Who is VAR there to help?

Watching yesterdays FA cup semi and the 3 “penalty” decisions not given to Forest, made me wonder who is VAR there to help?

Let’s look at the FA Cup semi first. Coventry’s 120th minute “winner” against Man United would have been a fairytale come true for Coventry but would it have been for the FA? Is Man City v Coventry a big enough final to sell around the world….. a Manchester derby certainly is.

So lets go back to that last minute goal where VAR called it offside. The on screen view shows the tip of Torp’s boot marginally offside. But how do they decide when to freeze the film? Take it back one frame and he’ll probably be onside and the ball will still look like it’s being kicked by the passer………….

Onto the Everton v Forest game and I think 2 of those decisions are wrong. The first incident is unclear how much or even if Young touches the Forest player but how can the 2nd incident not be hand ball when he moves his arm out to "hopefully" block the ball. And the 3rd incident, Young definitely catches the Forest player from behind, that would be a free kick anywhere else on the pitch.

Forest’s statement on social media after the game is totally justified, and if Stuart Attwell in charge of VAR is a Luton fan then the PGMOL need to be investigated. Again, Everton, who hold the record for the most amount of seasons playing in the top flight, playing in the Premier League next season is easier to sell around the world than Forest being there.

Since VAR was introduced, we’ve heard many relegation threatened clubs complaining about decisions going against them all season compared to very few from the top clubs fighting for the title.

Unfortunately football is now a business more than a sport with £millions made by the ones in control. I think VAR should be scrapped until it can be controlled by AI.

Watching yesterdays FA cup semi and the 3 “penalty” decisions not given to Forest, made me wonder who is VAR there to help?

Let’s look at the FA Cup semi first. Coventry’s 120th minute “winner” against Man United would have been a fairytale come true for Coventry but would it have been for the FA? Is Man City v Coventry a big enough final to sell around the world….. a Manchester derby certainly is.

So lets go back to that last minute goal where VAR called it offside. The on screen view shows the tip of Torp’s boot marginally offside. But how do they decide when to freeze the film? Take it back one frame and he’ll probably be onside and the ball will still look like it’s being kicked by the passer………….

Onto the Everton v Forest game and I think 2 of those decisions are wrong. The first incident is unclear how much or even if Young touches the Forest player but how can the 2nd incident not be hand ball when he moves his arm out to "hopefully" block the ball. And the 3rd incident, Young definitely catches the Forest player from behind, that would be a free kick anywhere else on the pitch.

Forest’s statement on social media after the game is totally justified, and if Stuart Attwell in charge of VAR is a Luton fan then the PGMOL need to be investigated. Again, Everton, who hold the record for the most amount of seasons playing in the top flight, playing in the Premier League next season is easier to sell around the world than Forest being there.

Since VAR was introduced, we’ve heard many relegation threatened clubs complaining about decisions going against them all season compared to very few from the top clubs fighting for the title.

Unfortunately football is now a business more than a sport with £millions made by the ones in control. I think VAR should be scrapped until it can be controlled by AI.

I made the point why didn't they show the picture with just the red line to see which toe was ahead because in picture cannot see so only their word for it was Coventry toe to my mind there was not enough clarity to call it offside? B 4 var attack got benefit of doubt now its the big club getting it.

I've got no problem with introducing tech

I've got no problem with human input alongside the tech (which is the current failure point)

What I have a problem with, is the rules are driving reasons to NOT give goals. If we're going to interrogate to this degree, then adjust it so that it's in favour of MORE GOALS!!!

I bet every other football fan on the planet (other than United fans) jumped out of their seat at that goal yesterday. Sickening to see it chalked off for some boot leather.

I've got no problem with introducing tech

I've got no problem with human input alongside the tech (which is the current failure point)

What I have a problem with, is the rules are driving reasons to NOT give goals. If we're going to interrogate to this degree, then adjust it so that it's in favour of MORE GOALS!!!

I bet every other football fan on the planet (other than United fans) jumped out of their seat at that goal yesterday. Sickening to see it chalked off for some boot leather.

If remember the word used was he standing in offside position ? That's gone out of window now it's what part of body is offside!! Simple solution is use players foot with clear air between them as marker as its only part of body attached to ground and easy to gauge against another foot rather than an arm pit or finger.......

Very interesting stance on this issue and good points raised. Money is certainly the main driving point here, would of been probably a fairly shit final for TV unless your a underdog fan and as you said Manu are a bigger club which in turn you'd think will draw a much bigger crowd worldwide

Let’s be fair, the late goal in extra time was offside.

In the PL, VAR would rule it out for offside. It’s a factual decision.

If they really didn’t want Coventry in the final, they would have overturned Rob Jones’ decision to give them a penalty at the end of normal time.


There were big mistakes made in the Everton v Forest game. I think one of them should have been given as a penalty (Young’s handball).

The other two were debatable so wouldn’t be right to overturn the decision by the on pitch referee.

But I have to say what Forest came out with after the game was completely unprofessional. To accuse the VAR of being a Luton fan is laughable. They should be charged by the FA for that.

Forest have lost their heads completely over VAR, to the point that they’ve employed Mark Clattenburg.


I have my issues with VAR. It was brought in to overturn the scandalous decisions like Chelsea’s goal against us. But at certain times they’ve used it to re-referee the game and it is also inconsistent.

But that’s down to the people operating it, there’s nothing wrong with the actual technology.

I do believe it will be in the Championship at some point.



But I have to say, there was only one decision yesterday that VAR got massively wrong - Young’s handball.

Let’s be fair, the late goal in extra time was offside.

In the PL, VAR would rule it out for offside. It’s a factual decision.

If they really didn’t want Coventry in the final, they would have overturned Rob Jones’ decision to give them a penalty at the end of normal time.


There were big mistakes made in the Everton v Forest game. I think one of them should have been given as a penalty (Young’s handball).

The other two were debatable so wouldn’t be right to overturn the decision by the on pitch referee.

But I have to say what Forest came out with after the game was completely unprofessional. To accuse the VAR of being a Luton fan is laughable. They should be charged by the FA for that.

Forest have lost their heads completely over VAR, to the point that they’ve employed Mark Clattenburg.


I have my issues with VAR. It was brought in to overturn the scandalous decisions like Chelsea’s goal against us. But at certain times they’ve used it to re-referee the game and it is also inconsistent.

But that’s down to the people operating it, there’s nothing wrong with the actual technology.

I do believe it will be in the Championship at some point.



But I have to say, there was only one decision yesterday that VAR got massively wrong - Young’s handball.

Ned it's a cop out to say that offside was factual when a toenail or size of boot dictates offside who's to say lines were drawn a fraction at wrong time which favoured defence oit was that close. ? As for forest pens 2nd tackle by young was deemed he played ball by ref but he clearly didn't so ref should have been directed to review decision because ref made wrong decision and that is what var is for to correct wrong decision.. watched Gallagher on ref watch
This is why forest narked by var for not referring original decision to monitor as per protocol
Ps Liverpool game the lines were actually on top of each other so no offside given ...a fraction either way and different decision

Let’s be fair, the late goal in extra time was offside.

In the PL, VAR would rule it out for offside. It’s a factual decision.

If they really didn’t want Coventry in the final, they would have overturned Rob Jones’ decision to give them a penalty at the end of normal time.


There were big mistakes made in the Everton v Forest game. I think one of them should have been given as a penalty (Young’s handball).

The other two were debatable so wouldn’t be right to overturn the decision by the on pitch referee.

But I have to say what Forest came out with after the game was completely unprofessional. To accuse the VAR of being a Luton fan is laughable. They should be charged by the FA for that.

Forest have lost their heads completely over VAR, to the point that they’ve employed Mark Clattenburg.


I have my issues with VAR. It was brought in to overturn the scandalous decisions like Chelsea’s goal against us. But at certain times they’ve used it to re-referee the game and it is also inconsistent.

But that’s down to the people operating it, there’s nothing wrong with the actual technology.

I do believe it will be in the Championship at some point.



But I have to say, there was only one decision yesterday that VAR got massively wrong - Young’s handball.

Ned it's a cop out to say that offside was factual when a toenail or size of boot dictates offside who's to say lines were drawn a fraction at wrong time which favoured defence oit was that close. ? As for forest pens 2nd tackle by young was deemed he played ball by ref but he clearly didn't so ref should have been directed to review decision because ref made wrong decision and that is what var is for to correct wrong decision.. watched Gallagher on ref watch
This is why forest narked by var for not referring original decision to monitor as per protocol

But the goal would have been disallowed in the PL/CL so nobody can say it was just because it was Coventry.

Forest have gone way over the top with the things they’ve said. I really do hope they get charged for their comments.

That tackle by Young was definitely a possible penalty but is it a massive error by the referee? I’m not sure.

The handball by Young was a huge error and should have been overturned.

Let’s be fair, the late goal in extra time was offside.

In the PL, VAR would rule it out for offside. It’s a factual decision.

If they really didn’t want Coventry in the final, they would have overturned Rob Jones’ decision to give them a penalty at the end of normal time.


There were big mistakes made in the Everton v Forest game. I think one of them should have been given as a penalty (Young’s handball).

The other two were debatable so wouldn’t be right to overturn the decision by the on pitch referee.

But I have to say what Forest came out with after the game was completely unprofessional. To accuse the VAR of being a Luton fan is laughable. They should be charged by the FA for that.

Forest have lost their heads completely over VAR, to the point that they’ve employed Mark Clattenburg.


I have my issues with VAR. It was brought in to overturn the scandalous decisions like Chelsea’s goal against us. But at certain times they’ve used it to re-referee the game and it is also inconsistent.

But that’s down to the people operating it, there’s nothing wrong with the actual technology.

I do believe it will be in the Championship at some point.



But I have to say, there was only one decision yesterday that VAR got massively wrong - Young’s handball.

Ned it's a cop out to say that offside was factual when a toenail or size of boot dictates offside who's to say lines were drawn a fraction at wrong time which favoured defence oit was that close. ? As for forest pens 2nd tackle by young was deemed he played ball by ref but he clearly didn't so ref should have been directed to review decision because ref made wrong decision and that is what var is for to correct wrong decision.. watched Gallagher on ref watch
This is why forest narked by var for not referring original decision to monitor as per protocol

But the goal would have been disallowed in the PL/CL so nobody can say it was just because it was Coventry.

Forest have gone way over the top with the things they’ve said. I really do hope they get charged for their comments.

That tackle by Young was definitely a possible penalty but is it a massive error by the referee? I’m not sure.

The handball by Young was a huge error and should have been overturned.

True about made no difference it was Coventry its how made the lines as it was so close in fact been pointed out the red line was put over utd shoe and not in front of it... young incident its a clear arror as he clearly signalled young touched the ball and replays showed he didn't something var must have seen if everyone else did? So protocol says var must intervene but they didn't so question by forest is why didn't atwell send ref to monitor? But forest will be sanctioned by premier league.

Let’s be fair, the late goal in extra time was offside.

In the PL, VAR would rule it out for offside. It’s a factual decision.

If they really didn’t want Coventry in the final, they would have overturned Rob Jones’ decision to give them a penalty at the end of normal time.


There were big mistakes made in the Everton v Forest game. I think one of them should have been given as a penalty (Young’s handball).

The other two were debatable so wouldn’t be right to overturn the decision by the on pitch referee.

But I have to say what Forest came out with after the game was completely unprofessional. To accuse the VAR of being a Luton fan is laughable. They should be charged by the FA for that.

Forest have lost their heads completely over VAR, to the point that they’ve employed Mark Clattenburg.


I have my issues with VAR. It was brought in to overturn the scandalous decisions like Chelsea’s goal against us. But at certain times they’ve used it to re-referee the game and it is also inconsistent.

But that’s down to the people operating it, there’s nothing wrong with the actual technology.

I do believe it will be in the Championship at some point.



But I have to say, there was only one decision yesterday that VAR got massively wrong - Young’s handball.

Ned it's a cop out to say that offside was factual when a toenail or size of boot dictates offside who's to say lines were drawn a fraction at wrong time which favoured defence oit was that close. ? As for forest pens 2nd tackle by young was deemed he played ball by ref but he clearly didn't so ref should have been directed to review decision because ref made wrong decision and that is what var is for to correct wrong decision.. watched Gallagher on ref watch
This is why forest narked by var for not referring original decision to monitor as per protocol
Ps Liverpool game the lines were actually on top of each other so no offside given ...a fraction either way and different decision

Exactly, it all depends when they stop the video and place the lines. A frame back and it could have been on side and the tv viewer still wouldn't be able tell if the ball had left the foot of the passer or not. I would imagine there are several frames where the ball looks like it's being kicked by the passer, but may only be one or two frames where the player is on or off side.

Let’s be fair, the late goal in extra time was offside.

In the PL, VAR would rule it out for offside. It’s a factual decision.

If they really didn’t want Coventry in the final, they would have overturned Rob Jones’ decision to give them a penalty at the end of normal time.


There were big mistakes made in the Everton v Forest game. I think one of them should have been given as a penalty (Young’s handball).

The other two were debatable so wouldn’t be right to overturn the decision by the on pitch referee.

But I have to say what Forest came out with after the game was completely unprofessional. To accuse the VAR of being a Luton fan is laughable. They should be charged by the FA for that.

Forest have lost their heads completely over VAR, to the point that they’ve employed Mark Clattenburg.


I have my issues with VAR. It was brought in to overturn the scandalous decisions like Chelsea’s goal against us. But at certain times they’ve used it to re-referee the game and it is also inconsistent.

But that’s down to the people operating it, there’s nothing wrong with the actual technology.

I do believe it will be in the Championship at some point.



But I have to say, there was only one decision yesterday that VAR got massively wrong - Young’s handball.

Ned it's a cop out to say that offside was factual when a toenail or size of boot dictates offside who's to say lines were drawn a fraction at wrong time which favoured defence oit was that close. ? As for forest pens 2nd tackle by young was deemed he played ball by ref but he clearly didn't so ref should have been directed to review decision because ref made wrong decision and that is what var is for to correct wrong decision.. watched Gallagher on ref watch
This is why forest narked by var for not referring original decision to monitor as per protocol
Ps Liverpool game the lines were actually on top of each other so no offside given ...a fraction either way and different decision

Exactly, it all depends when they stop the video and place the lines. A frame back and it could have been on side and the tv viewer still wouldn't be able tell if the ball had left the foot of the passer or not. I would imagine there are several frames where the ball looks like it's being kicked by the passer, but may only be one or two frames where the player is on or off side.

Got to question how did they manage to get both lines on top of each other as in the Liverpool game? Not in a million years can they be that accurate but somehow they did it?

The linesman, unless dead certain now won’t flag, they allow play to continue until it's confirmed via VAR. Marginal offsides are not flagged now, when they were previously some were wrong either ruling out a goal or allowing a goal incorrectly so I think the argument it wrecks the game is a case of only if it affects your teams illegitimate goal.

The penalties were shocking, 2/3 were all day long a penalty, the penalty Coventry got in added time was harsh at best, so how the Everton one wasn’t punished is beyond me. That match stinks of corruption

What I don't understand is "AI" is going to take over the world and all of us will be placed on the scrapheap with a decade but a pot-bellied middle-aged man running up the line trying to catch 20 year old whippets can assess offside in a fraction of a second but the "modern" tech allows you to put the kettle on and make a cuppa before they make a decision just seems plain crazy to me........

Who are they asking ?

hawkeye makes split-second decision in tennis for the last 20 years, but they just say in or out not ask for interpretations.

Seems like they want to control the decision to me.

Listening to Gary Neville’s comments he made yesterday about Forest’s statement yesterday.

I think he’s spot on:


“Poor decisions but clubs need to stop saying they’re going to explore all options.

What options have they got?

Sue? Ask for the game to be replayed?

They haven’t got any options. They can whinge for a bit but this is sporting competition, they don’t have any options.

Nottingham Forest will regret that statement.”

Listening to Gary Neville’s comments he made yesterday about Forest’s statement yesterday.

I think he’s spot on:


“Poor decisions but clubs need to stop saying they’re going to explore all options.

What options have they got?

Sue? Ask for the game to be replayed?

They haven’t got any options. They can whinge for a bit but this is sporting competition, they don’t have any options.

Nottingham Forest will regret that statement.”

Now forest want conversation made public between ref and var? All that's going to do is promote more controversy if what happened on pitch is repeated in public!! Not sure how they can explain why it wasn't referred to monitor given it was a mistake by ref and that's what var is for isn't it?
namely young touched the ball

What I don't understand is "AI" is going to take over the world and all of us will be placed on the scrapheap with a decade but a pot-bellied middle-aged man running up the line trying to catch 20 year old whippets can assess offside in a fraction of a second but the "modern" tech allows you to put the kettle on and make a cuppa before they make a decision just seems plain crazy to me........

Who are they asking ?

hawkeye makes split-second decision in tennis for the last 20 years, but they just say in or out not ask for interpretations.

Seems like they want to control the decision to me.

We are heading for split second, computerised, automatic VAR decisions on offside, technology isn't quite there yet. Once it's fully automatic, trustworthy and swift, it'll improve the match. I hate the idea of waiting to celebrate a VAR decision.

Forest now threatening to sue Gary Neville after he made a joke calling them a mafia because of their tweet.

Their owner is nearly as bad as Tan

Forest now threatening to sue Gary Neville after he made a joke calling them a mafia because of their tweet.

Their owner is nearly as bad as Tan

He is a bit mad that's for sure! Can't wait for audio of incident to come out
On Coventry goal the question being ssked now is why was line drawn on Coventry players toe and not utd toe ? To me it was dead heat just like in Liverpool game

Forest now threatening to sue Gary Neville after he made a joke calling them a mafia because of their tweet.

Their owner is nearly as bad as Tan

He is a bit mad that's for sure! Can't wait for audio of incident to come out
On Coventry goal the question being ssked now is why was line drawn on Coventry players toe and not utd toe ? To me it was dead heat just like in Liverpool game

The line made it less obvious to me, I thought he was offside watching it live & then the VAR made me realize it was nowhere near as cut & dried as I immediately thought it was.

I just think that VAR has had a largely negative impact on the game - so dry, clinical and drains the soul, emotion, elation and spontaneity from the key moments like goal scoring.

IMO and I think many others, that Coventry goal should have stood and they should be in the final - but have been robbed of that joy by the soulless AI world we now fund ourselves in where everything is over analysed painfully.

Their forward Haji had no advantage whatsoever from his toe being apparently 'offside'. What a stinking decision that was!

I just think that VAR has had a largely negative impact on the game - so dry, clinical and drains the soul, emotion, elation and spontaneity from the key moments like goal scoring.

IMO and I think many others, that Coventry goal should have stood and they should be in the final - but have been robbed of that joy by the soulless AI world we now fund ourselves in where everything is over analysed painfully.

Their forward Haji had no advantage whatsoever from his toe being apparently 'offside'. What a stinking decision that was!

I would ask if Man Utd had scored that goal by someone like Fernandes (who isn’t generally liked), would there be people complaining about the VAR decision so much?

I’m not sure.

I just think that VAR has had a largely negative impact on the game - so dry, clinical and drains the soul, emotion, elation and spontaneity from the key moments like goal scoring.

IMO and I think many others, that Coventry goal should have stood and they should be in the final - but have been robbed of that joy by the soulless AI world we now fund ourselves in where everything is over analysed painfully.

Their forward Haji had no advantage whatsoever from his toe being apparently 'offside'. What a stinking decision that was!

I would ask if Man Utd had scored that goal by someone like Fernandes (who isn’t generally liked), would there be people complaining about the VAR decision so much?

I’m not sure.

Definitely wouldn't complain about var if it was man u it would be unlucky Coventry!
Ned conspiracy pheory for you .... goal disallowed because if Coventry had won they would be closer to messing up efl playoff final date if got to final ... so efl didn't want a Coventry victory

I just think that VAR has had a largely negative impact on the game - so dry, clinical and drains the soul, emotion, elation and spontaneity from the key moments like goal scoring.

IMO and I think many others, that Coventry goal should have stood and they should be in the final - but have been robbed of that joy by the soulless AI world we now fund ourselves in where everything is over analysed painfully.

Their forward Haji had no advantage whatsoever from his toe being apparently 'offside'. What a stinking decision that was!

I would ask if Man Utd had scored that goal by someone like Fernandes (who isn’t generally liked), would there be people complaining about the VAR decision so much?

I’m not sure.

Definitely wouldn't complain about var if it was man u it would be unlucky Coventry!
Ned conspiracy pheory for you .... goal disallowed because if Coventry had won they would be closer to messing up efl playoff final date if got to final ... so efl didn't want a Coventry victory

Why not overturn the Coventry penalty then? That was debatable.

I just think that VAR has had a largely negative impact on the game - so dry, clinical and drains the soul, emotion, elation and spontaneity from the key moments like goal scoring.

IMO and I think many others, that Coventry goal should have stood and they should be in the final - but have been robbed of that joy by the soulless AI world we now fund ourselves in where everything is over analysed painfully.

Their forward Haji had no advantage whatsoever from his toe being apparently 'offside'. What a stinking decision that was!

I would ask if Man Utd had scored that goal by someone like Fernandes (who isn’t generally liked), would there be people complaining about the VAR decision so much?

I’m not sure.

Definitely wouldn't complain about var if it was man u it would be unlucky Coventry!
Ned conspiracy pheory for you .... goal disallowed because if Coventry had won they would be closer to messing up efl playoff final date if got to final ... so efl didn't want a Coventry victory

Why not overturn the Coventry penalty then? That was debatable.

Ned from what I've seen tonight and over weekend var is bottling decisions by not getting ref to review incidents Coventry pen could have been overturned on review as was questionable ... tonight a tackle got yellow should been reviewed for possible red but var said was ok when wasn't ok... musnt forget forest 2 debatable needed review but 3rd not one person as said it wasnt 100% a penalty ... and how can you get a toenail offside but manage to to get dead heat decision at Liverpool ( Blue Red lines on top each other? ) think prefer championship without var at least only hot match officials to barrate