Is it about time this forum had a politics secton.

A forum for all things Cardiff City

Is it about time this forum had a politics secton.

Postby stickywicket » Sun Oct 18, 2020 5:38 pm

Afterall I persume it was set up for all things Cardiff City. :bluescarf: :bluescarf: :bluescarf: :bluebird: :bluebird: :bluebird: :bluebird: :bluebird:
User avatar
stickywicket
 
Posts: 1957
Joined: Mon Nov 30, 2009 2:59 pm

Is it about time this forum had a politics secton.

Advertisement

Advertisement
Login or Register to remove this ad.

Re: Is it about time this forum had a politics secton.

Postby WestCoastBlue » Sun Oct 18, 2020 6:46 pm

I think so. I do enjoy partaking in the politics discussions but it clutters up the front page and pushes down the Cardiff content, I can see more casual users getting put off by too much politics.

On a separate note if we’re decluttering the front page can we have a section where Daya and Brownie can post their absolute drivel? There’s enough ads on the forum without 2 posters who contribute nothing to other threads and just leave links to their own personal websites :?
WestCoastBlue
 
Posts: 202
Joined: Thu Jul 02, 2020 3:17 pm

Re: Is it about time this forum had a politics secton.

Postby englishbluebird » Sun Oct 18, 2020 7:44 pm

I agree
"Like we give a f**k about the Carling Cup"-6Bysedd
User avatar
englishbluebird
 
Posts: 4653
Joined: Tue Jan 25, 2011 1:16 am
Location: caerphilly

Re: Is it about time this forum had a politics secton.

Postby worcester_ccfc » Sun Oct 18, 2020 10:32 pm

I would definitely agree.
Vote for your Man of the Match on this forum after every Cardiff City match, and your Player of the Month every month during the season :ayatollah:

Season ticket holder in Ninian 116 :bluebird:

@neddthomas on Twitter.

:bluescarf: :bluescarf: :bluescarf:
User avatar
worcester_ccfc
Admin
 
Posts: 14333
Joined: Tue Jun 29, 2010 11:30 am

Re: Is it about time this forum had a politics secton.

Postby Ponty Bluebird » Sun Oct 18, 2020 11:13 pm

WestCoastBlue wrote:I think so. I do enjoy partaking in the politics discussions but it clutters up the front page and pushes down the Cardiff content, I can see more casual users getting put off by too much politics.

On a separate note if we’re decluttering the front page can we have a section where Daya and Brownie can post their absolute drivel? There’s enough ads on the forum without 2 posters who contribute nothing to other threads and just leave links to their own personal websites :?

I agree :thumbup:
Ponty Bluebird
 
Posts: 86
Joined: Sat Jun 13, 2020 1:49 pm

Re: Is it about time this forum had a politics secton.

Postby Sven » Mon Oct 19, 2020 1:20 am

stickywicket wrote:Afterall I persume it was set up for all things Cardiff City. :bluescarf: :bluescarf: :bluescarf: :bluebird: :bluebird: :bluebird: :bluebird: :bluebird:

I agree, fella but (having seen/tried similar efforts in the past) it simply wouldn't work :(

A fair few (certainly not all) people on here don't really play the game on such things and will post in the Main Forum 'by default'

You only have to see how many threads are created when others already exist to see that

It's a shame but sadly how it is :cry:
"Never argue with an idiot; they'll drag you down to their gutter level and beat you with experience!"
User avatar
Sven
Moderator
 
Posts: 18608
Joined: Sat Aug 21, 2010 7:14 pm

Re: Is it about time this forum had a politics secton.

Postby ealing_ayatollah » Mon Oct 19, 2020 9:01 am

Sven wrote:
stickywicket wrote:Afterall I persume it was set up for all things Cardiff City. :bluescarf: :bluescarf: :bluescarf: :bluebird: :bluebird: :bluebird: :bluebird: :bluebird:

I agree, fella but (having seen/tried similar efforts in the past) it simply wouldn't work :(

A fair few (certainly not all) people on here don't really play the game on such things and will post in the Main Forum 'by default'

You only have to see how many threads are created when others already exist to see that

It's a shame but sadly how it is :cry:

You may well be right a politics section might not work for the reasons you suggest, but respectfully,it seems a bit of a defeatist attitutde to not even try because it might not work?

Couldnt the mods just move posts to the right area. Think I've seen that done before on posts so assume it is possible?

I think with a firm but consistent approach and good communication (DM the OP to let them know when a post is moved and why) then most people would eventually give up gaming the system. Surely worth trying though as there is clearly an appetite for it?

I like to post on football threads as much as non-football, but truth of the matter is it is the non-football threads which have far higher engagement which keeps them up front page. Thread for thread I'd imagine they also bring more ad revenue to the forum as they are longer so more pages?

Surely, the easiest answer for those complaining about not enough football threads on front page is just to post on them more?

:ayatollah:
I'm just a wine drinking monkey that has a penchant for fine bannanas. You can check out my human alter-ego singing and speaking nonsense on the you tube if you like @ https://www.youtube.com/user/sibaronimusic
User avatar
ealing_ayatollah
 
Posts: 1459
Joined: Mon Mar 26, 2012 6:29 pm

Re: Is it about time this forum had a politics secton.

Postby ion » Mon Oct 19, 2020 9:08 am

The thing is people flip flop around like labour when posting stuff I think it would be hard to keep it to one section :lol: only joking ,good idea ,I post enough political crap
ion
 
Posts: 113
Joined: Wed Sep 25, 2019 5:06 pm

Re: Is it about time this forum had a politics secton.

Postby Sven » Mon Oct 19, 2020 10:26 am

ealing_ayatollah wrote:
Sven wrote:
stickywicket wrote:Afterall I persume it was set up for all things Cardiff City. :bluescarf: :bluescarf: :bluescarf: :bluebird: :bluebird: :bluebird: :bluebird: :bluebird:

I agree, fella but (having seen/tried similar efforts in the past) it simply wouldn't work :(

A fair few (certainly not all) people on here don't really play the game on such things and will post in the Main Forum 'by default'

You only have to see how many threads are created when others already exist to see that

It's a shame but sadly how it is :cry:

You may well be right a politics section might not work for the reasons you suggest, but respectfully,it seems a bit of a defeatist attitutde to not even try because it might not work?

Couldnt the mods just move posts to the right area. Think I've seen that done before on posts so assume it is possible?

I think with a firm but consistent approach and good communication (DM the OP to let them know when a post is moved and why) then most people would eventually give up gaming the system. Surely worth trying though as there is clearly an appetite for it?

I like to post on football threads as much as non-football, but truth of the matter is it is the non-football threads which have far higher engagement which keeps them up front page. Thread for thread I'd imagine they also bring more ad revenue to the forum as they are longer so more pages?

Surely, the easiest answer for those complaining about not enough football threads on front page is just to post on them more?

:ayatollah:

It's hard to disagree with any of that (other than it's been tried before) and I'll put it to the other Mods/Admins to see if it's worth another go :thumbright:

The idea about those complaining is a novel one that one or two might think about taking up ;)
"Never argue with an idiot; they'll drag you down to their gutter level and beat you with experience!"
User avatar
Sven
Moderator
 
Posts: 18608
Joined: Sat Aug 21, 2010 7:14 pm

Re: Is it about time this forum had a politics secton.

Postby Tony Blue Williams » Mon Oct 19, 2020 11:00 am

I have been a member of this forum since day one. The forum has it's faults but by in large it is run excellently. I would prefer not to try and fix something that is not broke.

Leave everything as it is, (please) :thumbup:
User avatar
Tony Blue Williams
 
Posts: 13991
Joined: Wed Nov 25, 2009 9:25 am

Re: Is it about time this forum had a politics secton.

Postby ealing_ayatollah » Mon Oct 19, 2020 12:02 pm

Sven wrote:
ealing_ayatollah wrote:
Sven wrote:
stickywicket wrote:Afterall I persume it was set up for all things Cardiff City. :bluescarf: :bluescarf: :bluescarf: :bluebird: :bluebird: :bluebird: :bluebird: :bluebird:

I agree, fella but (having seen/tried similar efforts in the past) it simply wouldn't work :(

A fair few (certainly not all) people on here don't really play the game on such things and will post in the Main Forum 'by default'

You only have to see how many threads are created when others already exist to see that

It's a shame but sadly how it is :cry:

You may well be right a politics section might not work for the reasons you suggest, but respectfully,it seems a bit of a defeatist attitutde to not even try because it might not work?

Couldnt the mods just move posts to the right area. Think I've seen that done before on posts so assume it is possible?

I think with a firm but consistent approach and good communication (DM the OP to let them know when a post is moved and why) then most people would eventually give up gaming the system. Surely worth trying though as there is clearly an appetite for it?

I like to post on football threads as much as non-football, but truth of the matter is it is the non-football threads which have far higher engagement which keeps them up front page. Thread for thread I'd imagine they also bring more ad revenue to the forum as they are longer so more pages?

Surely, the easiest answer for those complaining about not enough football threads on front page is just to post on them more?

:ayatollah:

It's hard to disagree with any of that (other than it's been tried before) and I'll put it to the other Mods/Admins to see if it's worth another go :thumbright:

The idea about those complaining is a novel one that one or two might think about taking up ;)

:thumbup:
I'm just a wine drinking monkey that has a penchant for fine bannanas. You can check out my human alter-ego singing and speaking nonsense on the you tube if you like @ https://www.youtube.com/user/sibaronimusic
User avatar
ealing_ayatollah
 
Posts: 1459
Joined: Mon Mar 26, 2012 6:29 pm

Re: Is it about time this forum had a politics secton.

Postby pembroke allan » Mon Oct 19, 2020 1:00 pm

Now its politics what will be next ? This forum is based on open debate so banishing one sector to back pages means information will be lost and what constitutes politics? County councils a politician doing wrong ect ect .... as usual the answer is if subject is not for your taste simply dont look or post on it! Simples. :old:
User avatar
pembroke allan
 
Posts: 22655
Joined: Wed Jan 18, 2012 11:00 pm
Location: Cardiff

Re: Is it about time this forum had a politics secton.

Postby worcester_ccfc » Mon Oct 19, 2020 1:04 pm

pembroke allan wrote:Now its politics what will be next ? This forum is based on open debate so banishing one sector to back pages means information will be lost and what constitutes politics? County councils a politician doing wrong ect ect .... as usual the answer is if subject is not for your taste simply dont look or post on it! Simples. :old:


The fact is many people come on here to talk about football but there are far too many political topics posted on a daily basis.

I try to condense them down to the same thread if they're on a similar topic, but this can often take me a long time.
Vote for your Man of the Match on this forum after every Cardiff City match, and your Player of the Month every month during the season :ayatollah:

Season ticket holder in Ninian 116 :bluebird:

@neddthomas on Twitter.

:bluescarf: :bluescarf: :bluescarf:
User avatar
worcester_ccfc
Admin
 
Posts: 14333
Joined: Tue Jun 29, 2010 11:30 am

Re: Is it about time this forum had a politics secton.

Postby Bluebina » Mon Oct 19, 2020 1:05 pm

WestCoastBlue wrote:I think so. I do enjoy partaking in the politics discussions but it clutters up the front page and pushes down the Cardiff content, I can see more casual users getting put off by too much politics.

On a separate note if we’re decluttering the front page can we have a section where Daya and Brownie can post their absolute drivel? There’s enough ads on the forum without 2 posters who contribute nothing to other threads and just leave links to their own personal websites :?



I do agree with the Daya and Brownie bit, I never open them anymore but they do get in the way, and don't add anything at all :thumbup:

I'm happy to glance through football or politics at the same time, if the football is good the politics dies down anyway.
Bluebina
 
Posts: 11121
Joined: Thu Dec 03, 2009 12:32 am

Re: Is it about time this forum had a politics secton.

Postby pembroke allan » Mon Oct 19, 2020 1:10 pm

worcester_ccfc wrote:
pembroke allan wrote:Now its politics what will be next ? This forum is based on open debate so banishing one sector to back pages means information will be lost and what constitutes politics? County councils a politician doing wrong ect ect .... as usual the answer is if subject is not for your taste simply dont look or post on it! Simples. :old:


The fact is many people come on here to talk about football but there are far too many political topics posted on a daily basis.

I try to condense them down to the same thread if they're on a similar topic, but this can often take me a long time.



Ned cant you just shift them to bottom of page if not interesting? Not all political posts are boring or of no interest to people... or simply delete topic? :D
User avatar
pembroke allan
 
Posts: 22655
Joined: Wed Jan 18, 2012 11:00 pm
Location: Cardiff

Re: Is it about time this forum had a politics secton.

Postby worcester_ccfc » Mon Oct 19, 2020 1:13 pm

pembroke allan wrote:
worcester_ccfc wrote:
pembroke allan wrote:Now its politics what will be next ? This forum is based on open debate so banishing one sector to back pages means information will be lost and what constitutes politics? County councils a politician doing wrong ect ect .... as usual the answer is if subject is not for your taste simply dont look or post on it! Simples. :old:


The fact is many people come on here to talk about football but there are far too many political topics posted on a daily basis.

I try to condense them down to the same thread if they're on a similar topic, but this can often take me a long time.



Ned cant you just shift them to bottom of page if not interesting? Not all political posts are boring or of no interest to people... or simply delete topic? :D


I'm not moving them to the bottom of the page, just moving them to one topic. If people continue to discuss them, they will be at the top of the page still.

My personal opinion is there should be a politics forum - just as there is for gambling and selling.
Vote for your Man of the Match on this forum after every Cardiff City match, and your Player of the Month every month during the season :ayatollah:

Season ticket holder in Ninian 116 :bluebird:

@neddthomas on Twitter.

:bluescarf: :bluescarf: :bluescarf:
User avatar
worcester_ccfc
Admin
 
Posts: 14333
Joined: Tue Jun 29, 2010 11:30 am

Re: Is it about time this forum had a politics secton.

Postby pembroke allan » Mon Oct 19, 2020 1:20 pm

worcester_ccfc wrote:
pembroke allan wrote:
worcester_ccfc wrote:
pembroke allan wrote:Now its politics what will be next ? This forum is based on open debate so banishing one sector to back pages means information will be lost and what constitutes politics? County councils a politician doing wrong ect ect .... as usual the answer is if subject is not for your taste simply dont look or post on it! Simples. :old:


The fact is many people come on here to talk about football but there are far too many political topics posted on a daily basis.

I try to condense them down to the same thread if they're on a similar topic, but this can often take me a long time.



Ned cant you just shift them to bottom of page if not interesting? Not all political posts are boring or of no interest to people... or simply delete topic? :D


I'm not moving them to the bottom of the page, just moving them to one topic. If people continue to discuss them, they will be at the top of the page still.

My personal opinion is there should be a politics forum - just as there is for gambling and selling.



Thats fine but that wont stop people posting things about a politician council ect on main forum... seems like impossible task and to much work for you and fellow mods :o
User avatar
pembroke allan
 
Posts: 22655
Joined: Wed Jan 18, 2012 11:00 pm
Location: Cardiff

Re: Is it about time this forum had a politics secton.

Postby paulh_85 » Mon Oct 19, 2020 1:25 pm

the political threads are the ones that get the most posts. (thread about Newport not kneeling has more than anything cardiff related recently)

Maybe its time the forum had a football section? :laughing6:
User avatar
paulh_85
 
Posts: 11831
Joined: Fri Feb 04, 2011 6:20 pm

Re: Is it about time this forum had a politics secton.

Postby Bluebina » Mon Oct 19, 2020 7:59 pm

worcester_ccfc wrote:
pembroke allan wrote:
worcester_ccfc wrote:
pembroke allan wrote:Now its politics what will be next ? This forum is based on open debate so banishing one sector to back pages means information will be lost and what constitutes politics? County councils a politician doing wrong ect ect .... as usual the answer is if subject is not for your taste simply dont look or post on it! Simples. :old:


The fact is many people come on here to talk about football but there are far too many political topics posted on a daily basis.

I try to condense them down to the same thread if they're on a similar topic, but this can often take me a long time.



Ned cant you just shift them to bottom of page if not interesting? Not all political posts are boring or of no interest to people... or simply delete topic? :D


I'm not moving them to the bottom of the page, just moving them to one topic. If people continue to discuss them, they will be at the top of the page still.

My personal opinion is there should be a politics forum - just as there is for gambling and selling.


I don't think anyone would use them, and this boards traffic and posts would reduce massively, I've never read those other boards I forgot they even existed, is wolfpack on there he always posted about gambling?
Bluebina
 
Posts: 11121
Joined: Thu Dec 03, 2009 12:32 am

Re: Is it about time this forum had a politics secton.

Postby Bluebina » Mon Oct 19, 2020 8:08 pm

Bluebina wrote:
worcester_ccfc wrote:
pembroke allan wrote:
worcester_ccfc wrote:
pembroke allan wrote:Now its politics what will be next ? This forum is based on open debate so banishing one sector to back pages means information will be lost and what constitutes politics? County councils a politician doing wrong ect ect .... as usual the answer is if subject is not for your taste simply dont look or post on it! Simples. :old:


The fact is many people come on here to talk about football but there are far too many political topics posted on a daily basis.

I try to condense them down to the same thread if they're on a similar topic, but this can often take me a long time.



Ned cant you just shift them to bottom of page if not interesting? Not all political posts are boring or of no interest to people... or simply delete topic? :D


I'm not moving them to the bottom of the page, just moving them to one topic. If people continue to discuss them, they will be at the top of the page still.

My personal opinion is there should be a politics forum - just as there is for gambling and selling.


I don't think anyone would use them, and this boards traffic and posts would reduce massively, I've never read those other boards I forgot they even existed, is wolfpack on there he always posted about gambling?


I take it we mean all non-football related posts, like black lives matter, Covid, Brexit, Drakeford etc.
Bluebina
 
Posts: 11121
Joined: Thu Dec 03, 2009 12:32 am

Re: Is it about time this forum had a politics secton.

Postby ealing_ayatollah » Tue Oct 20, 2020 12:59 pm

pembroke allan wrote: or simply delete topic? :D


***In David Brent's voice ***

Oooh, a bit fascist that, ain't it? Deleting posts? Hmm, pretty sure Hitler would have done that. If he'd had internet. Well, internet, a message board and mod privileges... ;)



Sorry, couldn't resist. I know I should, I really do, but I just have a terrible, terrible sense of humour that takes control of my fingers sometimes. :laughing6:

:thumbup:
I'm just a wine drinking monkey that has a penchant for fine bannanas. You can check out my human alter-ego singing and speaking nonsense on the you tube if you like @ https://www.youtube.com/user/sibaronimusic
User avatar
ealing_ayatollah
 
Posts: 1459
Joined: Mon Mar 26, 2012 6:29 pm

Re: Is it about time this forum had a politics secton.

Postby ealing_ayatollah » Tue Oct 20, 2020 1:00 pm

paulh_85 wrote:the political threads are the ones that get the most posts. (thread about Newport not kneeling has more than anything cardiff related recently)

Maybe its time the forum had a football section? :laughing6:


:laughing5:
I'm just a wine drinking monkey that has a penchant for fine bannanas. You can check out my human alter-ego singing and speaking nonsense on the you tube if you like @ https://www.youtube.com/user/sibaronimusic
User avatar
ealing_ayatollah
 
Posts: 1459
Joined: Mon Mar 26, 2012 6:29 pm

Re: Is it about time this forum had a politics secton.

Postby pembroke allan » Tue Oct 20, 2020 1:17 pm

ealing_ayatollah wrote:
pembroke allan wrote: or simply delete topic? :D


***In David Brent's voice ***

Oooh, a bit fascist that, ain't it? Deleting posts? Hmm, pretty sure Hitler would have done that. If he'd had internet. Well, internet, a message board and mod privileges... ;)



Sorry, couldn't resist. I know I should, I really do, but I just have a terrible, terrible sense of humour that takes control of my fingers sometimes. :laughing6:

:thumbup:



Thats ok it was all gobblygook anyway! :laughing5:
User avatar
pembroke allan
 
Posts: 22655
Joined: Wed Jan 18, 2012 11:00 pm
Location: Cardiff

Re: Is it about time this forum had a politics secton.

Postby ealing_ayatollah » Tue Oct 20, 2020 1:22 pm

pembroke allan wrote:
ealing_ayatollah wrote:
pembroke allan wrote: or simply delete topic? :D


***In David Brent's voice ***

Oooh, a bit fascist that, ain't it? Deleting posts? Hmm, pretty sure Hitler would have done that. If he'd had internet. Well, internet, a message board and mod privileges... ;)



Sorry, couldn't resist. I know I should, I really do, but I just have a terrible, terrible sense of humour that takes control of my fingers sometimes. :laughing6:

:thumbup:



Thats ok it was all gobblygook anyway! :laughing5:


Moat of what goes through my brain is I'm afraid :thumbup: :laughing6:
I'm just a wine drinking monkey that has a penchant for fine bannanas. You can check out my human alter-ego singing and speaking nonsense on the you tube if you like @ https://www.youtube.com/user/sibaronimusic
User avatar
ealing_ayatollah
 
Posts: 1459
Joined: Mon Mar 26, 2012 6:29 pm

Re: Is it about time this forum had a politics secton.

Postby moonboots » Tue Oct 20, 2020 2:35 pm

Sven wrote:
stickywicket wrote:Afterall I persume it was set up for all things Cardiff City. :bluescarf: :bluescarf: :bluescarf: :bluebird: :bluebird: :bluebird: :bluebird: :bluebird:

I agree, fella but (having seen/tried similar efforts in the past) it simply wouldn't work :(

A fair few (certainly not all) people on here don't really play the game on such things and will post in the Main Forum 'by default'

You only have to see how many threads are created when others already exist to see that

It's a shame but sadly how it is :cry:

Could the mods not move political topics created in the football forum to the politics section?
moonboots
 
Posts: 2738
Joined: Thu Jun 24, 2010 2:18 pm

Re: Is it about time this forum had a politics secton.

Postby powysblue » Tue Oct 20, 2020 4:44 pm

Tony Blue Williams wrote:I have been a member of this forum since day one. The forum has it's faults but by in large it is run excellently. I would prefer not to try and fix something that is not broke.

Leave everything as it is, (please) :thumbup:


Agree with this.

Having looked at other championship forums online, OUR Cardiff city forum (or Annis's) is FAR superior for ease of Navigation and layout - Most users go straight to the "general chat" section and as we have discussed previously - all views are welcomed, football, political or general interest or asking for help or advice.

Even more so these days.

I am more than happy with the ease and variety of posts. If a political section was added it would be hidden away in the opening selection and I can see the usual suspects moaning like hell when anything non-football was commented on.

If it ain't broke, Don't fix it :old:

:bluescarf: :bluebird: :thumbup:
User avatar
powysblue
 
Posts: 548
Joined: Sat Mar 30, 2013 2:36 pm
Location: North of Brecon Via Llanrumney

Re: Is it about time this forum had a politics secton.

Postby Nuclearblue » Tue Oct 20, 2020 5:35 pm

The suppression of free speech needs to stop. For some if they don’t agree it’s hit the delete button. But this board has always been about all things. But even the topics on politics has an impact on Cardiff City FC.
So no having a different section won’t work. It’s one of those cases if you don’t like a thread move in to the next. No one is forcing anyone to read certain threads.
User avatar
Nuclearblue
 
Posts: 22848
Joined: Sat Nov 28, 2009 10:35 am

Re: Is it about time this forum had a politics secton.

Postby Sven » Tue Oct 20, 2020 6:46 pm

paulh_85 wrote:the political threads are the ones that get the most posts. (thread about Newport not kneeling has more than anything cardiff related recently)

Maybe its time the forum had a football section? :laughing6:

You may be right...! :thumbup: :lol: :lol:
"Never argue with an idiot; they'll drag you down to their gutter level and beat you with experience!"
User avatar
Sven
Moderator
 
Posts: 18608
Joined: Sat Aug 21, 2010 7:14 pm

Re: Is it about time this forum had a politics secton.

Postby thomasblue » Tue Oct 20, 2020 9:34 pm

Can they not just turn the titles of football Posts blue and everything else red so it is easier to just flick past them if you don't want to read it?
thomasblue
 
Posts: 6596
Joined: Tue Oct 30, 2012 3:20 pm

Re: Is it about time this forum had a politics secton.

Postby skidemin » Wed Oct 21, 2020 2:53 am

thomasblue wrote:Can they not just turn the titles of football Posts blue and everything else red so it is easier to just flick past them if you don't want to read it?



its not a bad idea... Adam Brown could have his own colour..Brown even... because the title is football but there is never a post when you have a look...
although most of those that have complained also post far more on non football threads than they post on the football threads... strange...
skidemin
 
Posts: 2790
Joined: Sat Jan 04, 2020 8:45 pm



Return to General Chat

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Google [Bot] and 90 guests

Disclaimer :
The views and comments entered in these forums are personal and are not necessarily those of the management of this board.
The management of this board is not responsible for the content of any external internet sites.