What has Kieffer Moore done wrong?

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What has Kieffer Moore done wrong?

Postby Forever Blue » Mon Jun 07, 2021 6:02 am

Boss Rob Page not a fan of Kieffer Moore?


The massive Euros mistake Wales boss Rob Page is in danger of making over Cardiff City's Kieffer Moore

Wales' Euro 2020 opener with Switzerland is just days away - and the likely omission from the starting XI of Cardiff City goal ace Kieffer is baffling many



Just what is Kieffer Moore supposed to have done wrong for Wales?


Monday 7th June 2021


By Glen Williams




I pose the question because for many it is utterly baffling how the big centre-forward, who helped revive Wales' fortunes after Ryan Giggs discovered Welsh ancestry, finds himself out of the first-team picture as we head towards Saturday's Euro 2020 opener with Switzerland.

Wales are without doubt a better team when Moore is there as the number nine. The facts and figures prove it, the evidence of our own eyes shows it.

He could perfectly knit everything together at the Euros, the pivot up top linking play and around whom Gareth Bale, Dan James and Aaron Ramsey can sprinkle their stardust.

Yet worryingly Wales' stand-in boss Rob Page doesn't appear to see it that way and Moore seems destined for a bench role in the tournament.

Plenty of Welsh fans are mystified by this. So am I. Not only does Moore offer so much to the side with his presence, next to Bale he is also the most likely to score goals for Wales in the coming weeks.

He is also brimful of confidence following the best season of his career when he has bagged 23 goals for Cardiff City and Wales. This, by the way, in a Bluebirds side who were awful for large parts under Neil Harris, offered Moore scant support as a lone striker - yet still he was Cardiff's Player of the Year by a country mile.

Yet while Moore's stock has gone through the roof at club level, with Wales it appears to have fallen.

For context about what Moore brings to Wales, we have to rewind to the summer of 2019 when Wales lost back-to-back Euro qualifiers in Croatia and Hungary, Giggs having tried a mix of Harry Wilson, James, David Brooks and Tom Lawrence as his centre-forward.

The balance of the team was so patently wrong, this writer called for a change of approach from Giggs. Knowing little about Moore at the time, my suggestion was Bale as centre-forward with the others running off him - or even, at a push and only grudgingly, Sam Vokes.

Whatever, Wales simply had to play with a target man. Expecting any one of Wilson, James, Brooks or Lawrence to perform the role was not only unfair on them, it also negated their own undoubted strengths.



To be fair to Giggs, he unearthed the prefect nine in Moore. The big man was an instant revelation, a new idol for Welsh fans.

Suddenly Wales started to look a proper team as he linked the play, won the headers, held up the ball, occupied defenders, took the bruising hits. Moore energised the more technically gifted and quicker stars around him, creating space for them with his presence and know-how.

Results instantly took an upturn. Moore scored the winner on his debut against Belarus, and bagged other key goals as Wales went on a streak of five wins, three draws and only a defeat to England in the next nine games.

He was beginning to look as indispensable as anybody in the team.

He was then suspended for a 1-0 win in Bulgaria last October - which proved to be Giggs' last game in charge.





Enter Rob Page and exit stage left, in the games that matter at least, Kieffer Moore.

Page wasn't with Wales when Giggs' side lost those qualifiers in Croatia and Hungary, defeats which proved a change in formation was so evidently required.

But he did join the coaching set-up shortly afterwards and it's hard to believe Page and Giggs didn't discuss the Moore factor and what he brings to the team.

Even though Giggs wasn't officially involved, we're told his hand was still on the tiller in Page's first few games in charge, thus we can't just blame Moore's sudden omission from the side as the decision of the new manager.

But as time has drawn on, and Page has put his own stamp on the team which he has every right to do, it's become clear he prefers five at the back, Wilson as the false nine and no place for Moore.

Against Switzerland in Baku at the weekend, it's more likely to be Ramsey than Wilson - an even bigger mistake, in my view, as Wales' midfield playmaker needs to get on the ball facing goal and put in those probing passes that can release the likes of Bale, James and Moore.

Page has probably been emboldened with his new five at the back and no Kieffer approach after impressive competitive wins under his watch over Ireland, Finland and the Czech Republic.

That's fair enough, results are everything at international level.

But Moore came on early in those matches and straight away Wales looked better for his involvement in the team.








So why his omission from Page's starting XI?


Kieffer Moore has been in rich scoring form for Cardiff.




Clearly Page wants to bolster his defence and that means extra numbers. That's understandable to a degree, Wales lack the proven Premier League performers they had in Euro 2016 when Ashley Williams, Neil Taylor, Ben Davies, James Chester and Wayne Hennessey were getting plenty of top-flight football.

Maybe he is concerned Moore's abrasive style of play runs the risk of incurring the wrath of continental referees at the Euros - although that's not really a reason not to pick him.

Perhaps he thinks Wales are more likely to score adopting the alternative system.

But for many, the more (no pun intended) you look at this, the more Kieffer being overlooked baffles.

As well as being the lynchpin around which Wales' forward play can flourish, Moore has goals to his name and is actually a very clever thinking and capable footballer with ball at feet. He offers way, way more than just being a so-called brute up top.

However, what's not to like about his aerial prowess too? The inclusion of Moore gives Wales extra set-piece expertise - offensively and defensively. Many is the time he was the one clearing the ball from corners for Cardiff City this season.

With Moore, Bale, Joe Rodon, Chris Mepham and Ben Davies in their ranks, Wales could pose a real threat at set-pieces in the Euros. Make no mistake, plenty of goals will come from corners and free-kicks in the tournament and Wales have to be ready for their share.

Wales have produced a lot of excellent performances during the Giggs era, but the most perfect of the lot came under intense pressure in the 2-0 win over Hungary which clinched qualification.









That night they played four at the back, two holding midfielders and Moore up top - Bale and James flying down the wing either side of the big man and Ramsey given a licence to thrill by joining them from the slightly deeper 10 role that suits him so perfectly.

Wales were utterly majestic and while two-goal Ramsey stole the show, Moore's presence helped link everything.

There is absolutely no reason why Wales cannot replicate that successful template against Switzerland, Turkey and Italy in Group A.

Their chances of Euro success will be more enhanced by doing it.

Pob lwc Cymru.
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What has Kieffer Moore done wrong?

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Re: What has Kieffer Moore done wrong?

Postby Winchmore Hill Bluebird » Mon Jun 07, 2021 6:42 am

For me who supports the City above Wales any day (although I still desperately want Wales to do well), I personally won’t be too bothered if Kieffer is used sparingly by Page - in fact I would not mind if he didn’t appear at all and rested to perform 100% for the City from August!
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Re: What has Kieffer Moore done wrong?

Postby theclaw » Mon Jun 07, 2021 7:26 am

Wales are not Man City and Page is not Pep.For god’s sake play to your advantage’s and Moore is a goal scoring advantage.
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Re: What has Kieffer Moore done wrong?

Postby Pulisnewport » Mon Jun 07, 2021 7:31 am

Appears he doesn’t like Will Vaulks either!

Page needs to enjoy the Euros because IMO together with Giggs he needs to be replaced to call time on Giggs era. This whole situation makes Welsh football look amateurish.

FAW need to advertise the position after the tournament it’s like waiting for an operation when you know what the result will be.

As far as Kieffer is concerned I hope he doesn’t play him to much but after the second half display when he came on I think he will play him from the start. If that first half selection was trying out a new format I’m worried already means he doesn’t know his best team this late in the day.
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Re: What has Kieffer Moore done wrong?

Postby AfricanBluebird » Mon Jun 07, 2021 8:08 am

Whether you play Moore up front on his own or even Bale - Wales NEED that kind of central player leading the line.

Time and time again Page tries to play without a striker and it ALWAYS fails - Since Page was thrust into the role I can't remember a single half of football where we have been at all convincing when we have not played a central number 9 type striker.

I am desperately worried that we are gonna get beaten in all three group games because Page doesn't seem to want to start with a No. 9.

Imagine getting to a third major international tournament and fecking it up because the manager is so stubborn or arrogant that he doesn't play a No. 9.

We are NOT good enough not to start with Moore (or Bale as a No. 9).

It's very worrying.
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Re: What has Kieffer Moore done wrong?

Postby Tony Blue Williams » Mon Jun 07, 2021 8:10 am

AfricanBluebird wrote:Whether you play Moore up front on his own or even Bale - Wales NEED that kind of central player leading the line.

Time and time again Page tries to play without a striker and it ALWAYS fails - Since Page was thrust into the role I can't remember a single half of football where we have been at all convincing when we have not played a central number 9 type striker.

I am desperately worried that we are gonna get beaten in all three group games because Page doesn't seem to want to start with a No. 9.

Imagine getting to a third major international tournament and fecking it up because the manager is so stubborn or arrogant that he doesn't play a No. 9.

We are NOT good enough not to start with Moore (or Bale as a No. 9).

It's very worrying.


:thumbright: :thumbright:
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Re: What has Kieffer Moore done wrong?

Postby Pantmawr Bluebird » Mon Jun 07, 2021 8:10 am

Putting Cardiff first I will selfishly be fine with him not playing tbh.

Won't get injured, gets a good rest and won't be in the shop window any more than he is now.

Gutting for him though if he does miss out
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Re: What has Kieffer Moore done wrong?

Postby AfricanBluebird » Mon Jun 07, 2021 8:10 am

theclaw wrote:Wales are not Man City and Page is not Pep.For god’s sake play to your advantage’s and Moore is a goal scoring advantage.


100%

:ayatollah:
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Re: What has Kieffer Moore done wrong?

Postby pembroke allan » Mon Jun 07, 2021 8:28 am

Would say page us probably using games to try out playing without him as it's a high probability he will get suspended due to his physicality so need another option like the fo called false no9?
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Re: What has Kieffer Moore done wrong?

Postby AfricanBluebird » Mon Jun 07, 2021 8:41 am

pembroke allan wrote:Would say page us probably using games to try out playing without him as it's a high probability he will get suspended due to his physicality so need another option like the fo called false no9?


Maybe Allan although Page has NEVER started with Moore up front and surely before now he should have had at least one game with Moore starting. We are hardly going into the Euros in good form.

Let's see.
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Re: What has Kieffer Moore done wrong?

Postby Daicwmbran » Mon Jun 07, 2021 10:12 am

Page seems unwilling to play a system to suit the players available.instead trying to get players to use a system that they are not technically able to play.
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Re: What has Kieffer Moore done wrong?

Postby Escott1927 » Mon Jun 07, 2021 10:25 am

We need to play to our strengths. We looked much better when Moore came on in the second half. If we are going to stand any chance of getting out of the group, Moore needs to be playing.
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Re: What has Kieffer Moore done wrong?

Postby Daicwmbran » Mon Jun 07, 2021 10:53 am

Page seems unwilling to play a system to suit the players available.instead trying to get players to use a system that they are not technically able to play.
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Re: What has Kieffer Moore done wrong?

Postby davids » Mon Jun 07, 2021 12:12 pm

Pantmawr Bluebird wrote:Putting Cardiff first I will selfishly be fine with him not playing tbh.

Won't get injured, gets a good rest and won't be in the shop window any more than he is now.

Gutting for him though if he does miss out


:thumbright: :thumbright: :thumbright:

Exactly this for me too.
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Re: What has Kieffer Moore done wrong?

Postby pembroke allan » Mon Jun 07, 2021 2:02 pm

AfricanBluebird wrote:
pembroke allan wrote:Would say page us probably using games to try out playing without him as it's a high probability he will get suspended due to his physicality so need another option like the fo called false no9?


Maybe Allan although Page has NEVER started with Moore up front and surely before now he should have had at least one game with Moore starting. We are hardly going into the Euros in good form.

Let's see.



Thats true but by same token playing way he as been past two games doesn't seem to have a pattern of play with or without moore... sounded like games were just for fitness rather than anything else as several players not played in ages plus never played what you'd
call 1st 11 .....
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Re: What has Kieffer Moore done wrong?

Postby Welshman in CA » Mon Jun 07, 2021 2:18 pm

davids wrote:
Pantmawr Bluebird wrote:Putting Cardiff first I will selfishly be fine with him not playing tbh.

Won't get injured, gets a good rest and won't be in the shop window any more than he is now.

Gutting for him though if he does miss out


:thumbright: :thumbright: :thumbright:

Exactly this for me too.


So as a group we seem to have gone from "great our first tournament in 58 years, hope we have a good showing & do well" to "hope he doesn't play our best team as someone is a Cardiff player" in 1 tournament.

Absolutely awful attitude, as with Cardiff some of you weren't around 20,30, 40 years ago when we were a basement nation that nobody wanted to play but would if nobody else was available to playing a warm up for a major tournament against the world champions.

I despair sometimes. :old: :old: :old:
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Re: What has Kieffer Moore done wrong?

Postby Pantmawr Bluebird » Mon Jun 07, 2021 2:24 pm

If I had to chose between Cardiff getting into the play offs and a chance at the Premier League

or

Wales doing well but ultimately not winning the Euros then there's only one choice I'm going to take I'm afraid
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Re: What has Kieffer Moore done wrong?

Postby davids » Mon Jun 07, 2021 2:35 pm

Welshman in CA wrote:
davids wrote:
Pantmawr Bluebird wrote:Putting Cardiff first I will selfishly be fine with him not playing tbh.

Won't get injured, gets a good rest and won't be in the shop window any more than he is now.

Gutting for him though if he does miss out


:thumbright: :thumbright: :thumbright:

Exactly this for me too.


So as a group we seem to have gone from "great our first tournament in 58 years, hope we have a good showing & do well" to "hope he doesn't play our best team as someone is a Cardiff player" in 1 tournament.

Absolutely awful attitude, as with Cardiff some of you weren't around 20,30, 40 years ago when we were a basement nation that nobody wanted to play but would if nobody else was available to playing a warm up for a major tournament against the world champions.

I despair sometimes. :old: :old: :old:


Sorry pal - respect your opinion but for me it's the interests of Cardiff City over those of Wales every single time.
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