 170,000 a year } died of heart or circulatory disease last year, it will be repeated throughout the day be in papers and tomorrow they move on to harry and Megan or which footballer is bonking a team mates bird no league tables , no daily briefings and we just carry on as normal..
skidemin
 
Posts: 345
Joined: Sat Jan 04, 2020 8:45 pm

Re: A different perspective Covid19

Postby Bigmarkw » Wed May 20, 2020 10:21 am

skidemin wrote:
Bigmarkw wrote:
Nuclearblue wrote:
Bluesince72 wrote:Have just finished watching critical on the bbc, i hope nobody else has the f*cking audacity to criticise NHS staff for filming themselves having the nerve to laugh, smile and yes even dance to try to cope with what they are going through. Any of you who have agreed with this poster and his attack on these people, facing what they are facing on a day to day basis hang your heads in shame.

The BBC ? Right ok the number one fake news channel. I give you Panorama of which has been proved to lie again and again and again. The BBC news channel which has bought fear to the nation. If you believe anything on that channel hold your head in shame


Anyone watched hospital on the bbc. Focused mainly on people who survived Covid.

This episode will piss on a lot of people’s fireworks.



you do realise you could make a programme about people who have survived any number of serious illnesses and come up with a similar show ?


Yes I do. But the point I was making people think the bbc are up to something (but nobody knows what or why) by over stating the danger or Covid but this isn’t always the case.
Bigmarkw
 
Posts: 177
Joined: Tue Apr 14, 2020 4:43 pm

Re: A different perspective Covid19

Postby Bigmarkw » Wed May 20, 2020 10:31 am

skidemin wrote:
Bigmarkw wrote:
bluesince62 wrote:
Bigmarkw wrote:
bluesince62 wrote:
Bigmarkw wrote:You ask them the reason behind they think and they nowhere to be seen.



Well I gave you my reasons,wether you agree with them is another matter surely? Not one person,yourself included,has been given any clue as to how many people have recovered, the figures are twisted,as how can they be correct, when there are some being recorded without any test taking place?and considering the list of symtoms continues to grow,how can they be listed as covid deaths,as it may have been any other condition that was cause of death? Plus there is a huge difference in dying of something,and dying with something !! My dad (rip) died of dementia,but also had two other underlying serious issues,any one of them could have eventually killed him,but only dementia was given as cause of death, with a triple A,and cancer being listed as "with" on death certificate! As neither of them were determined as the cause of death, even though they at some stage would have ended his life,my concern around the figures are for these very reasons.the deaths in Italy where covid 19 was listed as cause of death,was very low indeed,around 12/15 % of death certificates stated covid as direct cause of death,the rest died "with covid 19,but not of it" most deaths were of another cause,but with covid.I have said it once and I will continue to say it,just because people think and view things differently, do not deserve to be name called ,it's all about opinions isn't it? Or is It easier for you to write off people's differing opinions,and ridicule them as nuts,idiots etc (the list is huge!) I also said boris was a dick,bungling his way to the top, leaving the most vulnerable in care homes to suffer so badly is not something I will find easy to forgive, I mean ffs,we are past the peak, so let's roll out testing now :roll: 8 weeks too f@cking late imho.and I stand by my opinion, that the mainstream media have been complicit in trying to scare the shit out of the nation,and to a degree has succeeded,even on here some are saying continue lockdown /restricons until a vaccine is found,well that could be a couple of years away, and by then,if restrictions are still in place,we will lose thousands of businesses and millions of jobs,and our grandkids will still be paying for it, :old: :bluebird:



In terms of numbers I agree with you that they are accurate. But through some evil plan but just because it’s impossible for them to be accurate. Most people don’t get tested and don’t get to Illand survive. But they not in the numbers that’s just life.

I’ve think Covid is very survival by the vast majority except old and vulnerable which they can do survive. I urged people to watch the bbc show hospital showing how many so called vulnerable people have survived Covid. It’s just not that dangerous to the whole population. But it is to some and a lot are getting it at the same time which is why we doing what we are to give them the best chance by keeping beds open for them. Just like we would if flu was a new disease.


Well we seem to agree on a couple of points, :thumbup: if you have read any of my previous posts on various threads, I usually add ? As to what ends that this isn't al, it's cracked up to be,the figures imho are being inflated,why else are deaths with no test, being recorded as covid, why are there no survival figures? How come so few death certificates in Italy list covid as actual cause of death?are they wrong?how come every so often,usually on mainstream news,they keep showing a picture from an intensive care unit,that's not even here,it's in bergamo hospital in spain,it's even been on here a few times too?? I haven't used the word "flu" in reference to covid,as that would be demeaning it,but I will say one thing flu related,and that is anywhere between 350,000 to 750,000 people die annually around the globe of it, we are on around 320,000 deaths related (not of covid) to this virus to date,yet the world hasn't ground to a halt for this annual loss of life to flu every year? To me it seems a little bit suspicious, and I'm no conspiracy theorist either,I just read and watch people's take on this, and who have a wider knowledge than myself,even the guardians headline today is along the lines of"how can the country trust this floundering? Lot to protect us with covid 19" accompanied by a photo of boris and his minions sat at the table,so I guess I'm not alone is not trusting the government. On the point of the elderly bearing the brunt,this is also what I have been saying,and cursing the government over the huge delay in getting testing done in care homes,in my eyes that is unforgivable,considering the percentage of deaths in them.I did watch that programme as you advised,but my argument on that,would be,that is ONE programme that showed positivity, the rest have been doom and bloody gloom to say the very least.my 80 year old mother had serious flu in February, we as a family feared the worst,as she has poor lung function due to contracted tb as a young girl.so believe me when I day, we have ALL been doing as asked of us by the top brass,but in my case it's because of her fragility and age ,more than for myself,I shop for her once a week,and drop it off with a quick chat through the french doors,and off I go,she has been at home for ten weeks already, but is not stupid enough to put herself in danger (she is a very independent lady,who does her own shop, goes to keep fit twice weekly,and loves social occasions where she can"dress up" I volunteered a week into lockdown to deliver meds to the people who were/are in isolation,mainly elderly and infirm patients,so I do take it as a serious virus,but won't be forced to panic,at the behest of mainstream media's sake,maybe if/when the total death toll for the virus reaches the highest flu death rate annually, then maybe I will,but not really,as a million deaths annually of any other cause worldwide is not headline news. :old: :bluebird:


I get all that and understand. But what you fail to answer what do you think they up to that’s got you so wound up? Why did they choose Covid and not a bigger killer like flu? Every thing gets reported mate from a negative point of view. X people die a year of heart disease they never say how many survive and you not bothered by this. Same goes for cancer x die a year but don’t say how many people survived. Drug abuse, alcohol abuse, car accidents, jogging etc etc. The fact is they always report the negative because they more measurable god knows how many people take drugs a year and survive. We don’t know the amount of people that have survived Covid so it be just as inaccurate as you claim the death rate to be.

Please I ask one last time what do think they plan is for why they doing what you say they doing.



ive got no conspiracy theory as such... but does this make sense to you...because it doesn't for me. your correct about the negatives but you know what is different..., the news will say x amount { its about a 170,000 a year } died of heart or circulatory disease last year, it will be repeated throughout the day be in papers and tomorrow they move on to harry and Megan or which footballer is bonking a team mates bird no league tables , no daily briefings and we just carry on as normal..


Good point. But it’s there at the moment because it’s new and has potential to overwhelm the nhs. But it seems we prepared well and kept things as low as we could for now. Had we not taken the measure we did people would be saying they trying to kill us off. There always conspiracy theories when people have trouble processing simple things that cause so much distress/danger.

Deaths by other illnesses you right aren’t on the news every hour but they still used very regularly in all sorts of problems and the never say x survived a heart attack last year. When there a natural disaster they or a Terrorist
Attack they always counting the death toll over the days and not saying how many survived.

Unfortunately it’s the way it’s is. It’s what the public demands. Awful I know. But reality.
Bigmarkw
 
Posts: 177
Joined: Tue Apr 14, 2020 4:43 pm

Re: A different perspective Covid19

Postby Bigmarkw » Wed May 20, 2020 10:35 am

bluesince62 wrote:
Bigmarkw wrote:
bluesince62 wrote:
Bigmarkw wrote:
bluesince62 wrote:
Bigmarkw wrote:You ask them the reason behind they think and they nowhere to be seen.



Well I gave you my reasons,wether you agree with them is another matter surely? Not one person,yourself included,has been given any clue as to how many people have recovered, the figures are twisted,as how can they be correct, when there are some being recorded without any test taking place?and considering the list of symtoms continues to grow,how can they be listed as covid deaths,as it may have been any other condition that was cause of death? Plus there is a huge difference in dying of something,and dying with something !! My dad (rip) died of dementia,but also had two other underlying serious issues,any one of them could have eventually killed him,but only dementia was given as cause of death, with a triple A,and cancer being listed as "with" on death certificate! As neither of them were determined as the cause of death, even though they at some stage would have ended his life,my concern around the figures are for these very reasons.the deaths in Italy where covid 19 was listed as cause of death,was very low indeed,around 12/15 % of death certificates stated covid as direct cause of death,the rest died "with covid 19,but not of it" most deaths were of another cause,but with covid.I have said it once and I will continue to say it,just because people think and view things differently, do not deserve to be name called ,it's all about opinions isn't it? Or is It easier for you to write off people's differing opinions,and ridicule them as nuts,idiots etc (the list is huge!) I also said boris was a dick,bungling his way to the top, leaving the most vulnerable in care homes to suffer so badly is not something I will find easy to forgive, I mean ffs,we are past the peak, so let's roll out testing now :roll: 8 weeks too f@cking late imho.and I stand by my opinion, that the mainstream media have been complicit in trying to scare the shit out of the nation,and to a degree has succeeded,even on here some are saying continue lockdown /restricons until a vaccine is found,well that could be a couple of years away, and by then,if restrictions are still in place,we will lose thousands of businesses and millions of jobs,and our grandkids will still be paying for it, :old: :bluebird:



In terms of numbers I agree with you that they are accurate. But through some evil plan but just because it’s impossible for them to be accurate. Most people don’t get tested and don’t get to Illand survive. But they not in the numbers that’s just life.

I’ve think Covid is very survival by the vast majority except old and vulnerable which they can do survive. I urged people to watch the bbc show hospital showing how many so called vulnerable people have survived Covid. It’s just not that dangerous to the whole population. But it is to some and a lot are getting it at the same time which is why we doing what we are to give them the best chance by keeping beds open for them. Just like we would if flu was a new disease.


Well we seem to agree on a couple of points, :thumbup: if you have read any of my previous posts on various threads, I usually add ? As to what ends that this isn't al, it's cracked up to be,the figures imho are being inflated,why else are deaths with no test, being recorded as covid, why are there no survival figures? How come so few death certificates in Italy list covid as actual cause of death?are they wrong?how come every so often,usually on mainstream news,they keep showing a picture from an intensive care unit,that's not even here,it's in bergamo hospital in spain,it's even been on here a few times too?? I haven't used the word "flu" in reference to covid,as that would be demeaning it,but I will say one thing flu related,and that is anywhere between 350,000 to 750,000 people die annually around the globe of it, we are on around 320,000 deaths related (not of covid) to this virus to date,yet the world hasn't ground to a halt for this annual loss of life to flu every year? To me it seems a little bit suspicious, and I'm no conspiracy theorist either,I just read and watch people's take on this, and who have a wider knowledge than myself,even the guardians headline today is along the lines of"how can the country trust this floundering? Lot to protect us with covid 19" accompanied by a photo of boris and his minions sat at the table,so I guess I'm not alone is not trusting the government. On the point of the elderly bearing the brunt,this is also what I have been saying,and cursing the government over the huge delay in getting testing done in care homes,in my eyes that is unforgivable,considering the percentage of deaths in them.I did watch that programme as you advised,but my argument on that,would be,that is ONE programme that showed positivity, the rest have been doom and bloody gloom to say the very least.my 80 year old mother had serious flu in February, we as a family feared the worst,as she has poor lung function due to contracted tb as a young girl.so believe me when I day, we have ALL been doing as asked of us by the top brass,but in my case it's because of her fragility and age ,more than for myself,I shop for her once a week,and drop it off with a quick chat through the french doors,and off I go,she has been at home for ten weeks already, but is not stupid enough to put herself in danger (she is a very independent lady,who does her own shop, goes to keep fit twice weekly,and loves social occasions where she can"dress up" I volunteered a week into lockdown to deliver meds to the people who were/are in isolation,mainly elderly and infirm patients,so I do take it as a serious virus,but won't be forced to panic,at the behest of mainstream media's sake,maybe if/when the total death toll for the virus reaches the highest flu death rate annually, then maybe I will,but not really,as a million deaths annually of any other cause worldwide is not headline news. :old: :bluebird:


I get all that and understand. But what you fail to answer what do you think they up to that’s got you so wound up? Why did they choose Covid and not a bigger killer like flu? Every thing gets reported mate from a negative point of view. X people die a year of heart disease they never say how many survive and you not bothered by this. Same goes for cancer x die a year but don’t say how many people survived. Drug abuse, alcohol abuse, car accidents, jogging etc etc. The fact is they always report the negative because they more measurable god knows how many people take drugs a year and survive. We don’t know the amount of people that have survived Covid so it be just as inaccurate as you claim the death rate to be.

Please I ask one last time what do think they plan is for why they doing what you say they doing.



And again,I will point to the ? After my statement, in other words,I'm not 100%sure,but not everything sits well with me,I will not be drawn into giving an answer as to what the end game might be,as I have noticed that anyone who chooses to perhaps see things differently to others,is called a crackpot conspiracy theorist etc.how come turkey,a country of 84 million has a relatively low death rate,around 4,200 at present, compared to countries with considerably smaller populations? And I guess if they used flu instead of covid as you put it,it imo wouldn't have created the fear and hysteria currently being shown by the majority of the population.so in answer to your last sentence, I'm not sure at present,perhaps in time,and with a little research,I will come back to you with a more complete answer,and then you wil get your wish.lastly,cancer survival rates are available to view online,they do get reported, but as it's not a "new" killer it's never really noticed.why do you believe I am "wound up"? I'm very calm thank you,nor in the least wound up,just voicing my views on a forum,I would of thought the figures for survival,would only be reliable,if a person had tested positive? We are doing a lot more testing,so surely the numbers could be worked out on that basis for survival,as they know the number of infected people, if they kept tabs on wether that person had lived or had died,we could get an idea of number of survivers? :old: :bluebird:


Ok thank for responding. Was just expecting you to say a way of introducing new laws or sneaking in some brexit related deal.

But having no idea of why you don’t trust them but you don’t is all it was. Feel a foolish now that I hounded you for it I was genuinely interested in you viewpoint, but you don’t have one.
Bigmarkw
 
Posts: 177
Joined: Tue Apr 14, 2020 4:43 pm

Re: A different perspective Covid19

Postby bluesince62 » Wed May 20, 2020 7:41 pm

Bigmarkw wrote:
bluesince62 wrote:
Bigmarkw wrote:
bluesince62 wrote:
Bigmarkw wrote:
bluesince62 wrote:
Bigmarkw wrote:You ask them the reason behind they think and they nowhere to be seen.



Well I gave you my reasons,wether you agree with them is another matter surely? Not one person,yourself included,has been given any clue as to how many people have recovered, the figures are twisted,as how can they be correct, when there are some being recorded without any test taking place?and considering the list of symtoms continues to grow,how can they be listed as covid deaths,as it may have been any other condition that was cause of death? Plus there is a huge difference in dying of something,and dying with something !! My dad (rip) died of dementia,but also had two other underlying serious issues,any one of them could have eventually killed him,but only dementia was given as cause of death, with a triple A,and cancer being listed as "with" on death certificate! As neither of them were determined as the cause of death, even though they at some stage would have ended his life,my concern around the figures are for these very reasons.the deaths in Italy where covid 19 was listed as cause of death,was very low indeed,around 12/15 % of death certificates stated covid as direct cause of death,the rest died "with covid 19,but not of it" most deaths were of another cause,but with covid.I have said it once and I will continue to say it,just because people think and view things differently, do not deserve to be name called ,it's all about opinions isn't it? Or is It easier for you to write off people's differing opinions,and ridicule them as nuts,idiots etc (the list is huge!) I also said boris was a dick,bungling his way to the top, leaving the most vulnerable in care homes to suffer so badly is not something I will find easy to forgive, I mean ffs,we are past the peak, so let's roll out testing now :roll: 8 weeks too f@cking late imho.and I stand by my opinion, that the mainstream media have been complicit in trying to scare the shit out of the nation,and to a degree has succeeded,even on here some are saying continue lockdown /restricons until a vaccine is found,well that could be a couple of years away, and by then,if restrictions are still in place,we will lose thousands of businesses and millions of jobs,and our grandkids will still be paying for it, :old: :bluebird:



In terms of numbers I agree with you that they are accurate. But through some evil plan but just because it’s impossible for them to be accurate. Most people don’t get tested and don’t get to Illand survive. But they not in the numbers that’s just life.

I’ve think Covid is very survival by the vast majority except old and vulnerable which they can do survive. I urged people to watch the bbc show hospital showing how many so called vulnerable people have survived Covid. It’s just not that dangerous to the whole population. But it is to some and a lot are getting it at the same time which is why we doing what we are to give them the best chance by keeping beds open for them. Just like we would if flu was a new disease.


Well we seem to agree on a couple of points, :thumbup: if you have read any of my previous posts on various threads, I usually add ? As to what ends that this isn't al, it's cracked up to be,the figures imho are being inflated,why else are deaths with no test, being recorded as covid, why are there no survival figures? How come so few death certificates in Italy list covid as actual cause of death?are they wrong?how come every so often,usually on mainstream news,they keep showing a picture from an intensive care unit,that's not even here,it's in bergamo hospital in spain,it's even been on here a few times too?? I haven't used the word "flu" in reference to covid,as that would be demeaning it,but I will say one thing flu related,and that is anywhere between 350,000 to 750,000 people die annually around the globe of it, we are on around 320,000 deaths related (not of covid) to this virus to date,yet the world hasn't ground to a halt for this annual loss of life to flu every year? To me it seems a little bit suspicious, and I'm no conspiracy theorist either,I just read and watch people's take on this, and who have a wider knowledge than myself,even the guardians headline today is along the lines of"how can the country trust this floundering? Lot to protect us with covid 19" accompanied by a photo of boris and his minions sat at the table,so I guess I'm not alone is not trusting the government. On the point of the elderly bearing the brunt,this is also what I have been saying,and cursing the government over the huge delay in getting testing done in care homes,in my eyes that is unforgivable,considering the percentage of deaths in them.I did watch that programme as you advised,but my argument on that,would be,that is ONE programme that showed positivity, the rest have been doom and bloody gloom to say the very least.my 80 year old mother had serious flu in February, we as a family feared the worst,as she has poor lung function due to contracted tb as a young girl.so believe me when I day, we have ALL been doing as asked of us by the top brass,but in my case it's because of her fragility and age ,more than for myself,I shop for her once a week,and drop it off with a quick chat through the french doors,and off I go,she has been at home for ten weeks already, but is not stupid enough to put herself in danger (she is a very independent lady,who does her own shop, goes to keep fit twice weekly,and loves social occasions where she can"dress up" I volunteered a week into lockdown to deliver meds to the people who were/are in isolation,mainly elderly and infirm patients,so I do take it as a serious virus,but won't be forced to panic,at the behest of mainstream media's sake,maybe if/when the total death toll for the virus reaches the highest flu death rate annually, then maybe I will,but not really,as a million deaths annually of any other cause worldwide is not headline news. :old: :bluebird:


I get all that and understand. But what you fail to answer what do you think they up to that’s got you so wound up? Why did they choose Covid and not a bigger killer like flu? Every thing gets reported mate from a negative point of view. X people die a year of heart disease they never say how many survive and you not bothered by this. Same goes for cancer x die a year but don’t say how many people survived. Drug abuse, alcohol abuse, car accidents, jogging etc etc. The fact is they always report the negative because they more measurable god knows how many people take drugs a year and survive. We don’t know the amount of people that have survived Covid so it be just as inaccurate as you claim the death rate to be.

Please I ask one last time what do think they plan is for why they doing what you say they doing.



And again,I will point to the ? After my statement, in other words,I'm not 100%sure,but not everything sits well with me,I will not be drawn into giving an answer as to what the end game might be,as I have noticed that anyone who chooses to perhaps see things differently to others,is called a crackpot conspiracy theorist etc.how come turkey,a country of 84 million has a relatively low death rate,around 4,200 at present, compared to countries with considerably smaller populations? And I guess if they used flu instead of covid as you put it,it imo wouldn't have created the fear and hysteria currently being shown by the majority of the population.so in answer to your last sentence, I'm not sure at present,perhaps in time,and with a little research,I will come back to you with a more complete answer,and then you wil get your wish.lastly,cancer survival rates are available to view online,they do get reported, but as it's not a "new" killer it's never really noticed.why do you believe I am "wound up"? I'm very calm thank you,nor in the least wound up,just voicing my views on a forum,I would of thought the figures for survival,would only be reliable,if a person had tested positive? We are doing a lot more testing,so surely the numbers could be worked out on that basis for survival,as they know the number of infected people, if they kept tabs on wether that person had lived or had died,we could get an idea of number of survivers? :old: :bluebird:


Ok thank for responding. Was just expecting you to say a way of introducing new laws or sneaking in some brexit related deal.

But having no idea of why you don’t trust them but you don’t is all it was. Feel a foolish now that I hounded you for it I was genuinely interested in you viewpoint, but you don’t have one.



Jesus h christ! Will you put down that bone of yours? I have given my views,and answered you,that I am not 100%sure as to why the bbc are lying shit bags, but imo they are,do you not remember how we were convinced saddam hussein had invaded Kuwait? ?? Funny that,as it's now come to light that the fires in Kuwaiti oilfields,were lit by American special forces :oops: remember we were convinced saddam hussein had weapons of mass destruction,and we were in his sights??? All played out on the very same bbc,that you obviously think are spotless.I wil, say though,I've never said "I didn't have a clue" as to why they were doing it,just that I'm not 100% sure,and until I am,I will refrain from making a statement for you to try and pick holes in,thank you for admission of "hounding" me though,as that's how it feels.if you are happy with watching the bbc and sky,and believe all you hear and see,then that is your perogative,I don't, you want me to bite,so as you can try and fit me into a box that suits you,like conspiracy theorist etc,nice try though fella :thumbup: :old: :bluebird:
bluesince62
 
Posts: 2931
Joined: Sat Jun 29, 2013 12:02 pm

Re: A different perspective Covid19

Postby Bigmarkw » Wed May 20, 2020 9:48 pm

bluesince62 wrote:
Bigmarkw wrote:
bluesince62 wrote:
Bigmarkw wrote:
bluesince62 wrote:
Bigmarkw wrote:
bluesince62 wrote:
Bigmarkw wrote:You ask them the reason behind they think and they nowhere to be seen.



Well I gave you my reasons,wether you agree with them is another matter surely? Not one person,yourself included,has been given any clue as to how many people have recovered, the figures are twisted,as how can they be correct, when there are some being recorded without any test taking place?and considering the list of symtoms continues to grow,how can they be listed as covid deaths,as it may have been any other condition that was cause of death? Plus there is a huge difference in dying of something,and dying with something !! My dad (rip) died of dementia,but also had two other underlying serious issues,any one of them could have eventually killed him,but only dementia was given as cause of death, with a triple A,and cancer being listed as "with" on death certificate! As neither of them were determined as the cause of death, even though they at some stage would have ended his life,my concern around the figures are for these very reasons.the deaths in Italy where covid 19 was listed as cause of death,was very low indeed,around 12/15 % of death certificates stated covid as direct cause of death,the rest died "with covid 19,but not of it" most deaths were of another cause,but with covid.I have said it once and I will continue to say it,just because people think and view things differently, do not deserve to be name called ,it's all about opinions isn't it? Or is It easier for you to write off people's differing opinions,and ridicule them as nuts,idiots etc (the list is huge!) I also said boris was a dick,bungling his way to the top, leaving the most vulnerable in care homes to suffer so badly is not something I will find easy to forgive, I mean ffs,we are past the peak, so let's roll out testing now :roll: 8 weeks too f@cking late imho.and I stand by my opinion, that the mainstream media have been complicit in trying to scare the shit out of the nation,and to a degree has succeeded,even on here some are saying continue lockdown /restricons until a vaccine is found,well that could be a couple of years away, and by then,if restrictions are still in place,we will lose thousands of businesses and millions of jobs,and our grandkids will still be paying for it, :old: :bluebird:



In terms of numbers I agree with you that they are accurate. But through some evil plan but just because it’s impossible for them to be accurate. Most people don’t get tested and don’t get to Illand survive. But they not in the numbers that’s just life.

I’ve think Covid is very survival by the vast majority except old and vulnerable which they can do survive. I urged people to watch the bbc show hospital showing how many so called vulnerable people have survived Covid. It’s just not that dangerous to the whole population. But it is to some and a lot are getting it at the same time which is why we doing what we are to give them the best chance by keeping beds open for them. Just like we would if flu was a new disease.


Well we seem to agree on a couple of points, :thumbup: if you have read any of my previous posts on various threads, I usually add ? As to what ends that this isn't al, it's cracked up to be,the figures imho are being inflated,why else are deaths with no test, being recorded as covid, why are there no survival figures? How come so few death certificates in Italy list covid as actual cause of death?are they wrong?how come every so often,usually on mainstream news,they keep showing a picture from an intensive care unit,that's not even here,it's in bergamo hospital in spain,it's even been on here a few times too?? I haven't used the word "flu" in reference to covid,as that would be demeaning it,but I will say one thing flu related,and that is anywhere between 350,000 to 750,000 people die annually around the globe of it, we are on around 320,000 deaths related (not of covid) to this virus to date,yet the world hasn't ground to a halt for this annual loss of life to flu every year? To me it seems a little bit suspicious, and I'm no conspiracy theorist either,I just read and watch people's take on this, and who have a wider knowledge than myself,even the guardians headline today is along the lines of"how can the country trust this floundering? Lot to protect us with covid 19" accompanied by a photo of boris and his minions sat at the table,so I guess I'm not alone is not trusting the government. On the point of the elderly bearing the brunt,this is also what I have been saying,and cursing the government over the huge delay in getting testing done in care homes,in my eyes that is unforgivable,considering the percentage of deaths in them.I did watch that programme as you advised,but my argument on that,would be,that is ONE programme that showed positivity, the rest have been doom and bloody gloom to say the very least.my 80 year old mother had serious flu in February, we as a family feared the worst,as she has poor lung function due to contracted tb as a young girl.so believe me when I day, we have ALL been doing as asked of us by the top brass,but in my case it's because of her fragility and age ,more than for myself,I shop for her once a week,and drop it off with a quick chat through the french doors,and off I go,she has been at home for ten weeks already, but is not stupid enough to put herself in danger (she is a very independent lady,who does her own shop, goes to keep fit twice weekly,and loves social occasions where she can"dress up" I volunteered a week into lockdown to deliver meds to the people who were/are in isolation,mainly elderly and infirm patients,so I do take it as a serious virus,but won't be forced to panic,at the behest of mainstream media's sake,maybe if/when the total death toll for the virus reaches the highest flu death rate annually, then maybe I will,but not really,as a million deaths annually of any other cause worldwide is not headline news. :old: :bluebird:


I get all that and understand. But what you fail to answer what do you think they up to that’s got you so wound up? Why did they choose Covid and not a bigger killer like flu? Every thing gets reported mate from a negative point of view. X people die a year of heart disease they never say how many survive and you not bothered by this. Same goes for cancer x die a year but don’t say how many people survived. Drug abuse, alcohol abuse, car accidents, jogging etc etc. The fact is they always report the negative because they more measurable god knows how many people take drugs a year and survive. We don’t know the amount of people that have survived Covid so it be just as inaccurate as you claim the death rate to be.

Please I ask one last time what do think they plan is for why they doing what you say they doing.



And again,I will point to the ? After my statement, in other words,I'm not 100%sure,but not everything sits well with me,I will not be drawn into giving an answer as to what the end game might be,as I have noticed that anyone who chooses to perhaps see things differently to others,is called a crackpot conspiracy theorist etc.how come turkey,a country of 84 million has a relatively low death rate,around 4,200 at present, compared to countries with considerably smaller populations? And I guess if they used flu instead of covid as you put it,it imo wouldn't have created the fear and hysteria currently being shown by the majority of the population.so in answer to your last sentence, I'm not sure at present,perhaps in time,and with a little research,I will come back to you with a more complete answer,and then you wil get your wish.lastly,cancer survival rates are available to view online,they do get reported, but as it's not a "new" killer it's never really noticed.why do you believe I am "wound up"? I'm very calm thank you,nor in the least wound up,just voicing my views on a forum,I would of thought the figures for survival,would only be reliable,if a person had tested positive? We are doing a lot more testing,so surely the numbers could be worked out on that basis for survival,as they know the number of infected people, if they kept tabs on wether that person had lived or had died,we could get an idea of number of survivers? :old: :bluebird:


Ok thank for responding. Was just expecting you to say a way of introducing new laws or sneaking in some brexit related deal.

But having no idea of why you don’t trust them but you don’t is all it was. Feel a foolish now that I hounded you for it I was genuinely interested in you viewpoint, but you don’t have one.



Jesus h christ! Will you put down that bone of yours? I have given my views,and answered you,that I am not 100%sure as to why the bbc are lying shit bags, but imo they are,do you not remember how we were convinced saddam hussein had invaded Kuwait? ?? Funny that,as it's now come to light that the fires in Kuwaiti oilfields,were lit by American special forces :oops: remember we were convinced saddam hussein had weapons of mass destruction,and we were in his sights??? All played out on the very same bbc,that you obviously think are spotless.I wil, say though,I've never said "I didn't have a clue" as to why they were doing it,just that I'm not 100% sure,and until I am,I will refrain from making a statement for you to try and pick holes in,thank you for admission of "hounding" me though,as that's how it feels.if you are happy with watching the bbc and sky,and believe all you hear and see,then that is your perogative,I don't, you want me to bite,so as you can try and fit me into a box that suits you,like conspiracy theorist etc,nice try though fella :thumbup: :old: :bluebird:


Ooh. Someone doesn’t like be challenged.

I’m Sorry I’ve upset you genuinely was interested in what you views are as they weren’t the mundane norm washed up by main stream media. Sorry I asked now. Less hostilities asking my menopausal wife or teenager to do some thing. Lol. Jeez lesson learnt.

But in all seriousness I am genuinely sorry for upsetting you.
Bigmarkw
 
Posts: 177
Joined: Tue Apr 14, 2020 4:43 pm

Re: A different perspective Covid19

Postby bluesince62 » Wed May 20, 2020 11:51 pm

Bigmarkw wrote:
bluesince62 wrote:
Bigmarkw wrote:
bluesince62 wrote:
Bigmarkw wrote:
bluesince62 wrote:
Bigmarkw wrote:
bluesince62 wrote:
Bigmarkw wrote:You ask them the reason behind they think and they nowhere to be seen.



Well I gave you my reasons,wether you agree with them is another matter surely? Not one person,yourself included,has been given any clue as to how many people have recovered, the figures are twisted,as how can they be correct, when there are some being recorded without any test taking place?and considering the list of symtoms continues to grow,how can they be listed as covid deaths,as it may have been any other condition that was cause of death? Plus there is a huge difference in dying of something,and dying with something !! My dad (rip) died of dementia,but also had two other underlying serious issues,any one of them could have eventually killed him,but only dementia was given as cause of death, with a triple A,and cancer being listed as "with" on death certificate! As neither of them were determined as the cause of death, even though they at some stage would have ended his life,my concern around the figures are for these very reasons.the deaths in Italy where covid 19 was listed as cause of death,was very low indeed,around 12/15 % of death certificates stated covid as direct cause of death,the rest died "with covid 19,but not of it" most deaths were of another cause,but with covid.I have said it once and I will continue to say it,just because people think and view things differently, do not deserve to be name called ,it's all about opinions isn't it? Or is It easier for you to write off people's differing opinions,and ridicule them as nuts,idiots etc (the list is huge!) I also said boris was a dick,bungling his way to the top, leaving the most vulnerable in care homes to suffer so badly is not something I will find easy to forgive, I mean ffs,we are past the peak, so let's roll out testing now :roll: 8 weeks too f@cking late imho.and I stand by my opinion, that the mainstream media have been complicit in trying to scare the shit out of the nation,and to a degree has succeeded,even on here some are saying continue lockdown /restricons until a vaccine is found,well that could be a couple of years away, and by then,if restrictions are still in place,we will lose thousands of businesses and millions of jobs,and our grandkids will still be paying for it, :old: :bluebird:



In terms of numbers I agree with you that they are accurate. But through some evil plan but just because it’s impossible for them to be accurate. Most people don’t get tested and don’t get to Illand survive. But they not in the numbers that’s just life.

I’ve think Covid is very survival by the vast majority except old and vulnerable which they can do survive. I urged people to watch the bbc show hospital showing how many so called vulnerable people have survived Covid. It’s just not that dangerous to the whole population. But it is to some and a lot are getting it at the same time which is why we doing what we are to give them the best chance by keeping beds open for them. Just like we would if flu was a new disease.


Well we seem to agree on a couple of points, :thumbup: if you have read any of my previous posts on various threads, I usually add ? As to what ends that this isn't al, it's cracked up to be,the figures imho are being inflated,why else are deaths with no test, being recorded as covid, why are there no survival figures? How come so few death certificates in Italy list covid as actual cause of death?are they wrong?how come every so often,usually on mainstream news,they keep showing a picture from an intensive care unit,that's not even here,it's in bergamo hospital in spain,it's even been on here a few times too?? I haven't used the word "flu" in reference to covid,as that would be demeaning it,but I will say one thing flu related,and that is anywhere between 350,000 to 750,000 people die annually around the globe of it, we are on around 320,000 deaths related (not of covid) to this virus to date,yet the world hasn't ground to a halt for this annual loss of life to flu every year? To me it seems a little bit suspicious, and I'm no conspiracy theorist either,I just read and watch people's take on this, and who have a wider knowledge than myself,even the guardians headline today is along the lines of"how can the country trust this floundering? Lot to protect us with covid 19" accompanied by a photo of boris and his minions sat at the table,so I guess I'm not alone is not trusting the government. On the point of the elderly bearing the brunt,this is also what I have been saying,and cursing the government over the huge delay in getting testing done in care homes,in my eyes that is unforgivable,considering the percentage of deaths in them.I did watch that programme as you advised,but my argument on that,would be,that is ONE programme that showed positivity, the rest have been doom and bloody gloom to say the very least.my 80 year old mother had serious flu in February, we as a family feared the worst,as she has poor lung function due to contracted tb as a young girl.so believe me when I day, we have ALL been doing as asked of us by the top brass,but in my case it's because of her fragility and age ,more than for myself,I shop for her once a week,and drop it off with a quick chat through the french doors,and off I go,she has been at home for ten weeks already, but is not stupid enough to put herself in danger (she is a very independent lady,who does her own shop, goes to keep fit twice weekly,and loves social occasions where she can"dress up" I volunteered a week into lockdown to deliver meds to the people who were/are in isolation,mainly elderly and infirm patients,so I do take it as a serious virus,but won't be forced to panic,at the behest of mainstream media's sake,maybe if/when the total death toll for the virus reaches the highest flu death rate annually, then maybe I will,but not really,as a million deaths annually of any other cause worldwide is not headline news. :old: :bluebird:


I get all that and understand. But what you fail to answer what do you think they up to that’s got you so wound up? Why did they choose Covid and not a bigger killer like flu? Every thing gets reported mate from a negative point of view. X people die a year of heart disease they never say how many survive and you not bothered by this. Same goes for cancer x die a year but don’t say how many people survived. Drug abuse, alcohol abuse, car accidents, jogging etc etc. The fact is they always report the negative because they more measurable god knows how many people take drugs a year and survive. We don’t know the amount of people that have survived Covid so it be just as inaccurate as you claim the death rate to be.

Please I ask one last time what do think they plan is for why they doing what you say they doing.



And again,I will point to the ? After my statement, in other words,I'm not 100%sure,but not everything sits well with me,I will not be drawn into giving an answer as to what the end game might be,as I have noticed that anyone who chooses to perhaps see things differently to others,is called a crackpot conspiracy theorist etc.how come turkey,a country of 84 million has a relatively low death rate,around 4,200 at present, compared to countries with considerably smaller populations? And I guess if they used flu instead of covid as you put it,it imo wouldn't have created the fear and hysteria currently being shown by the majority of the population.so in answer to your last sentence, I'm not sure at present,perhaps in time,and with a little research,I will come back to you with a more complete answer,and then you wil get your wish.lastly,cancer survival rates are available to view online,they do get reported, but as it's not a "new" killer it's never really noticed.why do you believe I am "wound up"? I'm very calm thank you,nor in the least wound up,just voicing my views on a forum,I would of thought the figures for survival,would only be reliable,if a person had tested positive? We are doing a lot more testing,so surely the numbers could be worked out on that basis for survival,as they know the number of infected people, if they kept tabs on wether that person had lived or had died,we could get an idea of number of survivers? :old: :bluebird:


Ok thank for responding. Was just expecting you to say a way of introducing new laws or sneaking in some brexit related deal.

But having no idea of why you don’t trust them but you don’t is all it was. Feel a foolish now that I hounded you for it I was genuinely interested in you viewpoint, but you don’t have one.



Jesus h christ! Will you put down that bone of yours? I have given my views,and answered you,that I am not 100%sure as to why the bbc are lying shit bags, but imo they are,do you not remember how we were convinced saddam hussein had invaded Kuwait? ?? Funny that,as it's now come to light that the fires in Kuwaiti oilfields,were lit by American special forces :oops: remember we were convinced saddam hussein had weapons of mass destruction,and we were in his sights??? All played out on the very same bbc,that you obviously think are spotless.I wil, say though,I've never said "I didn't have a clue" as to why they were doing it,just that I'm not 100% sure,and until I am,I will refrain from making a statement for you to try and pick holes in,thank you for admission of "hounding" me though,as that's how it feels.if you are happy with watching the bbc and sky,and believe all you hear and see,then that is your perogative,I don't, you want me to bite,so as you can try and fit me into a box that suits you,like conspiracy theorist etc,nice try though fella :thumbup: :old: :bluebird:


Ooh. Someone doesn’t like be challenged.

I’m Sorry I’ve upset you genuinely was interested in what you views are as they weren’t the mundane norm washed up by main stream media. Sorry I asked now. Less hostilities asking my menopausal wife or teenager to do some thing. Lol. Jeez lesson learnt.

But in all seriousness I am genuinely sorry for upsetting you.



Firstly,I need no apology as I'm not upset, I've given you examples of why I mistrust the government and the bbc maybe for you it's not good enough,but that won't change my mind on trust in either.I get the feeling you were trying to get me to be controversial in my replies,so you could maybe put me in a box,with All the other "nutters" who think differently to you and a few others.last thing,you say you were expecting me to say something along the lines of sneaking in new laws,well partly I believe that will happen, perhaps around social distancing maybe.lm off this toic now anyway,as I cant/won't give you views according to you. :wave: :old: :bluebird:
bluesince62
 
Posts: 2931
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Re: A different perspective Covid19

Postby Nuclearblue » Thu May 21, 2020 11:26 pm

THIS IS FROM A DOCTOR WORKING IN BROADGREEN HOSPITAL:
"To all the people on here threatening to unfriend people, or wishing a second wave of COVID on people, for daring to go out in the sun yesterday, you really need to think about what you are writing, and a lot of you are health professionals as well.
What was the aim of lock down? What did every single health "expert" say was the reason to justify a lockdown? And why do we have a Flu season at all? And why have we continued to have a steady incidence rate despite being in lockdown? And why are thousands of elderly people dying in nursing homes?
The reason we had lockdown was to "flatten the curve" or buy time to increase ITU/crit care beds. Well with 4 nightingale hospitals mothballed and 50% of hospital beds lying empty, I think we have achieved that.
Not one "expert" worth his salt will tell you that we can stop a respiratory virus, and if they did they would be lying or I am deluded and we have no common cold or Flu cases every winter. So with a fifth of the country likely to have already had the virus and a health service with a massive amount of level 2 and level 3 beds, we are more than ready for a second spike, as it stands. Remember we cannot lock down forever and we need to come out, which brings me on to the Flu season.
Why do we have a flu season? The main reason we have a Flu season is because as it gets cooler people coop up and spend more time in close proximity, the population becomes denser and therefor it's easier for a virus to travel, also people tend to eat less fruit and veg and see less sunlight and our natural defences are slightly depleted, sound familiar?
The longer we stay locked down, the closer we will be to the next Flu season, so essentially you will be hitting a second spike as people begin to mix, late summer early Autumn which will be just as the next Flu seasons hits, so a second spike will lead nicely into a third and if you want to overwhelm the NHS then this is the exact way to do it.
Lastly why are so many elderly people dying of COVID, well it's largely down to the paranoia that people are displaying on platforms like facebook. GP's are not assessing elderly patients face to face, they are not being taken to hospital or they are terrified to go to hospital incase they get COVID, so they stay at home until it's too late.
Strokes are down up to 70%, where have these patient gone? MI's down 50%, Hospital attendances down 90%, where are all the falls?? But why do they all have COVID signs?
Well anyone who has worked with elderly patients, and I suspect lots of you have, will know there are multiple reasons an elderly person can develop a pneumonia (COVID symptoms). They might fall and be in pain therefore not fully expand their lungs and develop atelectasis and then pneumonia.
They may have reduced mobility, due to quarantine, and become constipated and this may push up on the diaphragm and cause atelectasis or cause them to vomit and aspirate leading to pneumonia.They may develop urinary retention and UTI, secondary to constipation, and become bed bound, causing more time in a prone position and develop a basal collapse of the lungs and again atelectasis and pneumonia. The fact that they have reduced mobility may even mean they spend more time in bed or just sitting, which again is enough to cause chest infection/pneumonia.
Strokes may not present (they aren't) and develop swallow issues and aspirate leading to pneumonia, MIs may present late and develop pulmonary oedema with a secondary infection again leading to pneumonia, and many may have a cold or a Flu (which is down 95%) and go on to develop a pneumonia.
All of the above reasons would cause a patient to have COVID symptoms and will kill elderly patients if not treated, and all of them are enough to be classed as a COVID death currently. And this is why so many nursing homes are being decimated, it's as much through fear as it is through COVID.
Before you campaign and sign petitions to lock yourselves and your family away, remember also that lock down has consequences.
The first 2 reasons are clear above, the elderly will become frail, not be treated and die in their thousands, and thousands of people will not attend A&E at all, or until it's too late and again will die. This is before you factor in the 60 thousand cancer patients that will lose their lives because of missed screening or delayed operations. And then there is the burden on mental health services and the deaths caused by domestic abuse or suicide. And that's before the biggest killer by far which will be austerity.
We are heading for the biggest recession in 300 years, the last one has cost an estimated 500000 lives, why will this one be any different? And even with the lock down measures prolonged, will we have saved any lives any way, as our frail residents face a second and third spike in quick succession.
I understand that you my be scared and its overwhelming being constantly bombarded with negativity and fear, but before you completely isolate yourselves and fall out with loved ones and friends, ask yourself is lockdown still working, and what are the potential benefits of staying locked down versus, carrying on with some semblance of a normal life?"
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Nuclearblue
 
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Re: A different perspective Covid19

Postby bluesince62 » Fri May 22, 2020 12:35 am

Nuclearblue wrote:THIS IS FROM A DOCTOR WORKING IN BROADGREEN HOSPITAL:
"To all the people on here threatening to unfriend people, or wishing a second wave of COVID on people, for daring to go out in the sun yesterday, you really need to think about what you are writing, and a lot of you are health professionals as well.
What was the aim of lock down? What did every single health "expert" say was the reason to justify a lockdown? And why do we have a Flu season at all? And why have we continued to have a steady incidence rate despite being in lockdown? And why are thousands of elderly people dying in nursing homes?
The reason we had lockdown was to "flatten the curve" or buy time to increase ITU/crit care beds. Well with 4 nightingale hospitals mothballed and 50% of hospital beds lying empty, I think we have achieved that.
Not one "expert" worth his salt will tell you that we can stop a respiratory virus, and if they did they would be lying or I am deluded and we have no common cold or Flu cases every winter. So with a fifth of the country likely to have already had the virus and a health service with a massive amount of level 2 and level 3 beds, we are more than ready for a second spike, as it stands. Remember we cannot lock down forever and we need to come out, which brings me on to the Flu season.
Why do we have a flu season? The main reason we have a Flu season is because as it gets cooler people coop up and spend more time in close proximity, the population becomes denser and therefor it's easier for a virus to travel, also people tend to eat less fruit and veg and see less sunlight and our natural defences are slightly depleted, sound familiar?
The longer we stay locked down, the closer we will be to the next Flu season, so essentially you will be hitting a second spike as people begin to mix, late summer early Autumn which will be just as the next Flu seasons hits, so a second spike will lead nicely into a third and if you want to overwhelm the NHS then this is the exact way to do it.
Lastly why are so many elderly people dying of COVID, well it's largely down to the paranoia that people are displaying on platforms like facebook. GP's are not assessing elderly patients face to face, they are not being taken to hospital or they are terrified to go to hospital incase they get COVID, so they stay at home until it's too late.
Strokes are down up to 70%, where have these patient gone? MI's down 50%, Hospital attendances down 90%, where are all the falls?? But why do they all have COVID signs?
Well anyone who has worked with elderly patients, and I suspect lots of you have, will know there are multiple reasons an elderly person can develop a pneumonia (COVID symptoms). They might fall and be in pain therefore not fully expand their lungs and develop atelectasis and then pneumonia.
They may have reduced mobility, due to quarantine, and become constipated and this may push up on the diaphragm and cause atelectasis or cause them to vomit and aspirate leading to pneumonia.They may develop urinary retention and UTI, secondary to constipation, and become bed bound, causing more time in a prone position and develop a basal collapse of the lungs and again atelectasis and pneumonia. The fact that they have reduced mobility may even mean they spend more time in bed or just sitting, which again is enough to cause chest infection/pneumonia.
Strokes may not present (they aren't) and develop swallow issues and aspirate leading to pneumonia, MIs may present late and develop pulmonary oedema with a secondary infection again leading to pneumonia, and many may have a cold or a Flu (which is down 95%) and go on to develop a pneumonia.
All of the above reasons would cause a patient to have COVID symptoms and will kill elderly patients if not treated, and all of them are enough to be classed as a COVID death currently. And this is why so many nursing homes are being decimated, it's as much through fear as it is through COVID.
Before you campaign and sign petitions to lock yourselves and your family away, remember also that lock down has consequences.
The first 2 reasons are clear above, the elderly will become frail, not be treated and die in their thousands, and thousands of people will not attend A&E at all, or until it's too late and again will die. This is before you factor in the 60 thousand cancer patients that will lose their lives because of missed screening or delayed operations. And then there is the burden on mental health services and the deaths caused by domestic abuse or suicide. And that's before the biggest killer by far which will be austerity.
We are heading for the biggest recession in 300 years, the last one has cost an estimated 500000 lives, why will this one be any different? And even with the lock down measures prolonged, will we have saved any lives any way, as our frail residents face a second and third spike in quick succession.
I understand that you my be scared and its overwhelming being constantly bombarded with negativity and fear, but before you completely isolate yourselves and fall out with loved ones and friends, ask yourself is lockdown still working, and what are the potential benefits of staying locked down versus, carrying on with some semblance of a normal life?"




:clap: :clap: :clap: if people looked further than their own noses, and did some searching,they will find a plethora of experts saying the same thing.but for those of us that listen,and see things in a different light,you get hounded out,trying to getyou to make a bonkers statement, so as they can try to belittle you,perhaps it makes them feel better? I would tell them to open their eyes and ears for a change! Come on how come flu is down 95%?? It's certainly not because everyone has the flu jab is it! And as the post states,a huge array of illness/sickness would be listed as a covid death these days,but could be a number of other things! Does that not matter to some,that these Un investigated/tested deaths are clouding the true picture? (Awaits usual susoect/so respond in kind :laughing6: ) I also came across an interesting article,regarding the virus being killed by heat,saying being in the sun,cold kill it in as little as 2 hrs! Which brings me to how turkey seem to be fairing, 84 m people,about 10%ish over 70,so roughly 8m,but are now on the downward curve of the virus,with only 4,300 deaths to date?? Is it because they are suffering an insanely warm may? (Hottest in 70 odd years! 43 c in places ) and they had a weaker lockdown than us, have sent ppe to 50 different countries too!! Only under 21's and over 65's who were in proper lockdown,and the big cities on lockdown on weekends,is that proof that heat can be a factor in dissapating the virus quickly?or a lesser lockdown was the way to go? Nice to see an expert give his honest opinion on this matter,and he is spot in about a 2nd or 3rd wave,it will decimate the old big time,not that it hasn't this time.all what he says is spot on to me. :thumbup: :old: :bluebird:
bluesince62
 
Posts: 2931
Joined: Sat Jun 29, 2013 12:02 pm

Re: A different perspective Covid19

Postby skidemin » Fri May 22, 2020 1:41 am

Nuclearblue wrote:THIS IS FROM A DOCTOR WORKING IN BROADGREEN HOSPITAL:
"To all the people on here threatening to unfriend people, or wishing a second wave of COVID on people, for daring to go out in the sun yesterday, you really need to think about what you are writing, and a lot of you are health professionals as well.
What was the aim of lock down? What did every single health "expert" say was the reason to justify a lockdown? And why do we have a Flu season at all? And why have we continued to have a steady incidence rate despite being in lockdown? And why are thousands of elderly people dying in nursing homes?
The reason we had lockdown was to "flatten the curve" or buy time to increase ITU/crit care beds. Well with 4 nightingale hospitals mothballed and 50% of hospital beds lying empty, I think we have achieved that.
Not one "expert" worth his salt will tell you that we can stop a respiratory virus, and if they did they would be lying or I am deluded and we have no common cold or Flu cases every winter. So with a fifth of the country likely to have already had the virus and a health service with a massive amount of level 2 and level 3 beds, we are more than ready for a second spike, as it stands. Remember we cannot lock down forever and we need to come out, which brings me on to the Flu season.
Why do we have a flu season? The main reason we have a Flu season is because as it gets cooler people coop up and spend more time in close proximity, the population becomes denser and therefor it's easier for a virus to travel, also people tend to eat less fruit and veg and see less sunlight and our natural defences are slightly depleted, sound familiar?
The longer we stay locked down, the closer we will be to the next Flu season, so essentially you will be hitting a second spike as people begin to mix, late summer early Autumn which will be just as the next Flu seasons hits, so a second spike will lead nicely into a third and if you want to overwhelm the NHS then this is the exact way to do it.
Lastly why are so many elderly people dying of COVID, well it's largely down to the paranoia that people are displaying on platforms like facebook. GP's are not assessing elderly patients face to face, they are not being taken to hospital or they are terrified to go to hospital incase they get COVID, so they stay at home until it's too late.
Strokes are down up to 70%, where have these patient gone? MI's down 50%, Hospital attendances down 90%, where are all the falls?? But why do they all have COVID signs?
Well anyone who has worked with elderly patients, and I suspect lots of you have, will know there are multiple reasons an elderly person can develop a pneumonia (COVID symptoms). They might fall and be in pain therefore not fully expand their lungs and develop atelectasis and then pneumonia.
They may have reduced mobility, due to quarantine, and become constipated and this may push up on the diaphragm and cause atelectasis or cause them to vomit and aspirate leading to pneumonia.They may develop urinary retention and UTI, secondary to constipation, and become bed bound, causing more time in a prone position and develop a basal collapse of the lungs and again atelectasis and pneumonia. The fact that they have reduced mobility may even mean they spend more time in bed or just sitting, which again is enough to cause chest infection/pneumonia.
Strokes may not present (they aren't) and develop swallow issues and aspirate leading to pneumonia, MIs may present late and develop pulmonary oedema with a secondary infection again leading to pneumonia, and many may have a cold or a Flu (which is down 95%) and go on to develop a pneumonia.
All of the above reasons would cause a patient to have COVID symptoms and will kill elderly patients if not treated, and all of them are enough to be classed as a COVID death currently. And this is why so many nursing homes are being decimated, it's as much through fear as it is through COVID.
Before you campaign and sign petitions to lock yourselves and your family away, remember also that lock down has consequences.
The first 2 reasons are clear above, the elderly will become frail, not be treated and die in their thousands, and thousands of people will not attend A&E at all, or until it's too late and again will die. This is before you factor in the 60 thousand cancer patients that will lose their lives because of missed screening or delayed operations. And then there is the burden on mental health services and the deaths caused by domestic abuse or suicide. And that's before the biggest killer by far which will be austerity.
We are heading for the biggest recession in 300 years, the last one has cost an estimated 500000 lives, why will this one be any different? And even with the lock down measures prolonged, will we have saved any lives any way, as our frail residents face a second and third spike in quick succession.
I understand that you my be scared and its overwhelming being constantly bombarded with negativity and fear, but before you completely isolate yourselves and fall out with loved ones and friends, ask yourself is lockdown still working, and what are the potential benefits of staying locked down versus, carrying on with some semblance of a normal life?"




most of the above has been said on here in smaller doses by many posters so so many times...
unfortunately it has no effect on the brainwashed coronaphobes
skidemin
 
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