“ The football under McCarthy “

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“ The football under McCarthy “

Postby The Lone Gunman » Sun May 09, 2021 8:11 am

There's no doubt that City's results improved significantly in the 22 games after Mick McCarthy took control in January. His impressive record from the first eleven matches he was in charge reads as follows:

Won 7, Drew 4, Lost 0, Scored 23, Conceded 7, Points 25

Things levelled out considerably after that incredible start and the record in McCarthy's last 11 games was as follows:

Won 3, Drew 5, Lost 3, Scored 13, Conceded 14, Points 14

But what about the football itself? Was it more entertaining and better to watch under McCarthy than it had been under Harris, as some contributors have suggested? Was the style pretty much the same? Or was the football even more basic? Obviously, the answers to those questions are entirely subjective, but personally I don't believe the style of City's play became any more attractive under McCarthy. If anything, I thought it became even more attritional than it was under Harris.

Of course, Big Mick was only working with the hand he'd been dealt. Next season will be the real test as regards how his team plays. Nevertheless, I thought I'd take a look at the stats from the match reports on the BBC football site from 2020/21 and see if they provide any clues about what we can expect in 2021/22 from Mick McCarthy's Cardiff City.

In the first 24 Championship games while Neil Harris was manager, City averaged a shade under 48% possession. The side averaged 11.7 shots per game, of which an average of 4 were on target.

In the 22 Championship games overseen by Mick McCarthy, City averaged a fraction over 41% possession. The team averaged 11.3 shots per game, of which an average of 4.5 were on target.

In 24 games under Harris, City's possession stats were 50% or higher on 13 occasions. In McCarthy's 22 games, the figure was just 5.

Under Harris, City's possession stats were 35% or less on 3 occasions in 24 games. Under McCarthy, that figure was 8 in 22 games.

So, City tended to have significantly more of the ball under Harris than they did under McCarthy and the tallies for both shots at goal and shots on target were broadly similar. The team converted marginally more chances under McCarthy (an average of 1.6 goals per game compared to 1.2 goals per game under Harris), but the biggest difference was in the defensive figures - an average of 1.5 goals conceded per game under Harris, but just 0.9 goals per game conceded under McCarthy.

These stats can be interpreted in a number of ways, but my view (based not only on the stats but what I've witnessed while watching the team on TV this season) is this: I don't think the football became any better to watch after Harris was sacked and on occasions it was a good deal worse. However, as a rule, the side was much better organised under McCarthy and the defending was consistently better.

Transfer windows are always interesting to a degree, but this year's will be even more so as Big Mick shuffles his pack. I like McCarthy as an individual and I'm hopeful he'll bring in a few players who will make his team better to watch, but based on the evidence so far, those hopes aren't particularly high.
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“ The football under McCarthy “

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Re: The football under McCarthy

Postby Bakedalasker » Sun May 09, 2021 8:42 am

Can't really argue against any of that.

We were looking at relegation before MM came in. Going on that article above the answer to avoid relegation was a tightening of the defence. To me it seems our defence is ok to go with next season but what about the midfield and attack? For me its a re-haul of the midfield and some backup for the attack. Then we might see some entertainment
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Re: The football under McCarthy

Postby EL JEFE » Sun May 09, 2021 9:58 am

Some good work gone into that, well done.
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Re: The football under McCarthy

Postby piledriver64 » Sun May 09, 2021 10:21 am

I would say I’ve enjoyed the football more under McCarthy, I think there is more emphasis on a high press and letting the front three be flexible.

I also like the way he makes changes during a game and players seem to have been drilled on that system too.

It’s now down to comings and going’s in the summer.

McCarthy deserves a chance and a bit of patience so let’s see where he can take us.
What we do know is the even with the drop off after the international break that was promotion level results.
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Re: The football under McCarthy

Postby castleblue » Sun May 09, 2021 10:33 am

As you say the biggest improvement under MM was the goals conceded and that had a massive effect on the points haul under MM compared to NH. If things had continued as they were under NH the average points won over his 24 games would have seen around 55 points total for the season, around 16th / 17th place. Under MM the average points won over his 22 games would have seen 81 points over 46 games, or 4th place.

Obviously it's not as simple as that but without doubt MM made Cardiff City as difficult team to beat, under Harris Cardiff City looked like a team very easy to beat.

For me I hope he gets cover for Moore, creativity in midfield and wingers with pace and then we just may have a decent season
with real hope of a playoff place.


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Re: The football under McCarthy

Postby skidemin » Sun May 09, 2021 12:28 pm

the important stats are league position.... we went from 15th to 8th..and would have finished in the play offs based on games played since MMs appointment...
points 29 under harris.... 39 under MM in 4 less games
goals.. we scored more { i think during MMs time in charge 3rd highest scorers } conceded less.... all this while not having a transfer window.. and not just having a thin squad but injuries to a point where the inexperienced replacements were getting injured..

as for the extra poss..i remember it well. messing about in our defensive third with no inclination of how to turn it into attack until invariably someone would give cheap possession away we would concede and then go more direct chasing the game... it was almost a weekly occurrence.. the football changed under MM as availability / personnel did.. its not lego where a blue block breaks and you pick an identical one from the block academy with zero effect....
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Re: The football under McCarthy

Postby maccydee » Sun May 09, 2021 12:52 pm

When we beat Derby 4 nil (and other games) there was some really good football being played.

People were even liking Pack for a short while.
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Re: The football under McCarthy

Postby Escott1927 » Sun May 09, 2021 1:25 pm

We are much more organised at the back and press with more energy. But the football is terrible, still. We struggle to string a few passes together before going long - a lot of the time just hit in the hope it goes somewhere near Moore. As soon as results drop people will be on micks back because even when we win the football is still pretty painful to watch.
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Re: The football under McCarthy

Postby Crayfish » Sun May 09, 2021 2:10 pm

Always thought MM was an effective manager who will achieve what you would expect him to achieve in the circumstances given. He got both Wolves and Sunderland promoted but was given money to spend by both clubs and you would expect a competent manager to get them up and he did. A less effective manager may not have got them up. I think he kept Wolves up for one season and Sunderland were relegated the season after he got them up so he was not good enough to keep those clubs up under difficult circumstances. Probably most managers wouldn't.

Yes he has been effective for us this season but my slight worry is it all came in his first nine games and was possibly due to new manager effect and a ferocious work rate in closing down other teams which was impossible to keep up over a long time.

My guess is he will be a good manager for us who would get us in the playoffs if he was given money to spend but he won't be given any and will manage up to a sort of mid table finish like he did with Ipswich. He might surprise us and be very clever in the transfer market like Warock was in his early days. Rather expecting the football to be a bit dull but I personally don't mind dull if we are winning. Never minded Warnocks route one stuff when we were winning.
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Re: The football under McCarthy

Postby llan bluebird » Sun May 09, 2021 2:51 pm

I always thought of MM as a defensive, pragmatic motivator and was surprised how we played when he turned up.

The 3 at the back with championship stalwart Flint with possibly one of the best championship CD's in Morrison and the mobility of Nelson allowed the wingbacks to be midfielders. so effectively we played 3421 and in most matches were on the front foot.

The injuries to Bennett,Bagan and NG killed the momentum, then you add Morrisons end of season :(

Flint,Brown and Nelson is not a back 3 to build on, i can't imagine another trio so poor at basic passing.The experiment to play Pack there was a good move but he is so slooooow it's a non starter.

NG is never a full on wingback in the modern sense he is a full back with enough technical ability to play like a right midfielder, so it worked. Playing Brown on the left wingback is a crime against football. The lad is a centre half and i don't know if that is at championship level.

I know its en vogue to have a go at the midfield, yes they are samey, but if the two starting CM's are Ralls and Vaulks i think thats a solid foundation. The spark is meant to come from the 2 AM's

Without this going into an essay, we were on the right track before the injuries. Its up to MM and the transfer team to move out the dead wood and bring in decent replacements. I believe they will and I am positive.
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Re: The football under McCarthy

Postby derynglas » Sun May 09, 2021 3:42 pm

llan bluebird wrote:we were on the right track before the injuries. Its up to MM and the transfer team to move out the dead wood and bring in decent replacements. I believe they will and I am positive.


Spot on. There wouldn’t be too many squads who could still excel themselves when you lose as many players as we did, think it was then a case of putting square pegs in round holes.

May have to resort to wheeling and dealing over the summer, hopefully MM can unearth a few gems.
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Re: The football under McCarthy

Postby skidemin » Sun May 09, 2021 3:46 pm

llan bluebird wrote:I always thought of MM as a defensive, pragmatic motivator and was surprised how we played when he turned up.

The 3 at the back with championship stalwart Flint with possibly one of the best championship CD's in Morrison and the mobility of Nelson allowed the wingbacks to be midfielders. so effectively we played 3421 and in most matches were on the front foot.

The injuries to Bennett,Bagan and NG killed the momentum, then you add Morrisons end of season :(

Flint,Brown and Nelson is not a back 3 to build on, i can't imagine another trio so poor at basic passing.The experiment to play Pack there was a good move but he is so slooooow it's a non starter.

NG is never a full on wingback in the modern sense he is a full back with enough technical ability to play like a right midfielder, so it worked. Playing Brown on the left wingback is a crime against football. The lad is a centre half and i don't know if that is at championship level.

I know its en vogue to have a go at the midfield, yes they are samey, but if the two starting CM's are Ralls and Vaulks i think thats a solid foundation. The spark is meant to come from the 2 AM's

Without this going into an essay, we were on the right track before the injuries. Its up to MM and the transfer team to move out the dead wood and bring in decent replacements. I believe they will and I am positive.




mostly agree... bit surprised how few have picked up in the change or even saw a change when we started picking up injuries ... and tbh not nearly as impressed as some with the players coming in... they have tried hard and been just about ok as stop gaps ... having said that Brown is not a wingback or is Sang....so not really fair
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Re: The football under McCarthy

Postby wez1927 » Sun May 09, 2021 8:18 pm

llan bluebird wrote:I always thought of MM as a defensive, pragmatic motivator and was surprised how we played when he turned up.

The 3 at the back with championship stalwart Flint with possibly one of the best championship CD's in Morrison and the mobility of Nelson allowed the wingbacks to be midfielders. so effectively we played 3421 and in most matches were on the front foot.

The injuries to Bennett,Bagan and NG killed the momentum, then you add Morrisons end of season :(

Flint,Brown and Nelson is not a back 3 to build on, i can't imagine another trio so poor at basic passing.The experiment to play Pack there was a good move but he is so slooooow it's a non starter.

NG is never a full on wingback in the modern sense he is a full back with enough technical ability to play like a right midfielder, so it worked. Playing Brown on the left wingback is a crime against football. The lad is a centre half and i don't know if that is at championship level.

I know its en vogue to have a go at the midfield, yes they are samey, but if the two starting CM's are Ralls and Vaulks i think thats a solid foundation. The spark is meant to come from the 2 AM's

Without this going into an essay, we were on the right track before the injuries. Its up to MM and the transfer team to move out the dead wood and bring in decent replacements. I believe they will and I am positive.

Agree going to be an interesting summer
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Re: The football under McCarthy

Postby maccydee » Sun May 09, 2021 9:03 pm

Does anyone care about the football as long as we are winning.

Malky was dogshit football.

Warnock for a lot of it was dogshit football although we had the occasional spurt of good stuff.

Dave Jones had us playing lovely football. Didn’t get us up.
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Re: The football under McCarthy

Postby wez1927 » Sun May 09, 2021 9:10 pm

maccydee wrote:Does anyone care about the football as long as we are winning.

Malky was dogshit football.

Warnock for a lot of it was dogshit football although we had the occasional spurt of good stuff.

Dave Jones had us playing lovely football. Didn’t get us up.

Agree its about winning ,think mick plays the football slightly different against different teams and also players available
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Re: “ The football under McCarthy “

Postby mjw6150 » Mon May 10, 2021 11:27 am

High possession doesn't always mean exciting football. A few teams have played a passing game against us and bored me to death. I'd rather a hybrid style of pragmatic football and attractive football when situation requires which I think is what we have with McCarthy.
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Re: The football under McCarthy

Postby Escott1927 » Mon May 10, 2021 11:40 am

maccydee wrote:Does anyone care about the football as long as we are winning.

Malky was dogshit football.

Warnock for a lot of it was dogshit football although we had the occasional spurt of good stuff.

Dave Jones had us playing lovely football. Didn’t get us up.


That's the problem though. The football is only tolerable when you are winning. Take the wins away and people lose patience very quickly. Warnock is a prime example. Performed a miracle to get us promoted, reunited a fractured fan base and had a good go at the prem on limited funds. After relegation, the performances were very poor and we weren't winning. He was gone pretty quickly as a result. Jones didn't deliver (although he did give us successive highest league finishes in like 40 years) but he was here longer than any of the managers that came after him.

There were plenty of times under warnock and even mick this year, where I have thought we are awful to watch, continuously aimlessly lumping it long, but still came away with a win. The performance is quickly forgotten, unless you lose. Id imagine mick will be in the same position next year as I dont expect a drastic change in our style of play.
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Re: The football under McCarthy

Postby skidemin » Mon May 10, 2021 1:27 pm

maccydee wrote:Does anyone care about the football as long as we are winning.

Malky was dogshit football.

Warnock for a lot of it was dogshit football although we had the occasional spurt of good stuff.

Dave Jones had us playing lovely football. Didn’t get us up.



hmmm.. moaners will moan....
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Re: The football under McCarthy

Postby maccydee » Mon May 10, 2021 2:38 pm

skidemin wrote:
maccydee wrote:Does anyone care about the football as long as we are winning.

Malky was dogshit football.

Warnock for a lot of it was dogshit football although we had the occasional spurt of good stuff.

Dave Jones had us playing lovely football. Didn’t get us up.



hmmm.. moaners will moan....


Ficklies will be ficklie
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Re: The football under McCarthy

Postby skidemin » Tue May 11, 2021 11:35 am

maccydee wrote:
skidemin wrote:
maccydee wrote:Does anyone care about the football as long as we are winning.

Malky was dogshit football.

Warnock for a lot of it was dogshit football although we had the occasional spurt of good stuff.

Dave Jones had us playing lovely football. Didn’t get us up.



hmmm.. moaners will moan....


Ficklies will be ficklie



not sure about being fickle about it... some are unhappy full stop...
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Re: The football under McCarthy

Postby Bluebina » Wed May 12, 2021 7:44 am

llan bluebird wrote:I always thought of MM as a defensive, pragmatic motivator and was surprised how we played when he turned up.

The 3 at the back with championship stalwart Flint with possibly one of the best championship CD's in Morrison and the mobility of Nelson allowed the wingbacks to be midfielders. so effectively we played 3421 and in most matches were on the front foot.

The injuries to Bennett,Bagan and NG killed the momentum, then you add Morrisons end of season :(

Flint,Brown and Nelson is not a back 3 to build on, i can't imagine another trio so poor at basic passing.The experiment to play Pack there was a good move but he is so slooooow it's a non starter.

NG is never a full on wingback in the modern sense he is a full back with enough technical ability to play like a right midfielder, so it worked. Playing Brown on the left wingback is a crime against football. The lad is a centre half and i don't know if that is at championship level.

I know its en vogue to have a go at the midfield, yes they are samey, but if the two starting CM's are Ralls and Vaulks i think thats a solid foundation. The spark is meant to come from the 2 AM's

Without this going into an essay, we were on the right track before the injuries. Its up to MM and the transfer team to move out the dead wood and bring in decent replacements. I believe they will and I am positive.


Good post I agree, with NG Morrison Flint Nelson and Bennett we looked really good and to lose tree or four of them was always going to hurt us, we need better cover especially at wingback/fullback.
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