Basic passing of the ball..

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Basic passing of the ball..

Postby GENERAL CHAT » Thu Oct 29, 2020 5:02 pm

I think one of the most fundamental problems we have is basic passing.

Too short a pass, inaccurate, too slow, too long. :o :shock: :o :shock:

Anyone else notice this and agree/disagree with our highly paid professional footballers?

(besides wrong decisions too)

For me, we need to get this right first.

Only my opinion... :banghead:
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Basic passing of the ball..

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Re: Basic passing of the ball..

Postby oxfordblue » Thu Oct 29, 2020 5:14 pm

GENERAL CHAT wrote:I think one of the most fundamental problems we have is basic passing.

Too short a pass, inaccurate, too slow, too long. :o :shock: :o :shock:

Anyone else notice this and agree/disagree with our highly paid professional footballers?

(besides wrong decisions too)

For me, we need to get this right first.

Only my opinion... :banghead:


Totally agree, the game is called football.

It's basically pass and move, not that complicated.
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Re: Basic passing of the ball..

Postby Nemo » Thu Oct 29, 2020 5:29 pm

GENERAL CHAT wrote:I think one of the most fundamental problems we have is basic passing.

Too short a pass, inaccurate, too slow, too long. :o :shock: :o :shock:

Anyone else notice this and agree/disagree with our highly paid professional footballers?

(besides wrong decisions too)

For me, we need to get this right first.

Only my opinion... :banghead:


Couldn’t agree more. It is possibly our biggest problem. Inexcusably sloppy passing in the attacking third means we frequentLy surrender good positions. The same In our own half puts us under unnecessary pressure. I don’t expect us to be like Man City but basic competence would be nice.
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Re: Basic passing of the ball..

Postby RICK+CCFC » Thu Oct 29, 2020 5:37 pm

I’ve said so, on many occasions in the past. Our passing, and basic ball control have been poor,,, and there seems too be little or no improvement season after season. Simply not good enough at this level.
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Re: Basic passing of the ball..

Postby montyblue » Thu Oct 29, 2020 5:51 pm

I agree on the passing
an even bigger problem is the backs get to the half way line and then either turn back or pass back drives me mad this recycle and retain the ball back and start again
what happened to taking on the opposition and perhaps try dribbling past a player
derby last night closed us down and we went backwards and have done under harris starting to defensive.
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Re: Basic passing of the ball..

Postby Crayfish » Thu Oct 29, 2020 6:06 pm

I agree but would point out that our passing was pretty awful when Neil Warncok was our manager and we managed to finish second in the table and got promoted despite boing constantly out passed by many other teams. Still find it hard to believe we got promoted that season with such poor passing.
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Re: Basic passing of the ball..

Postby skidemin » Thu Oct 29, 2020 10:14 pm

Crayfish wrote:I agree but would point out that our passing was pretty awful when Neil Warncok was our manager and we managed to finish second in the table and got promoted despite boing constantly out passed by many other teams. Still find it hard to believe we got promoted that season with such poor passing.



spot on mate they havent turned into a team of Iniestas over night.....it was recognise what you have and play to strengths.. way too much stupid square ponderous passing and at the moment and weve all seen how ineffective it is unless your a top top team...
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Re: Basic passing of the ball..

Postby Bakedalasker » Thu Oct 29, 2020 10:20 pm

Our passing has been atrocious.

Our first goal against us was because of an awful pass and we have not learnt from it. Sorry but I feel these guys are not worth their wages if they cannot get this right.
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Re: Basic passing of the ball..

Postby Robbiebluebird » Fri Oct 30, 2020 12:16 am

Our possession stats have been better because teams are more afraid of us on the break. If they let us have the ball we're toothless.
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Re: Basic passing of the ball..

Postby Crayfish » Fri Oct 30, 2020 10:46 am

Robbiebluebird wrote:Our possession stats have been better because teams are more afraid of us on the break. If they let us have the ball we're toothless.


My hope is when Tomlin and Wilson come back and with Ojo showing some very good form we will be much more effective in the final third and start winning a lot more marches. Hopefully this will happen soon.
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Re: Basic passing of the ball..

Postby fred keenor » Fri Oct 30, 2020 10:54 am

montyblue wrote:I agree on the passing
an even bigger problem is the backs get to the half way line and then either turn back or pass back drives me mad this recycle and retain the ball back and start again
what happened to taking on the opposition and perhaps try dribbling past a player
derby last night closed us down and we went backwards and have done under harris starting to defensive.



This exactly how i see it, so frustrating to watch and not enjoyable at all.

Does anyone try to beat a player these days.
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Re: Basic passing of the ball..

Postby pembroke allan » Fri Oct 30, 2020 1:26 pm

In 2nd half we had possession of over a minute without going more than 5yards forward it was simply sideways and backwards across the halfway line ! The other problem especially at home is teams are aware of our threat on break and are not bothering to attack just sitting deep and waiting for our mistakes? Not rocket science to other teams analysts we simply need s change of tact like playing wingers wide and centre forwards in centre not other way around. :o
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Re: Basic passing of the ball..

Postby bluesince62 » Fri Oct 30, 2020 2:42 pm

fred keenor wrote:
montyblue wrote:I agree on the passing
an even bigger problem is the backs get to the half way line and then either turn back or pass back drives me mad this recycle and retain the ball back and start again
what happened to taking on the opposition and perhaps try dribbling past a player
derby last night closed us down and we went backwards and have done under harris starting to defensive.



This exactly how i see it, so frustrating to watch and not enjoyable at all.

Does anyone try to beat a player these days.



As said above,this team struggled to pass under warnock,well unless it was one pass over the heads of everyone! Lets hope with players back,we at least have a few who can actually pass accurately.hand on hearts,who can say the football under warnock was a joy?? We have added a few who I hope can help us in this department.
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Re: Basic passing of the ball..

Postby skidemin » Fri Oct 30, 2020 3:28 pm

bluesince62 wrote:
fred keenor wrote:
montyblue wrote:I agree on the passing
an even bigger problem is the backs get to the half way line and then either turn back or pass back drives me mad this recycle and retain the ball back and start again
what happened to taking on the opposition and perhaps try dribbling past a player
derby last night closed us down and we went backwards and have done under harris starting to defensive.



This exactly how i see it, so frustrating to watch and not enjoyable at all.

Does anyone try to beat a player these days.



As said above,this team struggled to pass under warnock,well unless it was one pass over the heads of everyone! Lets hope with players back,we at least have a few who can actually pass accurately.hand on hearts,who can say the football under warnock was a joy?? We have added a few who I hope can help us in this department.



struggled to pass ? a pointless possession based short passing game in our own half was never the intention..
and yes i enjoyed it... and i certainly do not like this pretend playing the right way where the object for the first 70 minutes seems to be how many passes can we achieve 50 yards from goal before either we give them a goal or we hit seat number 74 row A in the Ninian stand..... then bring the game changers { cavalry } on because he loves stats.... heres a stat.. 90% of all goals scored in football are scored from 2 passes or less... so its a damn good idea to maybe be in the opposition half.. and here is another .the periods in games we dominate possession and rack up the passes stat is also when we concede... and the period when his game changers are on , our football is more direct but our possession and passes stats drop is also when we are more likely to score....if all i cared about was possession and numbers of consecutive passes id go home after the best bit....the warm up where there are no spoil sports trying to tackle them..
ive seen us play well this season for 15 - 20 minute periods and seen us play really well a few times under him last season but overall this year so far has been crap...
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Re: Basic passing of the ball..

Postby rumpo kid » Fri Oct 30, 2020 3:42 pm

It’s a two way street.. if you know Ralls and Pack won’t find you, you stop making the run. Barry Bannon always looks for that killer pass, and his team mates know it. Tomlin is the same..
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Re: Basic passing of the ball..

Postby bluesince62 » Fri Oct 30, 2020 5:01 pm

skidemin wrote:
Crayfish wrote:I agree but would point out that our passing was pretty awful when Neil Warncok was our manager and we managed to finish second in the table and got promoted despite boing constantly out passed by many other teams. Still find it hard to believe we got promoted that season with such poor passing.



spot on mate they havent turned into a team of Iniestas over night.....it was recognise what you have and play to strengths.. way too much stupid square ponderous passing and at the moment and weve all seen how ineffective it is unless your a top top team...



I think the main problem is we have players who were not encouraged to pass,still in the side,it looks foreign to some!
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Re: Basic passing of the ball..

Postby skidemin » Fri Oct 30, 2020 5:20 pm

bluesince62 wrote:
skidemin wrote:
Crayfish wrote:I agree but would point out that our passing was pretty awful when Neil Warncok was our manager and we managed to finish second in the table and got promoted despite boing constantly out passed by many other teams. Still find it hard to believe we got promoted that season with such poor passing.



spot on mate they havent turned into a team of Iniestas over night.....it was recognise what you have and play to strengths.. way too much stupid square ponderous passing and at the moment and weve all seen how ineffective it is unless your a top top team...



I think the main problem is we have players who were not encouraged to pass,still in the side,it looks foreign to some!



it shouldnt be foreign to our manager though... you pick a team / game plan / tactics / formation around what you have available.. not sure how encouraged to pass works., your either a good passer of the ball or not. many of our players were brought here for other attributes to playing a possession based game. encouraging them to knock it about isnt going to make them significantly better at it as we are seeing....
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Re: Basic passing of the ball..

Postby bluesince62 » Fri Oct 30, 2020 5:32 pm

Not arguing mate,just pointing out that passing,the most intrinsic basic skill required,should not be foreign,to ANY player earning a crust from a game where passing is the name of the game??
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Re: Basic passing of the ball..

Postby skidemin » Fri Oct 30, 2020 5:48 pm

bluesince62 wrote:Not arguing mate,just pointing out that passing,the most intrinsic basic skill required,should not be foreign,to ANY player earning a crust from a game where passing is the name of the game??




there is passing and passing though... the more comfortable you are receiving and distributing is on a sliding scale... the best at it cost the most and play for the better clubs. and the clubs that are amazingly good at it win things... thats not to say its foreign to our players its just that they are further down the scale ...
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Re: Basic passing of the ball..

Postby bluesince62 » Fri Oct 30, 2020 6:41 pm

skidemin wrote:
bluesince62 wrote:Not arguing mate,just pointing out that passing,the most intrinsic basic skill required,should not be foreign,to ANY player earning a crust from a game where passing is the name of the game??




there is passing and passing though... the more comfortable you are receiving and distributing is on a sliding scale... the best at it cost the most and play for the better clubs. and the clubs that are amazingly good at it win things... thats not to say its foreign to our players its just that they are further down the scale ...



Fair play,but we are one level below the top,so players really should be comfortable on the ball,yes some more so than others,but until we had new additions,only tomlin could pick a pass,so to speak(or st least a dangerous pass!).
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Re: Basic passing of the ball..

Postby bluesince62 » Fri Oct 30, 2020 8:44 pm

skidemin wrote:
bluesince62 wrote:
fred keenor wrote:
montyblue wrote:I agree on the passing
an even bigger problem is the backs get to the half way line and then either turn back or pass back drives me mad this recycle and retain the ball back and start again
what happened to taking on the opposition and perhaps try dribbling past a player
derby last night closed us down and we went backwards and have done under harris starting to defensive.



This exactly how i see it, so frustrating to watch and not enjoyable at all.

Does anyone try to beat a player these days.



As said above,this team struggled to pass under warnock,well unless it was one pass over the heads of everyone! Lets hope with players back,we at least have a few who can actually pass accurately.hand on hearts,who can say the football under warnock was a joy?? We have added a few who I hope can help us in this department.



struggled to pass ? a pointless possession based short passing game in our own half was never the intention..
and yes i enjoyed it... and i certainly do not like this pretend playing the right way where the object for the first 70 minutes seems to be how many passes can we achieve 50 yards from goal before either we give them a goal or we hit seat number 74 row A in the Ninian stand..... then bring the game changers { cavalry } on because he loves stats.... heres a stat.. 90% of all goals scored in football are scored from 2 passes or less... so its a damn good idea to maybe be in the opposition half.. and here is another .the periods in games we dominate possession and rack up the passes stat is also when we concede... and the period when his game changers are on , our football is more direct but our possession and passes stats drop is also when we are more likely to score....if all i cared about was possession and numbers of consecutive passes id go home after the best bit....the warm up where there are no spoil sports trying to tackle them..
ive seen us play well this season for 15 - 20 minute periods and seen us play really well a few times under him last season but overall this year so far has been crap...


90% from 2 passes?? Yeah usually in or around the box!!
Why are you telling me about stats exactly? The football under warnock was crap too!we are unbeaten in 5,the only way is up!! Glass half full me,we will get better imho.
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Re: Basic passing of the ball..

Postby moonboots » Fri Oct 30, 2020 8:51 pm

The OP is correct. Our passing has been very poor for a few seasons. Sometimes I'm shocked that we can't even find someone with a good pass who is only 5 yards away. It goes just in front or behind the intended recipient and the move breaks down. Also, it annoys me when a good forward pass is on but they go safe with a sideways or backwards pass. I think lately we've been trying to pass the ball more but the players we have are not the best at it unfortunately. Although, it was a lovely threaded pass by Ojo to find Moore against Derby....great finish too. Those little incisive passes in and around the opponents' box can be killer.
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Re: Basic passing of the ball..

Postby skidemin » Fri Oct 30, 2020 9:03 pm

bluesince62 wrote:
skidemin wrote:
bluesince62 wrote:
fred keenor wrote:
montyblue wrote:I agree on the passing
an even bigger problem is the backs get to the half way line and then either turn back or pass back drives me mad this recycle and retain the ball back and start again
what happened to taking on the opposition and perhaps try dribbling past a player
derby last night closed us down and we went backwards and have done under harris starting to defensive.



This exactly how i see it, so frustrating to watch and not enjoyable at all.

Does anyone try to beat a player these days.



As said above,this team struggled to pass under warnock,well unless it was one pass over the heads of everyone! Lets hope with players back,we at least have a few who can actually pass accurately.hand on hearts,who can say the football under warnock was a joy?? We have added a few who I hope can help us in this department.



struggled to pass ? a pointless possession based short passing game in our own half was never the intention..
and yes i enjoyed it... and i certainly do not like this pretend playing the right way where the object for the first 70 minutes seems to be how many passes can we achieve 50 yards from goal before either we give them a goal or we hit seat number 74 row A in the Ninian stand..... then bring the game changers { cavalry } on because he loves stats.... heres a stat.. 90% of all goals scored in football are scored from 2 passes or less... so its a damn good idea to maybe be in the opposition half.. and here is another .the periods in games we dominate possession and rack up the passes stat is also when we concede... and the period when his game changers are on , our football is more direct but our possession and passes stats drop is also when we are more likely to score....if all i cared about was possession and numbers of consecutive passes id go home after the best bit....the warm up where there are no spoil sports trying to tackle them..
ive seen us play well this season for 15 - 20 minute periods and seen us play really well a few times under him last season but overall this year so far has been crap...


90% from 2 passes?? Yeah usually in or around the box!!
Why are you telling me about stats exactly? The football under warnock was crap too!we are unbeaten in 5,the only way is up!! Glass half full me,we will get better imho.



yes its 2 passes or less... and you asked about enjoying football hand on heart which i answered...
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Re: Basic passing of the ball..

Postby llan bluebird » Fri Oct 30, 2020 9:54 pm

We had the greatest passer the championship had for a decade who was continually vilified for not getting stuck in !!!!


Ralls can pass, he is not in the top quantile for medium length passing but he is strong, tackle and run all day also has an eye for goal
Vaulks can also pass, his judgement can be suspect at least three times a game, but he is big strong, huge engine and can tackle
Bacuna can pass, he is quick, stong ,aggressive great engine and can tackle
Pack can pass, poor long range great at holding onto the ball, big, strong can tackle

Passing is one attribute. They are all 6/10 at nearly everything, if they were better they's be playing at a higher level than Cardiff City

I watched the Citeh Arsenal game and it probably was one of the most boring games i have witnessed, its not my football. Passing is very much envogue at the moment, so passing midfielders and defender are very much at a premium. I love the whole moneyball concept. Touches in the box and shots on goal are the second to goals stats I care about, getting the ball there however you do it is my metric, not meaningless passes in you own third.
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Re: Basic passing of the ball..

Postby Escott1927 » Fri Oct 30, 2020 10:10 pm

bluesince62 wrote:
fred keenor wrote:
montyblue wrote:I agree on the passing
an even bigger problem is the backs get to the half way line and then either turn back or pass back drives me mad this recycle and retain the ball back and start again
what happened to taking on the opposition and perhaps try dribbling past a player
derby last night closed us down and we went backwards and have done under harris starting to defensive.



This exactly how i see it, so frustrating to watch and not enjoyable at all.

Does anyone try to beat a player these days.



As said above,this team struggled to pass under warnock,well unless it was one pass over the heads of everyone! Lets hope with players back,we at least have a few who can actually pass accurately.hand on hearts,who can say the football under warnock was a joy?? We have added a few who I hope can help us in this department.


The football under warnock last season was awful. Awful to watch and the results weren't much better. Even by warnocks standards we played super long ball tactics. Now we are at the other end of the spectrum, trying to play a possession based game with a squad not built to do it, especially with the injuries we've got.

But we are in a period of transition. If we want to move away from hoofball, then we need to stop playing it. Pressure is building on Harris but I think things will get better. We've been unlucky with injuries. 3 fullbacks out at the same time plus Tomlin and wilson. Bagan has done well but Tutu, Tomlin and wilson would massively improve the starting 11. We havnt seen Tomlin and Harris play together and we still havnt seen Benkovic play yet.
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Re: Basic passing of the ball..

Postby GENERAL CHAT » Sat Oct 31, 2020 4:18 pm

Watching the game now. First ten mins is just hopeful kicking.

We really do need to practice passing...
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Baldrick: No, but I've often thought that I'd like to.
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Re: Basic passing of the ball..

Postby Isawgarystevensscoreagoal » Sun Nov 01, 2020 7:43 am

All these players we say can't pass were signed by Warnock to watch the ball fly over their heads, chase it down to win second balls, line up in the right place for our long throws and set pieces and manfully defend our goal thirty yards out.

We bemoaned the style but we need more players who can play to play the style.

If Warnocks Boro, who have been shite for seasons, are above us in the table we will be questioning what we've wished for.

I completely agree that our passing let's us down and is not good enough. But it's a hang over from Warnocks recruitment.
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